Bass Players are Their Own Worst Enemy!

[Deleted member 165050]

I disagree, from my experience.
mostly just groan when I a guitar player with tons of shyte shows up, same with a drummer .
I'm not playing rock music though.

Same here... if I see 4x12s being wheeled onto a small stage or dozens of cases containing the world's largest drum kit covering the area I want to set up in I am not impressed. Less is more.

 

[jmattbassplaya]

Well I actually double dare anybody on this forum to show me a class d amp that is as rich in tone and has a "tone fullness" such of a fender bassman/superbassman or an old 1970's svt or v4b.

Because anything I try along these amps just completely pales in comparison. No contest whatsoever.

Might be a controversial statement for some of you but I have gigged and played through a lot of amps to be able to share my own experience.

For deep thinkers: I just say that the slower response of these amps coupled with the tube harmonics and all the magic that happens in those preamps is basically unbeateable.

Just last night I was at a concert where a bass player used his v4b from the 70's and his 8x10 blueline fridge. Sound was epic af. Then, the next band came and was using an ashdown solid state stack and the tone was thin in comparison. No roundness, stiffer, lacked that nice tube low end extention...

Same sound technician though.

Mesa D800. The low mids in that head do very, very good things.

 

[Deleted member 165050]

Well I actually double dare anybody on this forum to show me a class d amp that is as rich in tone and has a "tone fullness" such of a fender bassman/superbassman or an old 1970's svt or v4b.

Because anything I try along these amps just completely pales in comparison. No contest whatsoever.

Might be a controversial statement for some of you but I have gigged and played through a lot of amps to be able to share my own experience.

For deep thinkers: I just say that the slower response of these amps coupled with the tube harmonics and all the magic that happens in those preamps is basically unbeateable.

Vacuum tubes are actually faster switching than solid state devices. Or so I've read

 

[BOOG]

The rig I have now is better than the big heavy stuff. My 14 lb Crest Prolite 3.0 power amp, 3 lb Art preamp, and 62 lb 12/12/6/1 fEARful blows away anything in every way, that I have ever used, including an SVT, a Sunn 2000s, an Acoustic 301 + Marshall major tube head, Epifani 610 + M9 Carbine, etc.

I am almost 69, but I'm no weakling and not frail. Nonetheless, a load-in that I can manage by myself, that fits in my car WITH an upright bass, and reduces the number of trips I need to carry things saves my time, energy, and aggravation. I'm about the music, the girls (ok, grown-up women ;-), and the beer, not how big and heavy my gear is. Aloha!

off topic...Aloha! I lived in Kailua for a few years and miss it everyday like an old friend. The running and bike riding to Kailua beach was pure therapy.

 

[DrayMiles]

I'd play an SVT 8x10 all of the time if I could, but that is not practical currently. If I was doing a residency or a tour, then I would most likely be on a union stage. Unfortunately, people aren't as helpful as they used to be. With my herniated L4-L5, and Sciatica. I find lugging the upright and a 12" speaker a pain in the butt.
But for tone...

IMO...

Ampeg.

 

[mobdirt]

For the times they are a-changin'.

 

[FunkySpoo]

Thanks for letting me rant... I understand the jazz guys all play minimal gear. The wedding bands are doing it for the money. I get it. However... the legacy of old heavy tube driven sound... damn...

I also prefer vinyl, if that tells you anything...

Oh come on, if you were really serious about audio you'd know the real deal is wax cylinders. Not that Johnny come lately high tech flat vinyl junk

 

[InnerBass]

Bass players are their own worst enemy...


I've played keys in touring/weekend warrior bands for years. From experience, I know keyboard players are not usually the focal point. Case in point. I've been called to sub, and sit in with bands I've never even practiced with. "Just come and play the gig". I have a few friends that have "made it" in the keyboard world. Three guys in particular that are all playing stadiums, festivals and auditoriums around the world. They are all varying degrees of very successful at what they do. All three of them have joined me at some point on stage to no fanfare. Absolutely no one knew or cared who they were...

With that said... I've always... almost always carried heavy equipment. I'm not talking SVT 810 heavy. I'm talking 300lb Hammond Organ, 300lb Yamaha CP70, 150lb Fender Rhodes plus synths and amps heavy... All of these moved into and out of the venue with the help of hand-trucks, dollies, and bandmates. I've never had a problem. I've never been left behind. I've never gotten complaints that my rig was too big/heavy. It was all for the love of the craft. I've volunteered to bring lighter newer boards... Time and time again everyone wants to see and hear the older heavy keys. And... for those of you that complain about space in your CAR... I even had to buy my own trailer.

Five years ago I decided to take bass playing seriously. I really didn't know what I was getting into. I didn't know if I would be good. I didn't have the deep love for the pocket that I have now. I didn't have the relationship with drummers I have now. But... I f'n love it. I love playing bass, I love the rhythm section. The whole damn thing is magical.

Just like any other instrument... Bass can make or break a song, which brings me to my point.

Until I started perusing TalkBass, I had no idea bass players were so worried about weight. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever played with a bass player worried about weight. Maybe this is a relatively new thing?

Think about this... Guitar players roll out all the mighty tube driven gear they can afford. No one complains. The more drums the drummer has the happier everyone is. The keyboard player shows up with a B3, everyone cheers. The bass player has to shop for class D amps and neo cabinets??? to save their back??? ***???

Why are you, as bass players giving up your SVT's? Why aren't you getting help moving the fridge. I help everyone else move their rig, and they help me with mine. Why does the sacrifice fall on the bass player? Why not have a class D Leslie, or a class D Twin Reverb... Stop with the BS. Gig your 100lb head with your 150lb cab. Hold your ground. For the love of everything that is great about rock and roll, Save The Bass!

Doing what I can.
Heavy duty casters are my best friend.

 

[swarfrat]

Them lines... do not mark a loading zone.

 

[SteveHeissner]

In my situation, less weight saves time during load-in and load-out. When I've been up since 5:00 AM and it's now 2:00 AM and we just finished playing 3 sets and still have 100 miles to drive home, saving time is important. And my newer light weight rigs sound as good or better than anything I used in the past.

 

[HolmeBass]

I play rock plus some reggae, ska, and funk. I will state without equivocation that I am not happy to hear any of the following:
- the drummer is bringing "more drums". Huge kick drums and 5 toms is a drag. Chinaboy cymbals are a major drag.
- I want the guitarist playing the smallest amp possible. I am not happy when someone shows up with a Fender Twin, let alone a half-stack or a whole stack.
- I am especially not happy when the keyboardist brings his Hammond and Leslie. While it sounds good, it was hard to move, mic, and ended up being too quiet anyway.

I use the smallest rig I can get away with. It's about the playing, not the amplification.

 

[brianrost]

I regularly play in really tiny venues...like fitting a 4 piece band with drums in a 8x8 ft space...no room for anything large. Even bringing my DB is a problem in some of those rooms.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[chadds]

A Twin with SROs is the weight of a dwarf star. It looks smallish until you actually go to pick it up.

I was a 125lb bass waif moving B3s Leslies, Sunn 2000s & SVT heads & cabs in high school. I can easily handle today's stuff.

I agree with the OP. Yet I see a balance. The complaints have made for tech to give us lighter gear. However I do stay fit so I carry what sounds right for the gig. Unless I had to take the subway I choose sound over portability.

I won't scrimp on quality. I won't stand there gigging wishing I'd cleaned the appropriate clothes for the gig. I won't stand there gigging wishing my rig was better. I won't stand there gigging wishing I'd practiced more.
YMMV and to each his own.

 

[Kro]

It's about the playing, not the amplification.

+1

Is it at all weird that the only people in your band concerned about FOH reinforcement is you and the kick drum?

If that was directed towards me, I assure you that's not the case - nor is it for anybody playing typical music venues. Just out of curiosity what does your average gig look like that this is your assessment of what FOH is for?

 

[socialleper]

Bass players are their own worst enemy...


I've played keys in touring/weekend warrior bands for years. From experience, I know keyboard players are not usually the focal point. Case in point. I've been called to sub, and sit in with bands I've never even practiced with. "Just come and play the gig". I have a few friends that have "made it" in the keyboard world. Three guys in particular that are all playing stadiums, festivals and auditoriums around the world. They are all varying degrees of very successful at what they do. All three of them have joined me at some point on stage to no fanfare. Absolutely no one knew or cared who they were...

With that said... I've always... almost always carried heavy equipment. I'm not talking SVT 810 heavy. I'm talking 300lb Hammond Organ, 300lb Yamaha CP70, 150lb Fender Rhodes plus synths and amps heavy... All of these moved into and out of the venue with the help of hand-trucks, dollies, and bandmates. I've never had a problem. I've never been left behind. I've never gotten complaints that my rig was too big/heavy. It was all for the love of the craft. I've volunteered to bring lighter newer boards... Time and time again everyone wants to see and hear the older heavy keys. And... for those of you that complain about space in your CAR... I even had to buy my own trailer.

Five years ago I decided to take bass playing seriously. I really didn't know what I was getting into. I didn't know if I would be good. I didn't have the deep love for the pocket that I have now. I didn't have the relationship with drummers I have now. But... I f'n love it. I love playing bass, I love the rhythm section. The whole damn thing is magical.

Just like any other instrument... Bass can make or break a song, which brings me to my point.

Until I started perusing TalkBass, I had no idea bass players were so worried about weight. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever played with a bass player worried about weight. Maybe this is a relatively new thing?

Think about this... Guitar players roll out all the mighty tube driven gear they can afford. No one complains. The more drums the drummer has the happier everyone is. The keyboard player shows up with a B3, everyone cheers. The bass player has to shop for class D amps and neo cabinets??? to save their back??? ***???

Why are you, as bass players giving up your SVT's? Why aren't you getting help moving the fridge. I help everyone else move their rig, and they help me with mine. Why does the sacrifice fall on the bass player? Why not have a class D Leslie, or a class D Twin Reverb... Stop with the BS. Gig your 100lb head with your 150lb cab. Hold your ground. For the love of everything that is great about rock and roll, Save The Bass!

I think bass players are their own worst enemy, but not because of gear weight or size. The prevailing culture here is that bass players should be subservient lap dogs that don't innovate or take leadership roles. I have a problem with that.
To the OP's topic, having evolved gear that you can move quickly and efficiently is an advantage, not a problem. Guitarists can be dummies sometimes that are slaves to 60 year old designs. Drummers have the worst possible job in a band because of all the stuff and time it takes to set up. I can fit my entire rig in a Focus hatchback, with the seats up. I can wear my amp around my neck. That little equipment will compete against two Marshall stacks and a heavy drummer.
Gear is the one place where bass players have it better than anyone else. Let the past of weighty, cumbersome, clumsy gear die.

 

[Amano]

Doing what I can.
Heavy duty casters are my best friend.


View attachment 3018612
View attachment 3018618

This is what I prefer to avoid. But I admire persistence and creativity. Nice jazz bass btw.

 

[fhm555]

I learned long ago there is no upside to hauling a rig out of some gut bucket at 4 AM that's too big for me to load on my own and not have any help to get it in my vehicle. Granted, when i was able it was 215 cabs, often 2 215 cabs if that's what i needed to be heard, and big heads. Back then even SS heads had bigass transformers so weight was never a consideration. Fast forward a few years and i'm beginning to think i may have some grit left in me after being crushed just below the wedding tackle to just above the knee. I was still able to walk without extra equipment but it looked pretty funny and my days of wrangling big bulky boxes single handed at 4 AM were long past. These days i've got a couple of 12/6 cabinets and a 500w head that will run one or both with ease and they are of a size that even i can get them in and out of vehicles/venues on my own if needed. It's not a matter of anything but physical limitations imposed by fate. I help others where i can but it's milk crates full of cables and smaller stuff like that. I can give you a hand with a lift up and into a door, but i cannot help lift and walk your bigass rig up on stage, so i certainly can't do mine. I don't ever pack with the anticipation someone else will do my load in/out for me. I'm always happy when someone wants to grab my bag or bass but even with both cabs i'm still just a two tripper solo and done. Oddly enough, even with a couple of funky pegs, the weight of my bass still remains a non issue so there is that.

 

[10cc]

The rig I have now is better than the big heavy stuff. My 14 lb Crest Prolite 3.0 power amp, 3 lb Art preamp, and 62 lb 12/12/6/1 fEARful blows away anything in every way, that I have ever used, including an SVT, a Sunn 2000s, an Acoustic 301 + Marshall major tube head, Epifani 610 + M9 Carbine, etc.

I am almost 69, but I'm no weakling and not frail. Nonetheless, a load-in that I can manage by myself, that fits in my car WITH an upright bass, and reduces the number of trips I need to carry things saves my time, energy, and aggravation. I'm about the music, the girls (ok, grown-up women ;-), and the beer, not how big and heavy my gear is. Aloha!

Thank you.

 

[Worldeeeter]

Bass players are their own worst enemies, but for a different reason...this:

 

[4dog]

I thought Geddy just goes direct. The "washing machines" on stage are visual subsitutes for Amps.

He does go direct ...but first through the lightweight rbi if im not mistaken,,,so if Ged can do it so can you...lol