Correct but it takes a TON of trial and error going through each gig feeling disappointed and to the point of almost giving up. Prince was a victim of this in his earlier career.
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Audience reactions: important to improving?
- Thread starter pklima
- Start date
Correct but it takes a TON of trial and error going through each gig feeling disappointed and to the point of almost giving up. Prince was a victim of this in his earlier career.
Different types of venues offer different types of experiences. So much of this has always depended on context. If you're a dance band playing "Play that Funky Music" to a seated audience of jazz lovers, you're possibly going to fail on the audience's terms. If you're a jazz band playing "Can't Take That Away From Me" in a dance club, probably the same thing.
I've learned through the years to put my best foot forward and tailor shows to the venue to the best of my ability, but the thing I know is that if you do what you do with confidence and the sense that you're having a good time, the audience will pick that up no matter what you play.
So, with that said, I think that this whole "no live audience" thing is giving us all an opportunity to explore things with some bravery that we perhaps didn't have full confidence to do before. I have original music that I'm starting to promote that I never did with a live band because I never had the support to perform it. I refuse to believe that means it isn't worth doing or that it doesn't have a home somewhere.
Get out there and do what you do and do it with everything you've got. If it's good, you'll find that has its own set of rewards.
Just as an aside, I am sitting here with headphones on and streaming and "Play that Funky Music" just came on, so that means my post was ordained somehow. Take it as gospel!
I've learned through the years to put my best foot forward and tailor shows to the venue to the best of my ability, but the thing I know is that if you do what you do with confidence and the sense that you're having a good time, the audience will pick that up no matter what you play.
So, with that said, I think that this whole "no live audience" thing is giving us all an opportunity to explore things with some bravery that we perhaps didn't have full confidence to do before. I have original music that I'm starting to promote that I never did with a live band because I never had the support to perform it. I refuse to believe that means it isn't worth doing or that it doesn't have a home somewhere.
Get out there and do what you do and do it with everything you've got. If it's good, you'll find that has its own set of rewards.
Just as an aside, I am sitting here with headphones on and streaming and "Play that Funky Music" just came on, so that means my post was ordained somehow. Take it as gospel!
I often wanted to edit recordings of our live gigs with the just last four bars of each song and the audience reaction. And string all those edits together for about 3-4 minutes worth of audio to share with the boys. To kind of help us remember what worked and what didn't.
Then I listened to a few of those gig tapes and realized it would be a whole lot of work for not much payoff! But it kinda depended on the place and the night, too.
Then I listened to a few of those gig tapes and realized it would be a whole lot of work for not much payoff! But it kinda depended on the place and the night, too.
We played this song to open a charity show with a "put-together" work group. We might have been a little more metal, and a little faster. OWNED the intro to the show!
The audience is never an indicator of what you need to do better, IMO. Definitely a measure of what you offed up.
I almost always play to please the audience - that's what you generally do. Either you figure out what they want/like and give it to them, or create something they may/will like and build your own.
But some of the simplest things played meh will amaze them and other really complicated things played well won't get noticed. Every artist has nights where they think they were amazing and no one said anything, and nights where they sucked and got nothing but accolades.
Sometimes its just the song you played...
But no matter what - YOU should know what needs done better, and try to do it better.
I almost always play to please the audience - that's what you generally do. Either you figure out what they want/like and give it to them, or create something they may/will like and build your own.
But some of the simplest things played meh will amaze them and other really complicated things played well won't get noticed. Every artist has nights where they think they were amazing and no one said anything, and nights where they sucked and got nothing but accolades.
Sometimes its just the song you played...
But no matter what - YOU should know what needs done better, and try to do it better.
I play in a cover band. We play bars, concerts, parties, etc. Audience reaction is EVERYTHING! That's why we get hired. It's not art, it's entertainment. (If I played in an original band this would be different) Many of the preceding posts have said it's all about song selection ( I agree) but implied that selecting the right songs is easy. HA! Most of the bands I see playing in the same clubs have terrible set lists. Why? because they play the songs they want to play, not the songs the audience wants to hear. The only way to know what the audience likes is to play in front of people as often as you can. I agree with what has been said before. You can't go by one gig. Some songs are guaranteed (Don't stop Believing?) Others might be great one night and so-so the next, and others will lose the audience most nights. I would think those should be replaced right away. Anyway, if you want to be a performer, then you have to perform. If you want to be a musician, practice your instrument. Of course you can be both. I would assume most of us who call ourselves performers also try to be good musicians as well, we just sadly know which aspect the audience appreciates more. Bottom line, do whatever helps you get to your goals.
I totally agree newwavefrank. But I think the OP was really talking about improving playing.
Having the right set list, arranged in the right order, for the audience/venue is about the "business" and by business I mean selling yourself to the venue and the audience to get gigs. Fail at that, and you are done.
But I hear you. So many bands go "This is cool - let's play it!" Yeah - cool as a musician, bass player, guitarist or whatever. I'm in an 80's Hair Band Tribute. Most "bands out there are "too cool" to play "Lame" songs like Pour Some Sugar, Here I Go Again, and We're Not Gonna Take It. Let alone actually wear spandex while doing it. In fact - most of us are not fans of those songs. Yet every one of them KILLS every night. We would all love to do Down Incognito by Winger off their 3rd album. Most people are like "Winger had a 3rd album?!?!?"
And no one EVER comes up and says "Dude - you were ON FIRE during that Vandenberg run at the end of the solo for Here I Go Again!!!!!" No matter how well, or how badly it goes...And it has only gone badly once/twice when my hair was covering my eyes in the dark. I probably spent more time practicing that run than all three songs put together. The Audience is already waiting to yell "HERE I GO AGAIN ON MY OWN!!!"
Listen to Randy Roads play the run at the end of Crazy train. He plays it 15 different ways. No one cares except that one guy in the back with his arms folded going "He didn't play the studio version exactly right". No one care about him. He isn't bold enough to get on stage and do it, and won't be happy no matter what you do.
I see a lot of people talk about playing out worrying about everything EXCEPT what will the audience like/enjoy.
We have a rule: Name a hair band, name the two songs they did everyone knows. If it isn't one of those - out. There are a COUPLE of exceptions. We do Never Enough by LA Guns and Edge of a Broken Heart by Vixen. Not "A" list songs - but just like that Alligator song - immediately accessible and clearly and right in the center ring as the genre goes. And as much as we can NAIL the notes and tones on Photograph by Def Leppard - we DON'T do it. Why not? Missing those harmonies would be an immediate FAIL.
Having the right set list, arranged in the right order, for the audience/venue is about the "business" and by business I mean selling yourself to the venue and the audience to get gigs. Fail at that, and you are done.
But I hear you. So many bands go "This is cool - let's play it!" Yeah - cool as a musician, bass player, guitarist or whatever. I'm in an 80's Hair Band Tribute. Most "bands out there are "too cool" to play "Lame" songs like Pour Some Sugar, Here I Go Again, and We're Not Gonna Take It. Let alone actually wear spandex while doing it. In fact - most of us are not fans of those songs. Yet every one of them KILLS every night. We would all love to do Down Incognito by Winger off their 3rd album. Most people are like "Winger had a 3rd album?!?!?"
And no one EVER comes up and says "Dude - you were ON FIRE during that Vandenberg run at the end of the solo for Here I Go Again!!!!!" No matter how well, or how badly it goes...And it has only gone badly once/twice when my hair was covering my eyes in the dark. I probably spent more time practicing that run than all three songs put together. The Audience is already waiting to yell "HERE I GO AGAIN ON MY OWN!!!"
Listen to Randy Roads play the run at the end of Crazy train. He plays it 15 different ways. No one cares except that one guy in the back with his arms folded going "He didn't play the studio version exactly right". No one care about him. He isn't bold enough to get on stage and do it, and won't be happy no matter what you do.
I see a lot of people talk about playing out worrying about everything EXCEPT what will the audience like/enjoy.
We have a rule: Name a hair band, name the two songs they did everyone knows. If it isn't one of those - out. There are a COUPLE of exceptions. We do Never Enough by LA Guns and Edge of a Broken Heart by Vixen. Not "A" list songs - but just like that Alligator song - immediately accessible and clearly and right in the center ring as the genre goes. And as much as we can NAIL the notes and tones on Photograph by Def Leppard - we DON'T do it. Why not? Missing those harmonies would be an immediate FAIL.
Debbie Harry agrees.As I've often said, rock music has a lot more in common with professional wrestling than most people care to think.
Play it tight, play it like you mean it, play it in time, play the right key.
The rest is Swagger. Correct notes be damned!
The rest is Swagger. Correct notes be damned!
I go with that Victor Wooten groove teaching and take upon myself that we are the glue that keeps things together and makes the heads bob and feet move. As a church player in a church where dancing is acceptable if people don't get up and dance on occasion then I feel the need to up my game.
In any case the latest quote I heard from one of Wooten's recent interviews is that he saw too many people now who studied Jaco's solos but none of them knew Jaco's bass lines. Yet I think Weather Report grooved harder with Alphonso
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- Chuck Sher publishes my book, WALKING BASSICS:The Fundamentals of Jazz Bass Playing.
All audience response is a good indicator of is just whether or not they're having good time. It won't improve anyone's playing. The only thing that improves your playing is consistent, progressive work in the shed. Sure, you can draw them into your energy, but that's contingent on how well the band is communicating musically with each other.
The problem with paying attention to audience reaction as regards your individual musicianship is that it can box you in and actually stifle any improvement. If you get a good reaction to something you played (talking lines, not a specific song) and what you're looking for is that immediate gratification of audience response, you tend to start doing those things (and only those things) that go over. Likewise songs, the band will then tend to do only those things that have been well received and anything other than that, even if it contains material that would be challenging to you musically and lead to developing better technique, better ear, more lyrical approach, whatever, that gets dropped.
But at the end of the day you, as a musician, need to decide what's important to you. Do you want people to like what you say or do you only want to say things people will like?
The problem with paying attention to audience reaction as regards your individual musicianship is that it can box you in and actually stifle any improvement. If you get a good reaction to something you played (talking lines, not a specific song) and what you're looking for is that immediate gratification of audience response, you tend to start doing those things (and only those things) that go over. Likewise songs, the band will then tend to do only those things that have been well received and anything other than that, even if it contains material that would be challenging to you musically and lead to developing better technique, better ear, more lyrical approach, whatever, that gets dropped.
But at the end of the day you, as a musician, need to decide what's important to you. Do you want people to like what you say or do you only want to say things people will like?
