Asking a band member for too much help.

[ChrisB2]

I'm 52. We weren't talking about setting up, we were talking about load in. Once it's all in, I start wiring the PA and everyone sets up they're own gear. If they get set up before I'm done, I'll give them something to do if they're standing around. It just seems to me that not helping someone move a cab or bring something into the venue is counter-productive and petty. Yes, I probably wind up doing most of the work, but I just got tired of "who does what" and just decided a "Git 'er done" attitude was the way to go.

Yep. I don't really get all the John Wayne attitudes like "I don't need help." Those same people probably also don't want to be bothered to help others. Geez. I look at a band as a team, like a sports team. We have to work together and be able to count on each other. At least that's how it is in my band. Maybe I've been taking the guys for granted...

Yeah I can just see an outfielder standing there like "dude that was your ball, I'm not moving in to cover, you get it."

 

[Floyd Eye]

Guitar player is a dick. I lug my guitarists cabs, he lugs mine, whatever. Who gives a crap, it all has to go in and come out. How we do it is the drummer, the guitarist and myself all lug in all the drum gear, then while the drummer is setting his stuff up the guitarist and I load in all the other stuff. We help each other set up the stacks, then while I am running PA cables the guitar player sets up our pedal boards, runs mics, etc.. For sure it is FAR more important to get a routine that gets you set up as quickly as possible, regardless of who it is that lifts what.

 

[afzoomie67]

You could be mean or nice. Or you could talk to him.

 

[guy n. cognito]

Yep. I don't really get all the John Wayne attitudes like "I don't need help." Those same people probably also don't want to be bothered to help others. Geez. I look at a band as a team, like a sports team. We have to work together and be able to count on each other. At least that's how it is in my band. Maybe I've been taking the guys for granted...

Yeah I can just see an outfielder standing there like "dude that was your ball, I'm not moving in to cover, you get it."

Of course, being part of a team mean pulling your own weight. While I would contend that the guitarist in the OP is being a jerk, I've also been on the other side of the coin, where one member insists on using gear entirely outsized for the gig, which puts time and space demands on the rest of the band.

So, while the OP clearly need to address the attitude of the guitarist, he should probably also evaluate his need for a 610 in a road case. If it's essential, then keep it. If not, find something smaller and lighter that will speed load in time.

 

[Mugre]

Couple 'a points:

We're talking about ONE cover. Not breaking down his pedal board, coiling the cables and carrying it to the car.

I had a medium regular 5 piece drum set with a similar number of cymbals. I looked after it by myself just fine. In fact it was faster to refuse help cuz' I had my system down. I couldn't however, easily lift the trunk with all the stands up into my truck. I NEVER had any problem, even in audition situations asking for or receiving that 10 seconds of help.

A road case is for traveling in trucks and planes. I would switch out to a padded, ballistic nylon cover for speaker I carried myself in my own car or light truck.

Mugre

 

[jaywa]

My guitarist with the oversize rig insists on road cases for all his gear except his guitars.

We don't tour per se, it all rides in our trailer.

Now granted it works insofar as all his gear stays in immaculate condition. But road cases do add significant bulk and weight to the equation.

 

[Munjibunga]

I'll play devil's advocate.............first, what kind of band is this that you need such a cumbersome cabinet? Just asking! I'm of the opinion that everyone is responsible for their own gear. I help unload and load the PA gear but I don't touch anyone's personal gear! I lug my own gear and have bought components that are very easily managed by myself. Personally, I would be annoyed if someone continually asked me to help with their gear. I suggest getting more manageable gear.

This is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.

Add another grain. The OP's the one who chose to build something too big for him to handle himself. Maybe the guitarist would help if the OP carried his gear in for him first.

 

[claytitan]

Add another grain. The OP's the one who chose to build something too big for him to handle himself. Maybe the guitarist would help if the OP carried his gear in for him first.

I agree. We are only getting one side of the story. I suspect there is more to it. I'm all for team but also for individualism. Some people look at team as a way to shuffle off work on to others. Bottom line help is great if offered. Don't expect it or need it. I don't know what kind of places you are playing. Most likely you should be able to bring in and setup you own gear. PA is a different story since it is band gear.

Some places we play supply PA. In that case I'm usually the quickest to pack up and load my stuff. Sometimes I help the other guys pack and load gear sometime not. I tend to help those who don't bring a bunch of crap they don't need. I tend not to help those that kick back for a couple beers or smokes. You can chill when the gear is loaded. Some guys want to chill while I load out then look at me when I'm ready to go like "where's the help man".

Got four choices that you have control of. Quit, talk about it and work on it openly, ignore it like it didn't happen, bring a rig that doesn't require someone to help you set it up.

 

[Stumbo]

Got four choices that you have control of.
1) Quit
2) Talk about it and work on it openly
3) Ignore it like it didn't happen
4) Bring a rig that doesn't require someone to help you set it up.

Good work! Summarized all the posts.

I think #2 is good. Talk to all the guys next time you meet and see if you can work it out. Maybe one of the other guys doesn't mind?

Still, what if two handles are installed in the middle and near the bottom of the wide side of the cab? Wouldn't that allow you to pick the case up and off by yourself?

Depending on how you transport the cab, how about instead of the case, possibly installing casters on the cab and using a thick cover might work in place of the road case?

IMO, no sense in having your efforts to maintain a perfect looking cab causing you this problem and quit a band over it.

Now, if you're getting other negative vibes in general, maybe the guitar player has an agenda? Like getting you to quit?

 

[Thrill-House]

Guitarist sounds like douche, tbh. While i have the general mindset that everyone should be able to take care of their own gear needs, including transporting or loading (except maybe the drummer, for obvious reasons), if a bandmate needs help with something, what the hell is wrong with helping out? Seems stupid....

I was in a metal band a few years ago, and we all had fairly decently sized rigs. I had an all tube combo amp that wieghed in at about 80lbs, other guitarist had a similarly hefty combo amp, drummer had a decent sized kit. Our bassist at the time was girl, and usually hooked up to the PA, but when the gig required an amp, we grabbed the other guitarists bass combo, which was also fairly heavy as well as being an awkward cube shape. Our bassists, being a girl in her early 20s, was built and had the strength of most average woman her age, which suffice to say, meant she simply couldnt help us load most of the heavy equipment, she simply did not have the strength needed. The only things she could really carry were my tiny pedalboard, 1 guitar at a time, and some of the smaller drum parts.

But we didnt hold it against her, we werent a bunch of sissies! .... we just made due, she helped out where she could, and no one ever held it against her.

Your guitarist needs to buck up.

 

[MooseLumps]

I like the rope idea.

OP, he was probably being a jerk, and it's likely not just the cover. Try asking. Also, if you need help, ask the drummer; he has more parts and pieces and bits than all the rest of you combined and would likely help in a heartbeat, especially if you helped him.

 

[lfmn16]

The guitarist is definitely a dick and it seems like there are more than a few people here that don't know what teamwork means. People can argue all they want but someone that won't take a few minutes to help a fellow band member is a dick; IMHO. What happened to common courtesy and just being a good guy????

 

[mcnach]

Yep. I don't really get all the John Wayne attitudes like "I don't need help." Those same people probably also don't want to be bothered to help others. Geez. I look at a band as a team, like a sports team. We have to work together and be able to count on each other. At least that's how it is in my band. Maybe I've been taking the guys for granted...

Yeah I can just see an outfielder standing there like "dude that was your ball, I'm not moving in to cover, you get it."

exactly

 

[klokker]

Every band I have ever been in has helped each other with whatever anyone needed help with. It's called camaraderie. It comes back to you. And so does being a dick.

Yup.

We're not the closest band in terms of being friends, but everyone helps everybody else out. No one helps me usually at a gig, but for me it's two loads to my little car and that's it. But even when I show up to rehearsal with my bass and VT deluxe (I never bring my amp to rehearsal) bandmates always ask it I need help.

They always say, "Drive safe" when I go home.

 

[Marginal Tom]

Here's a suggestion: Grab a chair, put it facing the front of the cab, lift the cover off, step down from the chair, put it back where it was. Problem solved, unless the road case is armored to withstand a nuclear explosion. If you're still having problems lifting the lid, spend more time at the gym.

 

[fractiouslowend]

The op's guitarist amazes me. It's always been my understanding that when a band is booked to play, unless there is roadies, it is the band's (ie, all the people in the band's) responsibility to get the band's gear on or off stage.
It's not your guitarist's rig or your drummer's kit. They both belong (in the context of the gig) to the band.

 

[Robdrone]

My guitard had this problem as well, he rolls a 4x12 to gigs with 5-7 people showing up...

I often see posts on here where people speak of routinely playing gigs for less than 20 people... How many people are in these bands? If you are a 4 or 5 piece band and you can't get 20 heads to come out and see you play, you need to get out of the woodshed and make some f-ing friends. Also if there are more bands on the bill, you seriously need to stop booking shows with bands that cant get more than 5-7 people to show up. I know the general wisdom is to play as many shows as possible, but you gotta look at your best interests as a band. Don't just book any hole in the wall with whatever band asks, be selective. Book around your home town where your friends and family are more likely to stop out. I know when you're first starting out it's hard to get new fans, but come on. Sorry for the thread jack. I just don't get it.

More to the point... I'd rather have too much amp and not need it. Then need it and not have it. You can play a big amp at lower volume... Of course I'm not in a coffee shop kind of band either. Does it suck to carry my 8x10? Yes. I'm actually looking for something in a 4x10 for bar shows, but I aint getting rid of my fridge either. At least not yet. Eventually I may look into a fearful... From what I've heard they seem pretty cool.

 

[xgator4u]

Here's a suggestion: Grab a chair, put it facing the front of the cab, lift the cover off, step down from the chair, put it back where it was. Problem solved, unless the road case is armored to withstand a nuclear explosion. If you're still having problems lifting the lid, spend more time at the gym.

This raises a few questions in my mind.
1. Just how tall is this 6x10 IN the case ?
2. Just how wide is this 6x10 in the case ?

3. Just how tall is the O.P. ?
4. How wide is the O.P.'s "wing span" ?

I ask these questions because I have an 8x10 in a flight case.
I am 6'1" and have NO difficulty removing the case from the cab
with NO assistance.

Just trying to visualize what/where the problem is.

 

[obimark]

I often see posts on here where people speak of routinely playing gigs for less than 20 people... How many people are in these bands? If you are a 4 or 5 piece band and you can't get 20 heads to come out and see you play, you need to get out of the woodshed and make some f-ing friends. Also if there are more bands on the bill, you seriously need to stop booking shows with bands that cant get more than 5-7 people to show up. I know the general wisdom is to play as many shows as possible, but you gotta look at your best interests as a band. Don't just book any hole in the wall with whatever band asks, be selective. Book around your home town where your friends and family are more likely to stop out. I know when you're first starting out it's hard to get new fans, but come on. Sorry for the thread jack. I just don't get it.

More to the point... I'd rather have too much amp and not need it. Then need it and not have it. You can play a big amp at lower volume... Of course I'm not in a coffee shop kind of band either. Does it suck to carry my 8x10? Yes. I'm actually looking for something in a 4x10 for bar shows, but I aint getting rid of my fridge either. At least not yet. Eventually I may look into a fearful... From what I've heard they seem pretty cool.

I am sorry to say I have been in those type of bands- but personally I do not feel it is my responsiblity to drag my friends to every show I play.
A club should have some sort of NATURAL crowd- ie a bar. If nobody comes to the bar normally then maybe my band can bring 10-15 people but that is it, the bar needs to provide the other 30-40 but guess what some of them just DON'T. Was my band the best, Hell No, but we were certainly as good as most cover bands. Here in Hotlanta the music scene for classic rock at least SUCKS. Period, I kid you not.
Either you can play out in the boonies or forget it. And before it is said, yes you can play originals, but you better ENJOY setting up and hauling all your gear to play for 30-40 minutes with 4-5 other bands EVERY TIME>

THis is sadly the way it is here. (UNLESS YOU ARE a MEDIUM size draw band that can get into the better places or open for a better band- as in B-List with radio play.)

 

[TBrett]

Gotta say, I'm fairly certain our guitarist would make a similar remark if he was constantly being asked to help the bass player set up or tear down. It's not that we don't help each other out at shows. If someone needs help, we help. But it is also expected that each band member is responsible for their own gear, and that they will select gear that they can manage. To that end, our guitarist bought himself a very compact set up that he can easily carry himself. So he would not be too pleased at having to play roadie at every gig just because someone else bought more gear than they can handle on their own.

That said, our bass player recently bought himself his dream rig, or pretty close to it, anyway. Two Accugroove cabs (an El Whappo Jr. and a Tri210L), two road cases containing his amp and Axe FX II respectively, plus the case for his pedal board and his wireless unit. When assembled, the rig is 6 feet tall and it requires three trips from the car to the stage and back again. Upon seeing this, our guitarist was quite concerned at how long it would take our bass player to load in, etc., and I could tell he was afraid he was going to get stuck helping every time, which would impact his own set up time. So there can definitely come a point when a band member's choice of gear unduly impacts others and it's important to keep this in mind.

It's the kind of thing that should be discussed up front, though. Did the OP speak to his guitarist prior to gigs and get the guy's agreement? Did he offer to do something for the guitarist in return? Because if not, the guitarist might be feeling a bit taken for granted, and I can see how he might feel that way.

Of course, in our case, I'm the one who helps the bass player because he also happens to be my spouse.