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Bergantino HDN212 vs. Mesa Subway 212

five7

five7

Ye Old Cat
Supporting Member
Dec 5, 2009
3,421
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colorado
#1
Have a chance to buy one of these. I have owned other berg cabs and other subway cabs. I owned the Darkglass 212 and enjoyed it. Wanting to pair with a mesa 800D. Playing rock, blues, country, reggae and pop. Not using iem's and sometimes need to carry the room. Also the berg is $300 cheaper.
 
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#2
You really cant go wrong with either of those. Both are amazing cabs, with the Mesa handling a bit more power, according to spec sheets. Both very close on weight, with the Berg being a couple pounds lighter.

Really a great problem to have when you've got access to both and have to choose. 👍

Edit to add: In my opinion, they're so close that I'd go with the less expensive Berg. I'm a big fan of both, but have been banging away on CN212s for over a decade. Currently using the WD800 with a D800 as a backup.
 
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#4
I own a Subway 212 and used to own a Berg NXT212 and also a Berg NV212T. Not exactly the comparison you're asking about but close. I don't know if the HDN212 uses the same hi-frequency driver as the NXT but I'm sure you could find out.

With the NXT212 there was an upper mid coloration that I always found to be unmusical, even with a variety of amps, and I could never seem to completely dial it out. That was a deal breaker for me so I moved it on. Other than that it was great - plenty loud enough for my needs, and it had more than sufficient bottom end. I own other Berg cabs and like them a lot, though. I loved the NV212T, but the weight became a problem for me.

I'd describe the Subway as more of a "rock" cabinet, to my ears. It is totally dependable, the weight is very manageable, it projects well and always seems to have more to give. It mates very well with the D800, too. In some jazzier contexts it doesn't quite get the sound I'm after, but that's not a problem as I have other cabs that work fine for that stuff.
 
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#6
five7 said:
Have a chance to buy one of these. I have owned other berg cabs and other subway cabs. I owned the Darkglass 212 and enjoyed it. Wanting to pair with a mesa 800D. Playing rock, blues, country, reggae and pop. Not using iem's and sometimes need to carry the room. Also the berg is $300 cheaper.
Click to expand...
What was your dislike with the Darkglass cab?

I run a DG212 with Berg and Tech21 heads and I’m extremely happy.
 
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#7
ad9000 said:
I own a Subway 212 and used to own a Berg NXT212 and also a Berg NV212T. Not exactly the comparison you're asking about but close. I don't know if the HDN212 uses the same hi-frequency driver as the NXT but I'm sure you could find out.

With the NXT212 there was an upper mid coloration that I always found to be unmusical, even with a variety of amps, and I could never seem to completely dial it out. That was a deal breaker for me so I moved it on. Other than that it was great - plenty loud enough for my needs, and it had more than sufficient bottom end. I own other Berg cabs and like them a lot, though. I loved the NV212T, but the weight became a problem for me.

I'd describe the Subway as more of a "rock" cabinet, to my ears. It is totally dependable, the weight is very manageable, it projects well and always seems to have more to give. It mates very well with the D800, too. In some jazzier contexts it doesn't quite get the sound I'm after, but that's not a problem as I have other cabs that work fine for that stuff.
Click to expand...
The HDN and NXT have completely different drivers and HF driver... it was a complete re-design with a different speaker manufacturer.

I had a 2x112 NXT rig, gig it probably a dozen times, and did not bond with it. I also moved on from the NXT, got a HDN212, loved it from the first gig - never looked back.

I've never played or even seen a Mesa 212 IRL.

IME, the HDN 212 is a fine cab.
 
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#10
Clark Westfield said:
Is the NXT $660 better sounding?

When I purchased my DG, that is what I contemplated.
Click to expand...
That is a chunk of change. It's important to contemplate what's right for you personally.

Berg 1,759 -- is the Berg $230 better than the Mesa
Mesa 1,529 - is the Mesa $240 better than the Aguilar
Aguilar 1,289 - is the Aggie $90 better than the Ampeg
Ampeg 1,199 - is the Ampeg $10 better than DG
DG 1,189 - is the DG $130 better than the Genzler
Genzler 1,059 - are any of those better than the Genzler?

Are any of those cabs better than the $800 used Berg CN212 on my local Craig's List?

Is a $1,100 used HDN212 $300 better than that CN212? ---- for me,,, Yes. I'd pay that extra $300 - that is, after owning and gigging both of those cabs for many years, respectively.

It's tough when you only have access to a limited number of cabs, that you may or may not be able to A/B. Many that you can't try at all. At a point, you are just taking a risk based on reputation, previous experience, or what dudes on TB and Redit tell you.
Lot's of different folks, with different budgets, different ears, different amps, different needs, different aesthetic preferences, etc...

Choice overload !!!!!!!!

Personally... I don't think I would ever pay sticker price and buy a new cab ever again.
 
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#11
Unfortunately, very true ^^^…price and voicing preference don’t necessarily correlate—nothing like being able to a/b cab’s with your own amp(s) and basses.

A couple things to add…

(1) if you can find posts with a similar (to your) cab description about a cab you’re familiar with—you might place more weight in what they’re saying about a potential different/unfamiliar cab.

(2) consider a cab’s size/weight specs, to help narrow down your list.

No experience with DG or Mesa cab’s, but I’ve owned (at length) both Berg HDN and NXT 12’s in the past…HDN’s had more bottom-end extension, and the NXT felt superbly robust (zero sense of “quit” when pushed really hard) and have more top-end coming off the woofer (without any tweeter assistance)…

Currently I enjoy Berg sealed ceramic NV 610T, 410T, 312T and Ampeg Heritage 810E. The Berg’s and Ampeg are voiced significantly different, but love both brand cab’s for different tone goals and amp’s—go figure. : )
 
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#14
This is very subjective, but I love Jim B's cabinets. Disclosure- I like many, "different" sounding cabs very certain applications. For instance, two of my favorite cabs are the Epifani 4x10 and the Genz Uber 4x10. The Epi sounds warm, "soft" and a bit compressed. The Genz Uber has clarity, punch and some growl to it when pushed. Bergs have their own thing too.
 
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#15
smeet said:
Thread derail: how do the 410T and 312T compare?
Click to expand...
No worries, I recently addressed this over in the main Berg thread:
kevk said:
To my ears, the 410T has the most immediate “in front of you” upper mid/top-end projection. The 312T is “bigger” sounding…more full and rich. It’s supremely balanced, top to bottom—cab sounds incredible at flat eq…just a gorgeously righteous cab tone!

I owned an NV412T for a short time (quite awhile ago though)… The 312T has its own thing going on…has the full low mid’s of the 412T, but a really nice, more inherently controlled bottom end.

410T—sound is immediate/in front of you
610T—more 3D sound field
312T—somewhere in between.

Worth repeating—312T is an absolute killer-balanced cab! I’m seriously loving it with either my Ultra or V4B.
Click to expand...
 
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