Begantino HD VS CN- winner!!!

[Virgil]

Another interesting thought- according to the bass guy at gelb music, two hd112s sound identical stacked to the hd212- however- stacking two cn112s doesn't sound identical to the cn212. I didn't hear it so I'm just passing along the music stores opinion- and honestly I trust his opinion- he's a player and the main buyer. To be honest I can afford the rig I want and I went in wanting one thing but trusted my ears and walked out with something different.

I A/B ed a C/N 212 against 2, CN 112's, and they do not sound alike. Bass and Beyond has a video comparing the two, and there you can hear the differernce. To my ears and many others, 2, 112's has more bottom, and more lower mid push than the 212. When I compared them at Bass Specialties, other players were around, and we all agreed that the 112's had more bottom. The CN 212 is more even across the frequency board. Though it cost more, I went with 2, 112's.

 

[Doug Parent]

I have a HT210 chrome face I'll never get rid of.

When you a/b 'd the cabs did you try tweeking the amp to compensate for the difference?

Still regretting selling my HT210 HT115 stack. WHAT AN IDIOT.

However, I picked up an Epifani T210, older NYC ceramic loaded cab and it just slays and I'm happy now.

 

[John D Harris]

I think an HD112 + HD210 stack would be excellent for a lot of musical styles.

 

[SvN]

FYI

I have just tried CN112 and HD112 for one hour, switching numerous times between the two.

Differences are quite subtle. I felt the CN112 was a bit more lower-mid than the HD, a bit less punchy, less hifi.

Although my GB ShuttleMax can take care of the differences, after a lot of hesitation due to the 7kg less of the CN, I decided to go for the HD.

If I had a Streamliner and looking for a warmer sound, might have gone for the CN. 7kg less is a big difference when you need to carry your cab often!

 

[slade]

yeah, for me- the HD 112 is so small and light I didn't let the additional weight savings sway my decision on the CN vs HD- just went with my ears. Would make the same choice again today. I have found the limit of these two cabs, but realistically they can pull about 85% of my gigs, and one can pull off a ton of them.

 

[sKyLiNe505]

I own an Aguilar gs 412 and looking into buying a berg hd 212 but undecided if I should buy two hd 112 cabs. Can anybody tell me if there's a big difference between the two set ups? Does the 212 has more bass? Or the two 112s sound deeper? Will use an Aguilar tone hammer 500

 

[jazztonebass]

I too, have concluded that the HD's are worth the extra heft. What I am still unsure of is choice between two HD 112's or two HD 210's. Either way, I like the modular approach. Can anyone testify about the differences between two 112's vs. two 210's? Inquiring minds want to know? Will push them with an older Eden WT800.

 

[KJung]

I too, have concluded that the HD's are worth the extra heft. What I am still unsure of is choice between two HD 112's or two HD 210's. Either way, I like the modular approach. Can anyone testify about the differences between two 112's vs. two 210's? Inquiring minds want to know? Will push them with an older Eden WT800.

The HD210's will have more low mid punch, less absolute low end extension and a little bit more brightness in the upper midrange. I used an HS210 (virtually identical to the newer HD210... a bit more relaxed up top) until the AE210V came out (which I preferred over the HD/HS 10's). The HD210 x 2 will have a somewhat similar tonality to the CN212, while putting out a bit more absolute volume and having a bit smoother upper midrange response (and of course, weighing double+).

If you like it smooth and open and big sounding, the HD112's are magnificent. If you want a bit more 'punch' and a higher ratio of midrange to deep lows, the HD210's are equally magnificent. If you want a bit more midrange articulation and 'clarity' with some/most of the punch of a traditional multi-10 cab, and/or weight is an issue, the CN212 is equally magnificent.

All fabulous in their own way. I would not be particularly happy myself with the HD112 cabs (not really my tone), but could happily play an HD210 x 2 stack. The point being, if you tried the HD12's and liked the more open, relaxed tonality better than the CN, then you should probably stick with the HD12's. The HD10's are quite a bit different, and closer to the CN tonality than the HD12 tonal profile (IME).

 

[slade]

I can't compare the HD112s to (2) HD210s, but I can compare them to (1) HD 410. My HD410 is my go to for my biggest gigs as it out performs my HD112s X2. If the store I purchased my HD112s from had 2 HD210s I would have gone that direction in a heartbeat. I don't feel that the 10s have less low end extension, quite the opposite actually, however that could be the 4 speakers in one box. In the HD line I personally don't think that (2) 112s can keep up with (1) 410. I would make the assumption that they couldn't keep up with (2) 210s either..... either way, the HD line is a donkey kickin' madman....

 

[John D Harris]

Or you could get you some of both: 1 HD112 + 1 HD210, but most people would probably recommend two of the same cab.

 

[ustabawannab]

I am so glad I found this thread. I'm on my way to Bass Club Chicago tomorrow to audition the NV115 and the HD&CN-212. I've read all Ken's reviews as well as others regarding the different Bergs and though I value his expertise, our tone goals are different. What I do appreciated about Ken's posts is he takes our different tastes into consideration when he reviews a cab.

Background - I have in the past owned a NV412, two AE 410s and a pair of HT112s

I now own a Mesa Prodigy and an un-modified M9 Carbine. I've been gigging with the M9 and an HS-410 and am happy with the tone for my 99% pick style playing classic to alternative style of rock. I also have a Vietnamese SVT 810e in our rehearsal space but rarely gig with it for obvious reasons. I absolutely love the SVT 810 quiet or loud running on either head. It is the sound in my head. The reason why I am heading down to the Bass Club is I just do not care for the Prodigy on the HS-410. The M9 works because I can cut 31.5 HZ 12db after the preamp but the 410 cab is just too subsonically boomy 10 to 15 feet away for my tastes on the Prodigy. Above 100Hz the HS-410 rocks. Full range on either head though, the SVT is the bomb.

I tried Jim's AE Neos but did not like the AE-410s on tube amps. They got farty on SVT Classics I've used in the past. I actually spoke with Jim about that. He told me that he found was the biggest difference between the Neos he used on the AE-410s and the Ceramics he used on the HS-410s was the strength of the magnetic field was more focused on the Neos. The strength seemed to change a little as the voice coil extended beyond a certain point. The ceramics appear to be more even throughout the stroke. I have no idea if that's resolved with the new CN line but I know personally that my HS-410 hits harder than any AE410 ever did. Didn't matter if its on power tubes or solid state.

I do not need a cabinet to boom through the room. I have FOH support. I want a tight punch that hits me hard in the chest up to but not exceed 10 to 15 feet, then melt away. It would also be nice if it weighed less than 88 pounds of my HS-410, 105 pounds of my old NV 412 or 120 pounds of my SVT-810e.

It may come down to the NV115 or the HD 212 or the CN 212. If I walk out with the HD212 only shaving 8 pounds or so, oh well. If the other cabs aren't that much different than the HS-410, I'll compromise and keep her. For the effort and hassle required to sell, pack and ship the HS 410, then spend another $300 to $600 for the new cab, the new cab's gotta blow me away.

 

[SanDiegoHarry]

I think if weight is your number one priority the CN wins hands down. Tone comes in line first for me, hence the two smaller ceramic boxes.

I'm wildly happy with the one CN 12 I have - I plan on getting a 2nd. I have been runing two Epifani 2x10 ceramic cabls for... 10+ years and while they sound great, they are HEAVY - and a touch more mid-scooped than I like. The Berg seems to sit in the mix better AND it's crazy light.

 

[Fuzzbass]

I A/B ed a C/N 212 against 2, CN 112's, and they do not sound alike. Bass and Beyond has a video comparing the two, and there you can hear the differernce. To my ears and many others, 2, 112's has more bottom, and more lower mid push than the 212. When I compared them at Bass Specialties, other players were around, and we all agreed that the 112's had more bottom. The CN 212 is more even across the frequency board. Though it cost more, I went with 2, 112's.

Interesting. I went with a pair of CN112 over a single CN212 because I have an upstairs gig where a single 12 is enough.

I had read that some prefer HD to CN for tone, but I already have heavy Berg cabs that I love: an NV610, and a pair of HS210s, which are still my go-to cabs for max tone and volume (either NV or HS, not all at once!) For my lightweight rig I wanted lightweight cabs (duh), so I never considered HD. I have genuinely enjoyed gigging one or two CN112 cabs (along with TH500). My ears like the heavy tens a little bit more, but my new mini-rig-of-doom sounds great too.

 

[Big String]

I just picked up a HD112 stack this week. Actually got the last one in stock at Bass Club Chicago and got the other shipped direct to me yesterday. Sorry ustabwannab I'm sure Jodie and Mark ordered more. I brought my Sadowsky Jazz and my GK MBF800 to test out the NV115, the CN's and HD's. I liked the NV115 quite well. Moved on to the HD212 and CN212 side by side. The shop isn't big but ample enough room to get a pretty good idea. So I let my ears decide. The HD212 has the "heft" and definition that I crave and; as many others have said; you can feel it. The CN212 is a great cab for sure and packs it's own wahollop of goodness. I switched cabs and settings a bunch of times and you can get in the 'ball park' of either cab with some tweaking. I'm not much of a knob twister and have some hearing loss so I'm no expert, but I do know what I like. In short I wanted the single cab but because of the weight I got the HD stack. Now, except for all but the really large gigs (which are few theses days) the stack will allow me to have a small rig and a medium/large rig. So far at home I like one of the tweeters completely off and the other cut at -2db.

Now, the perfect amp …. I like the GK MB-800 Fusion but I'm still thinking about some other amps with this kind of power but smoother. Still thinking about the Demeter VTBP800M.. hmmm. Its pricey and in that same "tone universe" as the GK, so dunno. Right now I'm sticking with the GK, still learning to love it.

 

[ustabawannab]

I just picked up a HD112 stack this week. Actually got the last one in stock at Bass Club Chicago and got the other shipped direct to me yesterday. Sorry ustabwannab I'm sure Jodie and Mark ordered more.

You so and so!!!

That's OK. I'm not thinking stacks unless I go with NV115s. The way Ken described the bass roll off on those that just might be what I'm looking for.

 

[Red Planet]

Interesting thread. I have a pair of the HT112ER's I purchased new fro ABG and I must say they are the freaking bomb. I ordered a set of AE112's originally but they just did not get my juices flowing.

I played a gig last weekend with 5 other bands all insanely loud. I could have used backline but this little rig is so easy to move. I used my prized Shuttle 9.0. I had FOH but no bass in the monitor though stage volume was very loud. I cranked the Shuttle and pummeled. As the old farts got down from the stage the young bass players were bowing down. The rig slammed very rudely and meant some serious business. I need to try my 400+ through the Bergs to see what it will do.

Most gigs I used just one cab and it gets the job done very well.

Thanks Jim!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[sKyLiNe505]

Can the HD212 keep up against an Aguilar gs412?

 

[John D Harris]

Maybe against a GS312...

 

[ustabawannab]

Just got back from Bass Club Chicago. The winner is .... CN-212!

The HD-212 had a little more bottom end but a small tweak of the bass knob on the Prodigy brought the CN-212 right inline. My HS410 is great but the the HD/CN-212 really does it for me. The weight of the CN-212 is a big deal. It's so easy to pick up and carry. That was the deciding factor. I have a few bills to pay but you'll probably see my HS-410 listed soon. Mark only has two CN212's left so I better act fast because new ones are on backorder.

As for the NV115. Ken's review was dead on. I think two in a stack would be nice but though I wasn't looking for deep bass, one NV-115 had so little. Kinda surprising. Nothing wrong with it, just not what I was looking for.