Whenever I'm playing with a bow I can get a good sound on all the lower notes, but when I start bowing anywhere higher then the C on the G string I get a really bad sound, is there a reason for this?
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Double Bass Bad sound bowing in higher positions.
- Thread starter Sebastian2113
- Start date
Firstly what strings are you using? Bright strings can exacerbate the issue.
What youre doing to make the bad sound could be a number of things:
1. Not bowing perpendicular (though thats a debatable point)
2. Pressing too hard
3. Incorrect bow speed/pressure combination
4. Scratchy bow hair
5. Rosin gripping too much because its too soft for the strings and hair, or youre just using too much of it.
If youre having trouble getting a good tone that low down then something is really tripping you up
What youre doing to make the bad sound could be a number of things:
1. Not bowing perpendicular (though thats a debatable point)
2. Pressing too hard
3. Incorrect bow speed/pressure combination
4. Scratchy bow hair
5. Rosin gripping too much because its too soft for the strings and hair, or youre just using too much of it.
If youre having trouble getting a good tone that low down then something is really tripping you up
As you bow notes that are further up the finger board (closer to the bridge) you need to also move your bow up closer to the bridge, to maintain a good tone quality.
Note that this bow movement is subtle, but continuous. You will probably only be moving the bow a couple of inches, while playing over the whole distance from C on the G string up to the Octave C on the G string.
As I said the bow creeping is subtle but it really makes a difference in tone quality.
All the other factors also matter in tone quality, but this one was not mentioned by the other posters.
Note that this bow movement is subtle, but continuous. You will probably only be moving the bow a couple of inches, while playing over the whole distance from C on the G string up to the Octave C on the G string.
As I said the bow creeping is subtle but it really makes a difference in tone quality.
All the other factors also matter in tone quality, but this one was not mentioned by the other posters.
What kind of bad sound is it that you are getting?
What I experience sometimes is that I get a high squeaking sound when going from the D (above the octave G on the g string) or higher. The sound is not always there and is unpredictable. It is not the D harmonic.
Maybe it is the same thing the OP is talking about?
I can't find what it is or what I can do to prevent this. I haven't asked my teacher yet.
Any of you know what it can be?
What I experience sometimes is that I get a high squeaking sound when going from the D (above the octave G on the g string) or higher. The sound is not always there and is unpredictable. It is not the D harmonic.
Maybe it is the same thing the OP is talking about?
I can't find what it is or what I can do to prevent this. I haven't asked my teacher yet.
Any of you know what it can be?
LF - i think i know what you are talking about. it may be a pressure/bow speed/timing thing. i've had trouble with this before and it's always been either from crushing the string with too much pressure or too fast of a bow stroke before the string has a chance to get started. it's irritating though because it is so subtle that it can feel like you are doing the same thing as always which makes it seem unpredictable and random.
OP - it's a pretty vague description you are giving. "bad sound" could mean a lot of things. my hunch is that it is one of the things listed above. you should either talk to your teacher about it or give a better description of what it is you are doing and the undesirable sound that you are making. are you talking about playing arco on your EUB or are you playing a school bass? getting a good arco sound is something that takes a very long time to develop. every note on the bass not only has a placement on the board, but also a set of speed/pressure/placement combinations that work and a set of combinations that won't. you need to learn the feel of that.
OP - it's a pretty vague description you are giving. "bad sound" could mean a lot of things. my hunch is that it is one of the things listed above. you should either talk to your teacher about it or give a better description of what it is you are doing and the undesirable sound that you are making. are you talking about playing arco on your EUB or are you playing a school bass? getting a good arco sound is something that takes a very long time to develop. every note on the bass not only has a placement on the board, but also a set of speed/pressure/placement combinations that work and a set of combinations that won't. you need to learn the feel of that.
i've just been playing in that tessitura a lot lately. i think the best way to explain it is that it's a familiarity thing, you just need to get to know that range of the instrument to the point that it is as comfortable to play in as half position. also, haphazard bow placement can often be the culprit... keep in mind that while you are playing across the strings in lower positions, you don't have to adjust your bow placement very much because you are in the same part of the string generally. as you go higher, there is a lot more shifting, and the string becomes more fussy about where the bow needs to be for a given speed on a given note. too stiff of a place on the string with too fast a bow will cause the string to reject the bow, whereas too soft a bow placement will cause you to lose resistance, and your sound will become airy and unfocused. for me, problems would often arise from lack of stamina when playing a lot in TP. it's easy to become lazy with technique because you are getting fatigued. i know i talk about it a lot, but 2 octave vomits are a really great stamina builder, and help address the bow speed/pressure issues we are talking about. i can't say that i've fully gotten rid of this problem for sure, but i haven't noticed it for a while. hope this helps. i know you already know a lot of this, but i guess my point is that the top range of the bass gets way more picky about all these things, requiring more focus and control.
Roy Vogt
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- Sep 20, 2000
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A lot of times students will play with their bow in the same position whatever position they are in which yields a "reedy/hollow" sound in thumb position.
There are a lot of Rabbath classes on this on Youtube, including a master class in Germany in 3 sections, here's one:
Also, the hidden culprit might be your left hand pressure/technique. Your teacher should be able to spot this and help you out.
There are a lot of Rabbath classes on this on Youtube, including a master class in Germany in 3 sections, here's one:
Also, the hidden culprit might be your left hand pressure/technique. Your teacher should be able to spot this and help you out.
Thanks for your tips. I play a lot in TP.
I hear the squeeking sound sometimes in a run from say a two octave C major arpeggio. Then on the high C (or higher with different triad) there is the squeek sound. I do move the bow closer to the bridge but it might not be enough. It is hard to find the right spot when doing all register runs.
yeah, maybe a bow placement thing then. still, timing can be the problem - the tendency for me has been that i will use a faster bow than i need to on or immediately following a shift in TP... it's a coordination thing - since one hand is moving a large distance, the tendency is for the other to want to follow i think. it's hard to separate the intention of each hand to such a fine degree, takes a lot of work.
Two things:
1. You know how your teacher and everyone else stresses long tones?? Well, you need to do them in all registers. Play said bad sounding note for an hour or two and it will tell you want it wants in order to sound good. I like to think of it that way, too - asking the bass what it wants.
2. Study the "bad" sound, find out how it works. You might need it someday. Know your enemy.
Once you know how it works you can more easily purge it. Rather than saying "bad" or "wrong" approach technical and theoretical matters like more like a scientist - note what the sound is and what you are doing to get it.
When scientists put two things together and they blow up - they don't say it is "wrong", they say, "when you put those two things together they blow up".
1. You know how your teacher and everyone else stresses long tones?? Well, you need to do them in all registers. Play said bad sounding note for an hour or two and it will tell you want it wants in order to sound good. I like to think of it that way, too - asking the bass what it wants.
2. Study the "bad" sound, find out how it works. You might need it someday. Know your enemy.
Once you know how it works you can more easily purge it. Rather than saying "bad" or "wrong" approach technical and theoretical matters like more like a scientist - note what the sound is and what you are doing to get it.
When scientists put two things together and they blow up - they don't say it is "wrong", they say, "when you put those two things together they blow up".
