Basic Rant re: keeping it simple.

[Mushroo]

How much are they being paid? $500 per week? $200 per week? $50 per gig which happens three times per year? You have to align expectations with what the gig is paying. There are a ton of other things happening in life so a band that pays effectively nothing becomes a lower priority. Chose songs that are easy crowd pleasers.

Exactly my point with the James Brown anecdote. I see a lot of threads on TB along the lines of, "why aren't the unpaid amateurs in my hobby band acting more PROFESSIONAL?"

We're all busy people. Not all musicians are perfectionists. A lot of amateur musicians look forward to "band night" as an opportunity to have fun in a casual, criticism-free environment. If you are the bandleader, and you want your hired guns to show up, on time and well-prepared, having done their homework and transcribed their parts note-for-note, then your side of the equation is to pay them a professional rate.

If on the other hand, you can't afford to pay your musicians for rehearsals, then my advice is to write out some accurate, easy to read charts. That way they aren't wasting your rehearsal time trying to remember how the song goes, and you aren't wasting your unpaid volunteers' home/life/family time by giving them homework in between rehearsals.

 

[40Hz]

I hear you.

There’s been a growing trend in this world to start seeing everything as one big joke.

Music hasn’t been immune to it.

It’s one reason I’m not currently in a band where I am. And the main reason why doesn’t bother me too much.

As far as many in the gimme-gimme “pay me first and I’ll think about it” crowd goes, my feeling is: Show me you’ve actually got something worth paying for and I’ll consider it.

I’ve done a lot of contracting in the IT world. And the one thing I’ve learned when hiring expertise is that the people who harp about money up front and go on about it the most are invariably the biggest disappointments. YMMV.

 

[ZAR14]

How much are they being paid? $500 per week? $200 per week? $50 per gig which happens three times per year? You have to align expectations with what the gig is paying. There are a ton of other things happening in life so a band that pays effectively nothing becomes a lower priority. Chose songs that are easy crowd pleasers.

Times are definitely "Different". Back in the day I didn't base my level of commitment on a pay scale. When I was a member of a band I fulfilled my Responsibilities.
I can't see how you could be too busy to be responsible for $200 but not too busy for $500. You either have other commitments on your plate or you do not. Comes down to having a Bad Attitude or not...

 

[lfmn16]

If you can't find it, start it. It's a lot of work, but worth it. You may need to 'settle' at first, but get the band out working and you'll have your pick of good players.

If someone can't learn the correct chords to most tunes, they shouldn't be in a band. With the internet, you should be able to learn most songs to the level that you can get through them relatively quickly. There is a lot of area between playing a song perfectly, note for note and showing up not even knowing the chords. Just don't play with people that don't have enough pride in their playing to bother learning the tunes (or play with them and replace them ASAP).

 

[lfmn16]

I hear you.

There’s been a growing trend in this world to start seeing everything as one big joke.

 

[FirewalZ]

I'm getting really fed up with a certain situation that seems to be rampant in my local music scene.

People show up to a rehearsal, unprepared. Don't know the song form, or even the right chords. It's a complete hack job forgery of an attempt.

(I realize this is not unique to my area, LOL)

At which point, I attempt to explain to them what they are doing wrong.

This is always met with "let's just keep it simple." LET'S JUST KEEP IT SIMPLE?!?

Don't get me wrong. I live by the K.I.S.S. method. (Keep it simple, sweety) But to me, and the musicians who brought me up, the actual act of keeping it as simple as possible is when everyone learns the song and shows up prepared to play what they were assigned with learning, simply.

Am I alone? I'm getting annoyed with the level of excellence people are striving for. I can't seem to find a band where the unacceptable isnt allowed onstage. Thanks for letting me vent!

There's times, when Im fed up with the whole "band" thing in general. Not only is no one prepared or seem to take anything seriously or put any effort into it.....its a TON of work and time, just to make $50 or something. I love to play and interact with other musician in a live setting, but at times really wish there was a way to do that regularly without the overhead and time/money sink that a band can be..

 

[JRA]

get the band out working and you'll have your pick of good players

OP: good luck with your 'levels of toleration'!

 

[40Hz]

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Yep! Like the Sharry Bobbins episode said:

 

[MultiScaleMale]

Times are definitely "Different". Back in the day I didn't base my level of commitment on a pay scale. When I was a member of a band I fulfilled my Responsibilities.
I can't see how you could be too busy to be responsible for $200 but not too busy for $500. You either have other commitments on your plate or you do not. Comes down to having a Bad Attitude or not...

I’m saying that if you’re paying more, you’ll get better people not that those people will magically become better. And this isn’t anything new. Back in any day, basic economics held.

 

[redwingxix]

Agree with just about everything said but are the other bandmates given enough time to practice it on their own? Sometimes the day before practice I'll get a couple new songs on our group text to work on. Well, if I get to work at 7:00am, get the message during the day on monday, work get home from work at 9:00pm, then practice is the next day right after work, then yes I haven't practiced them at all on my own and we will stumble through them that first time. But other than that, yeah, you to respect your bandmates time.

 

[PimasterPearson]

You could be describing the church I used to play in. One time our band leader (singer, non-musician, not that there's anything wrong with that) suggested a song for us to learn only a couple of days before our weekly rehearsal, and it was in 11/8 time. I told them it would be really tricky for all of the musicians, and that odd time signatures are not a good idea when you want 200 churchgoers to be able to sing along. They asked if we could "just do it simpler." I said sure, if you want to change the vocal rhythm. They responded "Can't you play it in normal time signature but in a way where we can sing it the original way?"

I mean, come on.

 

[bassliner50]

Sounds like your "local music scene" is devoid of real musicians. Unfortunately, this is common. You will eventually want to re network with pro's. Until then, do the best you can. It is a learning experience.

 

[baileyboy]

...At which point, I attempt to explain to them what they are doing wrong.

You might as well ram your head into concrete.

 

[Razman]

Dock their pay if they show up unprepared. James Brown fined his musicians $5 or $10 per mistake during rehearsal, up to $150 for a mistake during live performance.

I have heard this - and it's become an inside joke between myself and my musician buddies in my church. When I'm playing and I make a mistake, my best friend and sound guy would point at me and indicate the count of mistakes by the number of fingers (1, 2, etc.) and I did it to him also. It's all in fun.

 

[bkbirge]

You are in Maui, I'm not surprised that's the general attitude you run into. Pau Hana! I loved Maui when I lived there, the people, the culture, etc. But the driven urge to excel and rigid disciplined focus are not traits I'd associate with the islands. Still, I met some fabulous players there, also met a lot of what the OP describes.

 

[buldog5151bass]

I have heard this - and it's become an inside joke between myself and my musician buddies in my church. When I'm playing and I make a mistake, my best friend and sound guy would point at me and indicate the count of mistakes by the number of fingers (1, 2, etc.) and I did it to him also. It's all in fun.

I once played in a band that had a #$_#-up jar on stage. You mess up, you throw in a quarter

 

[bassplayer2014]

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And it's getting worse.

 

[EdO.]

I wouldn't dare to show up unprepared to a rehearsal , same as I wouldn't show up unprepared to a meeting at work. Not only it's disrespectful for others but mainly for me.

So many "musicians" don't get the fact that as much as anything a band is also a BUSINESS. If you're not taking a business like approach to not only the business side of it but to the musical side as well (as you would/should at whatever you do to make a living) IMO you have no business calling yourself a "pro". I understand that not everyone want to get that serious about it - that's fine. But don't expect that if you're unable/unwilling to provide it yourself.

I also get annoyed when someone doesn't take the time to learn the material. I dont appreciate Bad and/or Lazy Attitudes. However, I see nothing wrong with helping someone with a section they may be playing wrong or having difficulties with.
If you are truly a "Band", a "Team", then you should be willing to help a fellow member just as quickly as you would berait them...

Agreed. Entirely different thing from just being too damn lazy to do your homework pre rehearsal.

Times are definitely "Different". Back in the day I didn't base my level of commitment on a pay scale. When I was a member of a band I fulfilled my Responsibilities.

Amen. You're either committed to doing it the best you're able or you're not. You can't expect others to conduct themselves like pros if you're not being a pro yourself.

 

[chaak]

I'm with you. our singer never shows up prepared to our songwriting sessions and when we ask him to prepare in advance and come up with vocal lines and melodies he says don't worry I ll do it on the spot and he always waste our time by not hitting the notes and by singing every single song we have so far in the say manner. Last time we gave him an ultimatum let us see what s going to happen now.

 

[lfmn16]

And it's getting worse.

The only positive to this is that for those of us that adhere to high standards, it makes it easier for us to find work.