Rickett Customs
Commercial User
Koch and Hiscock. Truth is: No shop, no tools, the last of your problems is fretwire.
Work on the design...... stay focused, don't go to page 3 without a design
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Before my first build
- Thread starter daerek
- Start date
Koch and Hiscock. Truth is: No shop, no tools, the last of your problems is fretwire.
Work on the design...... stay focused, don't go to page 3 without a design
- Aug 25, 2007
- 835
- 6
- Disclosures
- I manufacture for several companies including but not limited to: Bridge City Sound, Catalinbread, more.
A small strip of copper foil underneath the bridge pieces works best for this, if you choose to ground to the bridge. If you search the forum for star grounding, you will find some awesome resources in the posts that will really help with grounding.
Page four now, actuallyKoch and Hiscock. Truth is: No shop, no tools, the last of your problems is fretwire.
Work on the design...... stay focused, don't go to page 3 without a design
And I'm working on a design, I think I've even come up with a shape I like.
A question: You would rather I not care about fretwire before I have read those books and gotten a workshop? I would end up asking about it anyway, what's wrong with being a bit early with the questions? If I ask now, I'll have the answers when I need them, so I won't have to wait for answers when I'm about to start fretting. Doesn't that make sense?
I don't know Mike..... He doesn't even have the plans or material for the train yet!!! At the risk of being blunt, I think he's being influenced by the same or similar influences that influenced allot of us folks back in the 60's.... far out man... but you never know, this might be the show of the century!!! lol
tjm
Guys, don't worry, I think there's a high chance I might actually end up with something at least somewhat playable. I already said I'm a persistent perfectionist, right?I don't know Mike..... He doesn't even have the plans or material for the train yet!!! At the risk of being blunt, I think he's being influenced by the same or similar influences that influenced allot of us folks back in the 60's.... far out man... but you never know, this might be the show of the century!!! lol
tjm
And even if this train does wreck, at least I'll know what I'll need to improve next time!
- Apr 18, 2008
- 16,006
- 1
- 31,700
- Disclosures
- I'm highly opinionated and extremely self-assured
mikeyswood
Inactive
Within the first 156 pages is a discussion on the truss rods that the experienced builders around here use including a tutorial on how to make your own. Did you not see it?
OK but I'll give you my opinion anyway. I'm a fan of the Martin style truss rod. I would suggest going with two truss rods on a 7 string.
jworrellbass
Commercial User
- May 17, 2009
- 1,271
- 11
- 62
- Disclosures
- Owner, builder: jworrellbass
The TR's I use are the one's on the link I provided on a earlier post, They are the same ones that Best Bass Gear, Grizzley and a few others sell, these are just a little lower on the cost. I would use 2 TR's and a cf rod as well.
IMHO that's all.
I like the LMI dual action truss rods, although I plan on trying the grizzly dual action on my next builds. With a fan fret setup the tension is actually much more even than you would think. I've only ever used 1 rod with no CF on my 6 string fan builds. But with that said I used very strong woods for my neck thru construction. Also another thing to consider, my 8 string Warrguitar only ever had 1 truss rod.
As far as fretwire goes, that all depends on the feel you are going for, no one can tell you that, it's completely a personal preference. I like large wire myself, I might consider stainless someday.
Oh and one more thing, no matter how much pre-planning you do, there will always be unexpected things that happen and will completely change your plans. As I said before improvisation is the #1 ingredient for me. You say you are a self proclaimed perfectionist, that would be a hard trait to deal with I would imagine.
And one last thing to think about, there is a great Zappa quote he said about talking about music that could easily apply to building. "Talking about Music, is like Fishing about Architecture".
I've learned much more in my life by doing rather than by reading, sorry to say.
Best of luck.
That's my 2 cents,
Dirk
As far as fretwire goes, that all depends on the feel you are going for, no one can tell you that, it's completely a personal preference. I like large wire myself, I might consider stainless someday.
Oh and one more thing, no matter how much pre-planning you do, there will always be unexpected things that happen and will completely change your plans. As I said before improvisation is the #1 ingredient for me. You say you are a self proclaimed perfectionist, that would be a hard trait to deal with I would imagine.
And one last thing to think about, there is a great Zappa quote he said about talking about music that could easily apply to building. "Talking about Music, is like Fishing about Architecture".
I've learned much more in my life by doing rather than by reading, sorry to say.
Best of luck.
That's my 2 cents,
Dirk
The LMIs are significantly more expensive than [This invalid link has been removed], are they also significantly better?
Ok, I'll go with one rod. The strings I think I'll be getting (Circle K) will be specially put together for tension as even as possible with my scale lengths.
Then, what is the most usual?
It certainly gives me problems.
That actually kinda made sense!And one last thing to think about, there is a great Zappa quote he said about talking about music that could easily apply to building. "Talking about Music, is like Fishing about Architecture".
Of course, but if I have no idea how to do it, I would have to reinvent the wheel.
mikeyswood
Inactive
I know the shape I want now.
I do, however, feel that you consistently criticize my planned build and this thread. You have also, directly and indirectly, stated that you expect me to fail. Even if you disapprove of what I want to do, or what I ask and reply, I would prefer if you don't post unless you have something constructive to say. I am in no way against constructive criticism, but I can find nothing constructive in your comments. If I am missing something, would you care to enlighten me?
Sorry if this seems a little harsh, but I have let it go quite a few times already.
Your first post in this thread, clearly stating that you don't think my first build will be great, or even good - that's OK, I don't expect my first build to be great either. But you should have stopped there. From this post alone, I understand that you disapprove of my spec choices for my first build.
Insinuating I won't be able to do what I have planned. I interpret the "good luck" comment as sarcastic, correct me if I'm wrong.
You link to a build thread with rather advanced specs that died, insinuating that either my build will fail or I will abandon it.
This time quite obviously insinuating that my build will end up as a wreck.
And regarding the multiple insinuations that I have not actually read 156 pages of threads: I have not read every single thread. I have picked out threads that concerned neck-throughs, fanned-frets and ERBs, and a few others. And besides, I do not have photographic memory. I do not remember every thread I have read, and every topic I passed by.
You also seem to insinuate that number of pages in a thread should indicate progress; it does not. Rather, it indicates the number of questions and replies. If I did not have any questions, the first post would have been filled with wood and sawdust and progress instead.
---
If there is something essential regarding bass guitar building that I am missing, would someone please enlighten me, rather than trying to make me feel bad and abandon the project entirely? Or, if there is some other reason why you're trying to discourage me that has not already been clearly stated, I would really like to know.
---
Sorry about the long post, I just think this has gone on for long enough. Someone less stubborn than I would probably have been discouraged and abandoned the idea of ever building an instrument long ago. And, our opinions may differ, I think that instrument building should be encouraged, not discouraged.
jworrellbass
Commercial User
- May 17, 2009
- 1,271
- 11
- 62
- Disclosures
- Owner, builder: jworrellbass
Hey Kid... if you are a kid.... why do you do all your research publicly? Are you looking for attention? Your in the tenth grade? Man, you gotta be driving your parents or guardians crazy... you got an answer for everything... have some mercy...
"instrument building should be encouraged, not discouraged"
The key words here are instrument building... making sawdust, cutting you finger, spilling paint, gluing your fingers together and even getting a sense of accomplishment IF the results are satisfactory. You can talk about swimming all day long, but sooner or later you gotta jump in the water.... or make some sawdust.... dig?
Your actions are very predictable... allot of us folks including myself have been down that road. Dude, your just another guy who is gonna slay the world...... I agree with Mickeyswood and would be astonished if you kept this train on the tracks. But in the meantime, your putting on quite the show!! Play on!!! Popcorn anybody?
peace
tjm
Because, if I ask questions in public, anyone can answer, thus increasing the chance of me actually getting useful answers.
What I mean is, if I wasn't 100% set on doing this, mikeyswood's comments would have put me off from ever starting the actual build, thus discouraging instrument building. And I have already said several times why I am not already making sawdust.
The heavy emphasis on the 'if' gives me the impression you think the results won't be satisfactory.
I never said I was going to build the best seven string bass ever. I am going to build a playable bass for my own use. And I do have a tendency to not give up.
---
You're trying to make me angry? Good luck, you'll need it. I'm not stupid, or quick to anger. I already mentioned that I'm stubborn, and I have decided to remain calm. You won't be able to change that.
---
Oh, by the way - I started this thread to ask some questions and hopefully get answers, not to exchange insults. I would appreciate greatly if this thread was brought back on topic.
I wonder if this qualifies as a bonafide jeeze.... by a 10th grader.... man I should get special status for this.
Rickett Customs
Commercial User
Daerek,
You gotta realize, most of us are grown folks with shops (of some kind) and tools, that have at least the minimum of 5 or more instruments under our belts, what we are accustomed to seeing, are people that at least come with a bit more planning than just question after question, after more than 2 pages. If you're dead set on building this, by all means.. Hang around the LC and see how it's done, but when you get a thread like this rolling, you've gotta realize there are alot of us here who have been around for a year or more......we've seen threads like this go nowhere.
I'm not talking down at you, but take into consideration where others point of view come from who have hung around awhile, it get's old.
Hang out for awhile, you'll see it for yourself and along the way you will also find that Mikey is very blunt and to the point. TJmdetriot, although we didn't quite start off well, I believe we know where each other is coming from.
I implore you, hang out awhile and you'll see how it really is.
Jeeze............
Answers have been given.
You gotta realize, most of us are grown folks with shops (of some kind) and tools, that have at least the minimum of 5 or more instruments under our belts, what we are accustomed to seeing, are people that at least come with a bit more planning than just question after question, after more than 2 pages. If you're dead set on building this, by all means.. Hang around the LC and see how it's done, but when you get a thread like this rolling, you've gotta realize there are alot of us here who have been around for a year or more......we've seen threads like this go nowhere.
I'm not talking down at you, but take into consideration where others point of view come from who have hung around awhile, it get's old.
Hang out for awhile, you'll see it for yourself and along the way you will also find that Mikey is very blunt and to the point. TJmdetriot, although we didn't quite start off well, I believe we know where each other is coming from.
I implore you, hang out awhile and you'll see how it really is.
Jeeze............
Answers have been given.
Daerek,
I am going to throw my 2 cents in here. Everybody was trying to keep you from setting yourself up for failure. Maybe you are persistent. Maybe you are a perfectionist. Your character traits will help you in your endeavor. However, you need to do some of the basic things before you jump on a task such as this. I have not even completed my first build yet and I have been building and repairing string instrument bows for 10 years.
I decided in May that I would like to build an instrument. I logged onto the luthier's corner read some threads and asked some basic questions. I also started looking for some parts that I could get relatively inexpensively. My original intent was to build an instrument out of Home Depot wood. Mikeyswood discouraged me from doing that and recommended searching through lumber yards to get better wood for less or the same money. So, I collected a nice slab of poplar for my build. I also took the time to read the books that everyone is recommending to you...and then I started reading them again.
Let me say this, I have a workshop, but it was not ready to build an instrument. It was very compact (8x8) and only had a bench for bow work. So, I realized that I needed to build up some space for future equipment purchases. And, create a workbench. These are some of your first steps.
Another thing I did just recently this past weekend was mill that poplar into usable wood for a project. But, before I could do that I needed to replace the blades on my planer (you can search the shop injuries thread to read about my delay). Before I even thought about strings or truss rods, I bought a bridge. It was my belief that I would be able to use this and have to create an instrument on PAPER. However, my first PAPER instrument was a neck created on fret find and a piece of 8.5x11 paper, to see how things laid out. I did this while referring to the aforementioned books. Another thing I did was get some cheap 1x4 and practice laminating. AGAIN, not starting an instrument.
At this point, I have been hanging back in the Luthier's Corner reading posts from our experienced builders (Rickett, Mikeyswood, JWorrel, Musiclogic, LedBelli, etc.). I have been asking questions about their builds, not asking questions about a build that I have not started and certainly not asking questions about finishing items such as grounding bridges, string to use, etc. I also went to search out some Wilsers (another fine TB builder) YouTube videos to see how he is doing things. These guys are here to help. But, they will only help if you do not waste their time. They will only help when they see that you have put the time in reading their threads and tutorials. They will only help when you can ask questions about your build in a progression that makes sense. And, I am sorry to say the number of truss rods should not be a concern, until you have a design, purchased some wood and created a template or two. And even before that it is HIGHLY recommended that you practice since you have ZERO woodworking experience. Woodworking tools are dangerous. But, they are only dangerous when a person does not know how to use them. To the best of my knowledge a router has NEVER jumped out of its box and attacked someone. If you know where I am paraphrasing that statement from, then you may have started doing one of the things that has been recommended.
We DO NOT want to see you fail. But, trust me you are setting yourself up for failure and you are not taking the steps to build this instrument in a methodical approach. When you started riding a bike did you jump on an $8K carbon fiber road bike and starting riding centuries (look it up) or did you have training wheels, and then have your dad or mom hold on and let you go until you could balance on your own. These guys are here to do the same. They will help. But, only when the build you are attempting has some structure and when you can at least ride with training wheels.
I am going to throw my 2 cents in here. Everybody was trying to keep you from setting yourself up for failure. Maybe you are persistent. Maybe you are a perfectionist. Your character traits will help you in your endeavor. However, you need to do some of the basic things before you jump on a task such as this. I have not even completed my first build yet and I have been building and repairing string instrument bows for 10 years.
I decided in May that I would like to build an instrument. I logged onto the luthier's corner read some threads and asked some basic questions. I also started looking for some parts that I could get relatively inexpensively. My original intent was to build an instrument out of Home Depot wood. Mikeyswood discouraged me from doing that and recommended searching through lumber yards to get better wood for less or the same money. So, I collected a nice slab of poplar for my build. I also took the time to read the books that everyone is recommending to you...and then I started reading them again.
Let me say this, I have a workshop, but it was not ready to build an instrument. It was very compact (8x8) and only had a bench for bow work. So, I realized that I needed to build up some space for future equipment purchases. And, create a workbench. These are some of your first steps.
Another thing I did just recently this past weekend was mill that poplar into usable wood for a project. But, before I could do that I needed to replace the blades on my planer (you can search the shop injuries thread to read about my delay). Before I even thought about strings or truss rods, I bought a bridge. It was my belief that I would be able to use this and have to create an instrument on PAPER. However, my first PAPER instrument was a neck created on fret find and a piece of 8.5x11 paper, to see how things laid out. I did this while referring to the aforementioned books. Another thing I did was get some cheap 1x4 and practice laminating. AGAIN, not starting an instrument.
At this point, I have been hanging back in the Luthier's Corner reading posts from our experienced builders (Rickett, Mikeyswood, JWorrel, Musiclogic, LedBelli, etc.). I have been asking questions about their builds, not asking questions about a build that I have not started and certainly not asking questions about finishing items such as grounding bridges, string to use, etc. I also went to search out some Wilsers (another fine TB builder) YouTube videos to see how he is doing things. These guys are here to help. But, they will only help if you do not waste their time. They will only help when they see that you have put the time in reading their threads and tutorials. They will only help when you can ask questions about your build in a progression that makes sense. And, I am sorry to say the number of truss rods should not be a concern, until you have a design, purchased some wood and created a template or two. And even before that it is HIGHLY recommended that you practice since you have ZERO woodworking experience. Woodworking tools are dangerous. But, they are only dangerous when a person does not know how to use them. To the best of my knowledge a router has NEVER jumped out of its box and attacked someone. If you know where I am paraphrasing that statement from, then you may have started doing one of the things that has been recommended.
We DO NOT want to see you fail. But, trust me you are setting yourself up for failure and you are not taking the steps to build this instrument in a methodical approach. When you started riding a bike did you jump on an $8K carbon fiber road bike and starting riding centuries (look it up) or did you have training wheels, and then have your dad or mom hold on and let you go until you could balance on your own. These guys are here to do the same. They will help. But, only when the build you are attempting has some structure and when you can at least ride with training wheels.
