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Baer Amplification Megathread!

#3,141
This is all fine, well, and true, as far as "100% optimal" is concerned.

However, I've owned and used both mirrored, and, non-mirrored sets of cabs, and I'd bet you $5 you couldn't tell which was which, from the middle of the room in a live performance.

So, for me, I think the Baers are just fine, as *I* can hear myself better, and, it doesn't seem to lose anything out in the room.

Coolhandjjl said:
A horizontal positioned cab stacked vertical with a mirror image cab lets the mids stay as close as possible, and keeps the top woofer close enough to the bottom woofer. Given that, when stacked vertically, the top woofer couples to the bottom woofer, which is coupled to the floor. This will get you better horizontal dispersion in the audience. If you stacked horizontal and went into the crowd, I'll bet you would find reduced dispersion. Typically, it's just the frequencies 150 Hz and below that our ears can't tell direction from, but there's still a lot of content from the woofers above 150Hz that do benefit from wide dispersion.

Having a mid closer to the bassist's ears is nice, but not absolutely necessary. I would think having the option of mirror image cabs would supercede that, as it's more critical to get the mids closer together so they couple as well. Having the mids spaced too far apart usually results in beaming, cancellation areas, etc.



YMMV :cool:
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#3,142
I like this "If it sounds good, it IS good" approach.

Chef said:
This is all fine, well, and true, as far as "100% optimal" is concerned.

However, I've owned and used both mirrored, and, non-mirrored sets of cabs, and I'd bet you $5 you couldn't tell which was which, from the middle of the room in a live performance.

So, for me, I think the Baers are just fine, as *I* can hear myself better, and, it doesn't seem to lose anything out in the room.
Click to expand...
 
#3,143
liam_g said:
I thought lows were omnidirectional?

Liam
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Salesmen in the home theater arena are guilty of spreading that one. They will all tell you 'bass is non-directional' and end the conversation there. A half truth at best.

We detect direct of sound by triangulation. Because our ears are just 8" apart or so, there is little difference in the portion a 41Hz wave (27') that our right ear hears vs what our left ear picks up. That 27' wave has to travel 8" further to get to out other ear, but 8" compared to that overall 27' wave, it is simply not enough of a difference for humans to detect. And both ears pick up that long wave in very similar portions of it's crest/trough cycle. Pro audio guys often 'sum' low frequencies because of this. But how low is too low to detect?

At about 150~200Hz, the average listener can begin to detect direction. I have an EQ with a feature that sums from roughly 150Hz. It is because the length of the sound wave decreases. So as the frequency goes up, we can begin to detect the direction that the sound is coming from. At 4kHz, that wave is now just a few inches. That wave still traveled 8" further to get to the other ear, but several more complete cycles of that 4kHz signal occured from when it hit the first ear to get to the second ear, and the second ear also picked it up at a different portion of the wave's crest/trough cycle than the first ear. Triangulation is in effect and works well.

Elephants use low frequencies to navigate as their heads are so wide their ears are much further apart.
 
#3,144
nostatic said:
Baer + balloons

9mar13-2.jpg
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wow. quite impressive.
 
#3,145
Chef said:
This is all fine, well, and true, as far as "100% optimal" is concerned.

However, I've owned and used both mirrored, and, non-mirrored sets of cabs, and I'd bet you $5 you couldn't tell which was which, from the middle of the room in a live performance.

So, for me, I think the Baers are just fine, as *I* can hear myself better, and, it doesn't seem to lose anything out in the room.
Click to expand...


Good to know! I can safely buy a pair of ML112's as they are, as two are just plain better than one! Plus the look of a pair (anyway you do it) always wins out over just one. :p (And any cab with two woofers is just too darn heavy for an old guy like me to schlep around.)
 
#3,147
monsterthompson said:
What's the word on the 115? Is there a street date yet? Are any already out in the wild?
Sorry for pulling a Donny and just wanering into theconversation, but google and search weren't helping.
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I'm hoping the ML115 will be available next month. I did a slight tweak to the cabinet dimensions and am just waiting on the shop to reprogram the CNC's and get material ordered.
 
#3,148
Sweet. I'm very interested (and have been for a while). I still question my choice to go with a custom 15/6 over a 112, particularly now that I'm running a TecAmp head. I could have had two ML 112 cabs for about the same cost and a more modular setup. Eight times out of ten, the 15/6 is a gun in a knife fight. I did have some tonal concerns with my bass (Ding ABZ5) and head (M6) at the time with the ML112, but I think now that I favor the Jag 900 and a Nash PB63 things would line up differently.
 
#3,149
monsterthompson said:
Sweet. I'm very interested (and have been for a while). I still question my choice to go with a custom 15/6 over a 112, particularly now that I'm running a TecAmp head. I could have had two ML 112 cabs for about the same cost and a more modular setup. Eight times out of ten, the 15/6 is a gun in a knife fight. I did have some tonal concerns with my bass (Ding ABZ5) and head (M6) at the time with the ML112, but I think now that I favor the Jag 900 and a Nash PB63 things would line up differently.
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That Mesa is a pretty bright head and the EQ doesn't really let you dial it all out. Let's hook up here soon and you can take the ML115 for a spin and see if it's more to your liking. Bit bigger on the low end and less upper mids. Might be just right for you.
 
#3,150
Coolhandjjl said:
Good to know! I can safely buy a pair of ML112's as they are, as two are just plain better than one! Plus the look of a pair (anyway you do it) always wins out over just one. :p (And any cab with two woofers is just too darn heavy for an old guy like me to schlep around.)
Click to expand...

IME, a pair of ML112s makes a monstrous bar band rig. I kept up with a volume-crazy guitard, with no sweat. Stacked vertically. And the B string? Fuggedabouddit!
 
#3,151
electric wood said:
Hi One Drop,

I live around Lausanne and my main gig is "ALOAN", based in Geneva: Invalid Link Removed

Since we've played a fair amount of places across the country recently, and Switzerland's area being 10x smaller than California, we'd rather be wandering in France in the near future. We hope to get some Swiss festivals in the Summer though.
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Wow, you guys sound fabulous! I'll try to come and see you at party Time in Chateau d'Oex. I can't believe you are nearly local to me and I haven't heard of you or seen you yet.

BTW I'll be moving to Lausanne in May for a new job moving between LSNE and GE, will give me more time to check out bands in the area.
 
#3,152
R Baer said:
That Mesa is a pretty bright head and the EQ doesn't really let you dial it all out. Let's hook up here soon and you can take the ML115 for a spin and see if it's more to your liking. Bit bigger on the low end and less upper mids. Might be just right for you.
Click to expand...

deal!

i'm also waiting for those new Mesa tube heads to get released. i sorta expect the same tone/eq vibe, so that might not be the best combo, but no way to know with each of these items being just above phantom vaporware :)
 
#3,154
I was chatting with Bruce yesterday (B string). While we were discussing the merits and magic of the Baer ML112, we both commented on something that may not receive as much mind-share as it deserves; Low to medium Volume quality of tone!

I've had many other cabs that sound great when you turn them up. And we all need to know our cabinets are capable of delivering a certain SPL/volume. But some of those larger cabs sound just 'ok' at low to medium volume.

This is NOT the case with the Baer ML112. It possesses equally lively, articulate, clarity of tone at all volumes. Maybe that's the magic of the 6" mid. Whatever it is, exceptional low volume performance is as important to me as anything. Sometimes more!

So Kudo's to Roger for a design that spans all volume thresholds with great performance and tone.
 
#3,156
GRoberts said:
I was chatting with Bruce yesterday (B string). While we were discussing the merits and magic of the Baer ML112, we both commented on something that may not receive as much mind-share as it deserves; Low to medium Volume quality of tone!

I've had many other cabs that sound great when you turn them up. And we all need to know our cabinets are capable of delivering a certain SPL/volume. But some of those larger cabs sound just 'ok' at low to medium volume.

This is NOT the case with the Baer ML112. It possesses equally lively, articulate, clarity of tone at all volumes. Maybe that's the magic of the 6" mid. Whatever it is, exceptional low volume performance is as important to me as anything. Sometimes more!

So Kudo's to Roger for a design that spans all volume thresholds with great performance and tone.
Click to expand...

Thanks for bringing that up. Very important factor for a lot of players, but often gets overlooked in the race for the most volume out of the smallest cab that seems to be the focus of most TB threads these days.
 
#3,159
R Baer said:
Thanks for bringing that up. Very important factor for a lot of players, but often gets overlooked in the race for the most volume out of the smallest cab that seems to be the focus of most TB threads these days.
Click to expand...

So far, in my limited, but real-world gigging experience, I have not found a single 1x12 cab that sounds as good, rich and full, and articulate as the Baer ML112 does for my low to medium volume gigs. Truly exceptional tone. Does not HAVE TO BE loud before it sounds good. It sounds good all the time. Seriously!
 
#3,160
GRoberts said:
So far, in my limited, but real-world gigging experience, I have not found a single 1x12 cab that sounds as good, rich and full, and articulate as the Baer ML112 does for my low to medium volume gigs. Truly exceptional tone. Does not HAVE TO BE loud before it sounds good. It sounds good all the time. Seriously!
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more Gary. Sounds very even, full, and articulate at low volumes.

It killed again at my gig last night at a retro 80's show.....

Baggy parachute pants: 20 dollars

Mullet wig: 25 dollars

Dropping a low B during Rebel Yell with an ML112 causing the Flock of Seagulls dude's wig to rocket off his head.......Priceless!
 

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