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AUDIO TEST: Maple+Maple vs. Alder+Rosewood!
- Thread starter -=DanAtkinson=-
- Start date
Upper mids, its not so much the top, but the upper mid harshness and bite i hear from maple I do not dig. This is coming from my own experience as well. The combination of ash body, goncalo alves neck shaft with pau ferro board sounds more interesting to me, as that maple sound is gone entirely. Now that I've heard both, I can generally attribute maple as having this 2khz upper mid high Q boost in it that I dont like. IMO, YMMV of course.
In these clips though you will not hear that as pronounced because the flats are covering it up. I suspect the tone knob and potentiometers are further covering up that detail and in the mix it would be lost if not for the overly accentuated lows and lack of upper mid detail from bass 2 to make out what bass was being played.
Bass 2 has a distinctive growl in the low end, which comes through in the mix. I heard it very clearly and guessed right. Sounds excellent!
Ahhh...I can see that. Thanks for relaying your thoughts on the subject. Frequencies in the 2k range can be quite hard on the ears.
In the clips posted, do you hear a difference in the fundamental vs. first/second harmonics?
Dan is a builder so we should be careful when supporting an opposite theory.
In my experience, many times I bought a certain bass not because it sounded good in the shop, but because I heard something exciting in the quite disappointing sound produced. If I judged the instrument as it was, I just missed some good instrument. I mean, took the bass home, and dedicated many, oh so many ours, in different days, to adjust correctly and by ear, the truss rod, the string action, the string spacing, all the interfaces between woods (neck pocket, bridge), PUs height. Rewired the circuit with high-quality wire and pots, capacitors. Many months of work, because of the time to allow the neck to take a new comfortable correct bowing and so on...I must say that all these acts produced an audible change in sound, many of the times in the right direction. Above mentioned percentages should IMO be changed slightly. When you buy a Suzuki GSX-R (sport motorcycle) and you go racing on a track circuit, you can complete the lap in 2 minutes. Then you dedicate days to the setup of suspensions, change tires, adjust the height of the rear and front of the vehicle and more...now you can complete the lap in 1:40 minutes, with the same motorbike, even without changing stock components, if you change them...
In my experience, many times I bought a certain bass not because it sounded good in the shop, but because I heard something exciting in the quite disappointing sound produced. If I judged the instrument as it was, I just missed some good instrument. I mean, took the bass home, and dedicated many, oh so many ours, in different days, to adjust correctly and by ear, the truss rod, the string action, the string spacing, all the interfaces between woods (neck pocket, bridge), PUs height. Rewired the circuit with high-quality wire and pots, capacitors. Many months of work, because of the time to allow the neck to take a new comfortable correct bowing and so on...I must say that all these acts produced an audible change in sound, many of the times in the right direction. Above mentioned percentages should IMO be changed slightly. When you buy a Suzuki GSX-R (sport motorcycle) and you go racing on a track circuit, you can complete the lap in 2 minutes. Then you dedicate days to the setup of suspensions, change tires, adjust the height of the rear and front of the vehicle and more...now you can complete the lap in 1:40 minutes, with the same motorbike, even without changing stock components, if you change them...
So... What is the best goat for metal
Thanks for doing these tests Dan, it reinforces my thinking that while wood does matter, there are many other things that have a higher influence on the final tone.
Looking forward to whatever test you have next
Dan is a builder so we should be careful when supporting an opposite theory.
In my experience, many times I bought a certain bass not because it sounded good in the shop, but because I heard something exciting in the quite disappointing sound produced. If I judged the instrument as it was, I just missed some good instrument. I mean, took the bass home, and dedicated many, oh so many ours, in different days, to adjust correctly and by ear, the truss rod, the string action, the string spacing, all the interfaces between woods (neck pocket, bridge), PUs height. Rewired the circuit with high-quality wire and pots, capacitors. Many months of work, because of the time to allow the neck to take a new comfortable correct bowing and so on...I must say that all these acts produced an audible change in sound, many of the times in the right direction. Above mentioned percentages should IMO be changed slightly. When you buy a Suzuki GSX-R (sport motorcycle) and you go racing on a track circuit, you can complete the lap in 2 minutes. Then you dedicate days to the setup of suspensions, change tires, adjust the height of the rear and front of the vehicle and more...now you can complete the lap in 1:40 minutes, with the same motorbike, even without changing stock components, if you change them...
I've never made any change to the neck of a bass that altered the sound at all.
Unless I actually replaced a physical part of the bass (bridge, nut, strings, etc) I've never heard any change in tone.
Judging from his posts here, it appears that Dan has been assembling instruments for the last couple of years.
I started building and repairing instruments over 40 years ago and have been a professional test engineer for the last 24 years, so I'm very comfortable with my qualifications to critique his testing practices.
Went to my local guitar store today and took out an ash Fender J and an alder one. Both 2010, both passive, both set flat. Solicited 4 eager volunteers and asked 2 customers and 2 sales guys to turn their backs while I played a riff on each through an Ampeg combo. 1st I told 'em which was which, and in subsequent trials I asked them to tell me. Before we started, 2 said they'd be able to tell ash from alder. Noone could tell diddly from squat. They were all over the map, just as anyone I've done this with has been. I hear a lot of people saying they can tell, but when blinded, I've never seen anyone able. I've done it 4 times over the last 9 years. I have seen many many claims that wood matters, but no reasonable evidence that anybody can tell, in a blinded, objective test.
Wood matters, but not enough to make a difference anyone can truly hear with his ears alone.
Wood matters, but not enough to make a difference anyone can truly hear with his ears alone.
So far I've sussed out every one of Dan's demonstrations including the one where he tried to fool us and used the same bass twice when he said he used two different basses. All of those were ears only.
You judge incorrectly.
Can you prove that? Out of all my test threads, I can only find one where you publicly went on the record with your pick. Most of the time, you only post for the sake of being critical.
Besides, I'm more concerned with the collective results. Not whether one individual claims to have aced all the tests.
- Feb 16, 2008
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- Disclosures
- John K Custom Basses
IMO, that's a false generalization. maybe just you can't, and the people you played for can't, but i know of many, and have built instruments for those that can.
I think there are people that think they can hear these differences. I'd love to get a double blind test going and put some folks' ears to the test. Although I'd believe people being able to tell the differences in woods over people who think thy can hear a difference between your average cable and those silly Tara Labs or Lava cables!
Runs out of thread...
Runs out of thread...
Have you truly seen someone BLINDLY and repeatedly/reliably differentiate between multiple basses differing only in wood type?
Honestly? If so, you are the 1st to have actually seen it that I have ever heard of. I have met a few who claim to, but when push came to shove, they were unable.
