• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join freeLog in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Begantino HD VS CN- winner!!!

Apr 5, 2001
885
439
So I've been following the Bergantino threads with great interest- I've been gigging the HD 410 for a few years now- absolutely fantastic cab but the schlep has been killing me. Been looking for months to replace but couldn't decide- then came the threads about the new CN line- sounded PERFECT!! I have three gigs this weekend so this morning I jumped on-line and saw that Gelb Music (one hour away) had the new line- off I went to buy myself a CN 212.

So I get there and start off with the CN212- man, what a great sounding cabinet. I've never played Neos before though so I think to myself- right next to it is the HD410 which I am very familiar with- let's AB the two and see what's what and get a frame of reference. Should have never done that :( For my taste it was instantly apparent the major differences between the ceramic and neos, especially once I AB'd it to an HD212. The CN sounded great- very articulate, great low end although it came across a bit pillowy compared to the ceramics- for a lack of a better term the ceramics had a donkey punch to them that the CNs don't have (this particular cab has many hours of play on it- well broken in).

But- the reason I was there was to get something easy to move- I've got some impending hip surgeries on the horizon and 90lbs of HD 410 needs to stop. So I start playing the CN212 again- digging it but can't get the HD tone out of my head. Oh wait- what's that little bugger over there?? Oh, its an HD 112. Let's give it a whirl. And we have a winner. Times 2. I a/bd the HD112 vs the CN212 for a good half an hour- realized that one HD can handle about 30% of my gigs and am fairly sure that 2 of them stacked should handle all but the largest gigs (of which I can drag my 810 fridge).

I gotta tell ya- I went there to buy the CN line, and although I would rave about it on it's own, for my tonal preferences it doesn't stand up to the HD line. So I figure I split the difference- two smaller, easy to move boxes, and for my tonal goals a better match. I'll know more after the next few days of gigs- proof is always in the pudding. I'll report back if anyone is interested. I'll be using my Ampeg 7 Pro and Fender Jazz and P basses. No pedals. For reference my playing style is pocket player, 95% fingers, no effects- I play everything from Americana, old school country, blues, rock, reggae, swing, etc. I dig a thick, clean, warm tone- I drive my tubes a bit but don't go for total breakup. I play in three bands- an Americana/roots rock/country band with drums, electric guitar, lap steel, pedal steel, mandolin, and acoustic guitar plus three vox, and two party style pro cover bands covering everything from Sublime, to the Meters, The Stones, Greenday, Elvis, Johnny Cash, Merle Haggard etc....

Cheers-
 
  • Like
Reactions: svtb15
Going modular (a pair of 1x12's rather than a 2x12 cab) makes a WHOLE lotta sense for many reasons! And I'm with you on the ceramic versus neo. Yeah, yeah, I know.......I get the whole "gauss is gauss" thing........but IME, I have found that cabs loaded with ceramic drivers just seem to have a gut-pounding OOMPF that I just don't get from neo cabs. Others will have differing opinions for sure, and I say great...go with what you like. But for me, it's ceramics all the way (plus Motrin as needed!)
 
  • Like
Reactions: svtb15
I had a similar experience when I a/b'd the AE410 and the HS410, I walked away with the HS410!
I now run a HD212 which is a little heavy but is tonal nirvana, (as was the HS410) having bought several neo cabs and not enjoyed them (ae112, ae212,ml112, ae410) I am sticking with the HD212. I have a great cart so the only lift is in and out of the car, handle placement is great so it is not too difficult to move.
Jim' ceramic loaded cabs are to me the best sounding cabs I have ever played, there are many compromises and new pretenders to the throne, but none quite get there. All imho and ime of course! :cool:
 
I have a feeling I may arrive at the same conclusion when I eventually get out to Bass and Beyond and compare the HD112 with the CN112. I got rid of my dual HT210 (old silver face) last year due to financial provblems / unemployment, but now I'm rebuilding. I loved the tone of the HT210. Super clean tweeter, lots of low end for a 210, but they were big and heavy. The HD series is supposed to be closer to the old HT series in terms of tone. I'm going with a dual 112 rig for portability at this point. It's just so much easier with rehearsal to take a single 12 and have the dual 12 available for gigs, which is all I will ever really need for gigs.
 
Yeah, to my ear the neos sound "close". I'm not ready to compromise tone just yet. Played a gig last night with the two hd112s and went to sleep happy. What a great rig. Played a super weird room- three story open ceiling lobby art museum with three walls of glass and all concrete floors- no foh support. I walked out front and couldn't believe the bass sound- thick, articulate, and warm- my goals met. I easily could have used just one- may do so tonight
 
I don't post here very often but I love seeing all the Bergantino and ceramic speaker love! I've been running an HD212 for a little over a year and it's kept up with a super loud drummer and a dueling Marshall stacks at each side of the stage.

I'm playing more R&B and funk gigs now, and just loving this cab. Especially since I'm not competing with heinous amounts of gain and loud and bright (gross) cymbals. I can really hear the full spectrum and really dig it. All hail well designed ceramics.
 
It's the magic speaker gnomes Jim installs. :hiding:
A dual HD112 rig is exactly what I want to end up with eventually.

Yeah, to my ear the neos sound "close". I'm not ready to compromise tone just yet. Played a gig last night with the two hd112s and went to sleep happy. What a great rig. Played a super weird room- three story open ceiling lobby art museum with three walls of glass and all concrete floors- no foh support. I walked out front and couldn't believe the bass sound- thick, articulate, and warm- my goals met. I easily could have used just one- may do so tonight
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stu Rose
I have a feeling I may arrive at the same conclusion when I eventually get out to Bass and Beyond and compare the HD112 with the CN112. I got rid of my dual HT210 (old silver face) last year due to financial provblems / unemployment, but now I'm rebuilding. I loved the tone of the HT210. Super clean tweeter, lots of low end for a 210, but they were big and heavy. The HD series is supposed to be closer to the old HT series in terms of tone. I'm going with a dual 112 rig for portability at this point. It's just so much easier with rehearsal to take a single 12 and have the dual 12 available for gigs, which is all I will ever really need for gigs.

The two hd112s sound huge together- I couldn't even really push them last night- looking forward to it though. I just can't get over how thick and warm they are- and the thickness is true thickness- you can feel it all the way through the tone.
 
I have a feeling I may arrive at the same conclusion when I eventually get out to Bass and Beyond and compare the HD112 with the CN112. I got rid of my dual HT210 (old silver face) last year due to financial provblems / unemployment, but now I'm rebuilding. I loved the tone of the HT210. Super clean tweeter, lots of low end for a 210, but they were big and heavy. The HD series is supposed to be closer to the old HT series in terms of tone. I'm going with a dual 112 rig for portability at this point. It's just so much easier with rehearsal to take a single 12 and have the dual 12 available for gigs, which is all I will ever really need for gigs.

Another interesting thought- according to the bass guy at gelb music, two hd112s sound identical stacked to the hd212- however- stacking two cn112s doesn't sound identical to the cn212. I didn't hear it so I'm just passing along the music stores opinion- and honestly I trust his opinion- he's a player and the main buyer. To be honest I can afford the rig I want and I went in wanting one thing but trusted my ears and walked out with something different.
 
I will go into the store with an open mind for sure and I won't be limited by cash when it comes time to pull the trigger. I will walk out with whatever sounds best to me. I will probably go back a second time to be sure. Sometimes what sounds good to you one day, won't sound the same a few days later. I buy this way because I can be impulsive at times. I'm not loaded with cash so I want to make sure what I buy is what I need.

Another interesting thought- according to the bass guy at gelb music, two hd112s sound identical stacked to the hd212- however- stacking two cn112s doesn't sound identical to the cn212. I didn't hear it so I'm just passing along the music stores opinion- and honestly I trust his opinion- he's a player and the main buyer. To be honest I can afford the rig I want and I went in wanting one thing but trusted my ears and walked out with something different.
 
I love my Sadowsky SA410, but my AE210s are getting all the gigs lately.

A single AE210 is loud enough for medium bar gigs and 2 of them do everything but huge rooms. And they are light.

I am still seriously considering selling the Sadowsky and one of the AE210s and buying 2 Baer or Berg CN 112s to have even more lightweight options.

The CN212 looks great, but a little redundant with my current cabs.

I rehearse quite loudly with 2 guitarists and only use a single TC 112... the little single speaker cabs are not just for jazz duos in a coffee house anymore!
 
I will go into the store with an open mind for sure and I won't be limited by cash when it comes time to pull the trigger. I will walk out with whatever sounds best to me. I will probably go back a second time to be sure. Sometimes what sounds good to you one day, won't sound the same a few days later. I buy this way because I can be impulsive at times. I'm not loaded with cash so I want to make sure what I buy is what I need.

great attitude for sure. I've gotten sucked into the flavor of the month for sure- no more for me. Ears and personal trial is what I need. I'm sure the Baer stuff is super bad ass stuff- but if I can't play it I'm not gonna buy it- and listening to someone pontificate about it on-line isn't gonna help me a ton either. Just like my thoughts on the HD line- they're just my opinions based on my wants and needs, and MY ears. I totally disagree with a prominent member here on a handful of pieces of gear, and guess what- NEITHER of us are right or wrong- we clearly have different taste and apparently perception of sound.
 
I have a HT210 chrome face I'll never get rid of.

When you a/b 'd the cabs did you try tweeking the amp to compensate for the difference?

yeah, spent quite a bit of time with them. EQ isn't the issue- the natural baked in tone is. Like I said, the CN212 sounds big and full- but when you go back and forth (Gelb has them all set up on switches so you can AB instantly) there is a lack of kick to me. I don't sit back and compare this stuff all day, and don't have all the correct terminology like some guys do- to me it felt like the difference of playing a true signal VS a modeled signal. Again, I think the CN line sounds great and would probably cut it for me- but after hearing them back to back I couldn't compromise for my taste....
 
  • Like
Reactions: svtb15
I haven't tried the CN series, but chose to go ahead and pull the trigger on an HD212. I probably should have waited and done an A/B between them but didn't based on the HD/CN comparisons I read here on TB. Sounded like it would suit my style better. Tried the HD212 with my Mesa WA and it was tone heaven. Sure wouldn't mind the light weight of the CN, but am plenty happy with the HD