Berklee Questions:

[Mikey D]

Hi Janek, I'm just trying to find out a few answers to some easy questions, I've asked a few others but still not heard. You may be able to help, you may not. To put these questions into perspective, I am thinking of doing an audition as part of the world scholarship tour as I grow increasingly unhappy with my educational establishments view of electric bass within jazz and contemporary improvisation:

1. Is age an issue? i.e. I am 27, but have come to full-time education late in life. Do you know if they look for only young people for these scholarships? Or is sheer talent and potential what they look for?

2. What is the standard like of people that obtain the scholarships? Preferably on bass.

3. What would be some examples of audition pieces that would "impress" the panel? (I assume they've seen everything before, but what makes them think, "god, that bastard can really play bass!")

Any insight into this, or just berklee life in general would be great. As I am seriously considering it as an option as they seem to be one of the places that really appreciate what the electric bass is capable of going by previous alumni!

Cheers...(Anyone else feel free to give past experiences of the Berklee or the scholarship tour)

 

[Mark Wilson]

Mikey,

I have a friend at Berklee. he's there on a 15k scholarship a year, but that's piano.

I have heard that Berklee does hand out a lot of scholarships.

Now, I'm a student at Humber College. It's in Toronto and has a made a pretty big name for itself.

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I'm not trying to turn out away from Berklee, but I do encourage you to look into Humber. The classes are smaller, so more individual attention is given.

 

[user3653753]

well I was at berklee in quite a different time from now. I took the scholarship audition in 1997 in Paris, and was given around $10,000 I think. it was the highest amount of bread for a non US student at the time. It was still a stretch to get the rest of the money, and a lot of fund raising had to be done.

A lot has changed that I don't know too much about since I was there. But one thing I do know is that the audition process got a lot tougher. The standard is going up again and they are getting more picky about who they let in.

My advice for you for the audition is to not concentrate on the bass at all. It's about music, and bass just happens to be the instrument you chose to play music on. I'm sure the audition will be based around some sort of jazz language so play melody, with great time, and great sound. Say something that sticks out, and something that is full of your personality. They're looking for individuals I'm sure. So the more unique you can be as a player the better.

Berklee has a student body like no other school in the world. So if you're lucky enough to study there you need to hang all the time. day and night, with all the cats. these are the people that you're going to make music with for the rest of your life.

Not only does it have some of the best students, but it has the best facilities of any music school in the world. State of the art studios and synth labs, rehearsal spaces, concert halls, computer labs, and one of the biggest music libraries in the country. All this, twinned with the fact that there are some amazing teachers there in every field, and that it's just up the street from New York city..... need I say anymore?

Good luck with it all, and let me know how it pans out.

Do you know who is going to be auditioning you by the way?

Easy,

Janek

 

[Mikey D]

I'm sure the audition will be based around some sort of jazz language so play melody, with great time, and great sound. Say something that sticks out, and something that is full of your personality. They're looking for individuals I'm sure. So the more unique you can be as a player the better.

This is exactly what I was thinking! I'm still striving towards my own sound, but I'm on my way, sort of making a mix up of Dipiazza/Patitucci/Fred Baker (my teacher)/Scofield on fretless doin that whole 4 finger thing you know!

Meeting and studying with DiPiazza for a week has finally set me straight on what i want and how to do it with the electric and that IT IS acceptable in jazz music! I personally have known this all along, but to get these positive comments from him and yourself and other professional electric players has helped me in my quest to ignore the negative comments I keep getting about the electric bass in improvised music. Because currently I feel my education is hindering my progress as a musician, not aiding it! Although it does mean as a result I'm sort of saying "up yours" and practicing 8 hours a day on electric to show them! So in a way they are helping my chops!

The reasons you state are also why I want to study there; New York, the standard of students, the teachers especially (not just the principal instrument ones either), the appreciation of electric bass as a legitimate instrument (I'm not anti-upright, but recently have been very pro-electric), even the stigma attached to saying you have studied at Berklee (even though some of it can be negative).

I don't know who will be auditioning me yet as I have just applied and asked a few questions, but I hope to be able to attend fall 2008 so audition next year. I will probably do it as part of the tour in Europe, but am tempted to save a bit and go to Boston and audition there to get a taste of it.

Thanks for your time and I will keep you updated.

 

[SteveA-UK]

Mikey,

I studied in Birmingham too where I felt the course was about the tradition, which was fine and important, but not open minded enough to be ENCOURAGING enough to students who wanted to do what they wanted to do.

Something I come up against a lot at home... snobbery, fear and negativity. I wish so much that people could be open minded and encouraging. I play in a touring band I left college 4 years ago to play in as I wanted real world experience rather than be in that environment in Birmingham any more. Trouble is, I still experience anti-jazz/improvisation snobbery from the musicians I tour with!!!

It's made me come to the conclusion now that you simply have to do your best to ignore this negativity and pursue your own thing as far as possible. Even better, surround yourself with encouraging, supportive people. Even if they're not always into the same music as you, if they're decent generous human beings they'll give you the freedom to be yourself and make you feel like you can do anything!

If you can find this from a place of education, then so much the better.

As you're in the neighbourhood, I'd love to come and hear you play sometime soon.

All the best,

Steve

 

[Snarf]

Something to consider: when I was sticking strictly to electric, I got no sessions. But when I got my upright up there, I started playing a lot. DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE the power of the upright bass.

Also, the four-finger right hand technique is pretty cliche now. I'd say stay away from it during your audition. Just swing like a mofo, you'll do well.

 

[Mikey D]

Mikey,
Even better, surround yourself with encouraging, supportive people. Even if they're not always into the same music as you, if they're decent generous human beings they'll give you the freedom to be yourself and make you feel like you can do anything!

If you can find this from a place of education, then so much the better.

As you're in the neighbourhood, I'd love to come and hear you play sometime soon.

I'm actually quite lucky in that I have a few very open minded people here, they couldn't care less what bass is being played as long as it swings. I'll let you know when I have got some gigs coming up.

Something to consider: when I was sticking strictly to electric, I got no sessions. But when I got my upright up there, I started playing a lot. DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE the power of the upright bass.

Also, the four-finger right hand technique is pretty cliche now. I'd say stay away from it during your audition. Just swing like a mofo, you'll do well.

Don't get me wrong about upright, it is not that I don't enjoy learning it and using it for certain roles, but I don't like being told I can't play electric. I will probably keep playing upright as I have my own. It is just as I see it I have a LOT more **** together on the electric and I don't see the point of an educational establishment poo-pooing it because it is not an upright. Especially when they have a phenomenal electric bass on the teaching staff!

Also I am not sure what you say about the 4 finger thing, you say it is a cliche, but I don't see that many people out there apart from a few big names at all using it. Maybe I haven't been exposed to somewhere like Berklee where maybe every bassist is doing it or not, these are things I would like to hear about the place. Then again the technique is just a means to an end. There are some things I want to play that I feel just aren't possible with 2 fingers (for me anyway), it is not just like I want to use 4 because other people are and it is seen as currently one of the things to be doing.

I have and am spending a lot of time really trying to make the electric swing, as I know my role as a player and realise this is essential, but purely for soloing and some grooves I just feel the 4 finger technique that I have been working on since playing with Dominique Dipiazza can't be beat.

So did you do the Berklee course, or just a bass player in the area? Any insight into the original scholarship questions and standards would be appreciated!

 

[Snarf]

The way I see it, playing 4 fingers on the right hand is like playing Donna Lee straight. No teacher wants to hear it, because it is a very copy-cat thing to do. Now this may or may not be justified, but it's the reality of things. Most of the Berklee faculty is pretty old-school when it comes to jazz. And I'll tell you straight up that I don't like the sound of it. I like to hear less notes that mean more. But that's just my individual preference and means nothing in the grand scheme of things. But definitely be wary of it with the faculty.

I'm a performance major at Berklee, starting my full major this semester (already have 4 semesters behind me). To get a scholarship, just play real well, and get your own voice to shine out. I'm not gonna lie, when I got in, I was a crappy player, and I still got a scholarship, so it's not hard to do. I worked a lot to get where I am now, I've been playing and chillin' with a lot of the top echelon players here. I've been lucky to live two floors above the 3rd-most employed bassist at Berklee (at least that I know of), that opened some doors for sure.

Oh, one last thing before I go get dinner. It's not really the establishment poo-pooing the electric bass. Don't get hung up on that, because you'll just get bitter for no reason, and there's no institutional bias against electric players. HOWEVER, in my experience, it's the STUDENTS who are looking to play with upright players. That's the sound that the piano players, sax players, and drummers want to hear. It's a unique feel and a unique sound, and it's one that is highly sought-after. That's the power of the upright at Berklee. Play it well, and you'll be making those connections. It is possible to do really well here with just electric, but you'll make it so much easier if you fully embrace upright.

 

[Mikey D]

Oh, one last thing before I go get dinner. It's not really the establishment poo-pooing the electric bass. Don't get hung up on that, because you'll just get bitter for no reason, and there's no institutional bias against electric players. HOWEVER, in my experience, it's the STUDENTS who are looking to play with upright players. That's the sound that the piano players, sax players, and drummers want to hear. It's a unique feel and a unique sound, and it's one that is highly sought-after. That's the power of the upright at Berklee. Play it well, and you'll be making those connections. It is possible to do really well here with just electric, but you'll make it so much easier if you fully embrace upright.

That is a shame i was going to do a straight version of donna lee with 4 fingers at about 400bpm! (not really of course)

Thanks for your comments, its good to hear from people who are studying at Berklee. Just to clarify, it is where i study at the moment that has a very negative attitude towards the instrument, however I am aware that no matter where I go, if 'jazz' is what i want to dedicate myself to, people will almost always want the upright (which is why I still practice it). However I still believe that it will be a better environment to get my electric playing together compared to where I am at the moment.

 

[jazzcrime]

i'd just like to add in my experience in studying music here in australia - you don't have to be as good or as spot on at playing your instrument if you're an upright player to get way more credit than you would playing your instrument just as well on electric. there are so many guys here whose bass playing kills but cos they're on electric they're always running second string to some double bass specialist.

 

[user3653753]

which is all the more reason for your primary concern to be your own music, and creating your vehicle in which to play.

The more you worry about what someone else thinks about your playing, the less time you're going to devote actually becoming a voice in music.

Being a sideman can be great, and is almost required in order to pay the bills and to live. But if you're serious about playing, and serious about your own playing, you'll strive for something unique, and something where it doesn't matter if you play the oboe, the drums, or the penny whistle. It'll just get to a point where it's music, and where it's not about the instrument you play it on.

Easy,

Janek

 

[Mikey D]

which is all the more reason for your primary concern to be your own music, and creating your vehicle in which to play.

Easy,

Janek

Hammer+Nail+Head

 

[jazzcrime]

which is all the more reason for your primary concern to be your own music, and creating your vehicle in which to play.

The more you worry about what someone else thinks about your playing, the less time you're going to devote actually becoming a voice in music.

Being a sideman can be great, and is almost required in order to pay the bills and to live. But if you're serious about playing, and serious about your own playing, you'll strive for something unique, and something where it doesn't matter if you play the oboe, the drums, or the penny whistle. It'll just get to a point where it's music, and where it's not about the instrument you play it on.

Easy,

Janek

janek,
to derail the thread a little more - if i may - how have you gone about creating your own voice as a bass player playing a more sideman bass playing kind of role - and do you find it harder to develop uniqueness as a great 'bass' player than a soloist? i guess i am wondering because i'm more into bass players who are great at making others sound great and doing in their own unique way. i guess it just leads back to my unhealthy obsession with anthony jacksons playing .

 

[user3653753]

well...... what a question..!

where do I start? i have found that the more advancements I make in my own sound and personal voice, come from study, repetition, and hard work on ideas that my mind dreams up. I think all the sideman gigs I do add to that in their own unique way, because life and art are just a series of experiences. It's how you express those experiences to others that gives you a unique voice. And also being concious in your practice not to get too hung up in one persons playing, or in a certain style or sound that already exists.

Great bass playing, like greatness in any focus of your time, comes from hard work. Bulding colours in your pallet, and then letting the mind run wild with them and paint all these new things that people have never heard before. If you are honest in your playing as well as working harder than anyone else, you are going to produce something great. Patience is the biggest key I think. And then you have to realize that if you finally think you have "your" sound or a "unique" voice, then you're probably not working hard enough. When you feel you have got somewhere, think again. There is no finish line, and there should be no sense of completion. It's not meant to sound morbid, it's meant to test the depth of your motivation. And as long as it's all fun along the way then you have nothing to worry about. As soon as it stops being fun, leave it alone. Don't force it, and don't feel preasured into anything. Set goals for yoursellf - Yes, but don't beat yourself up over something that might not be coming to fruition as quickly as you might like it to.

My main areas of study, aside from pure technique, have been in transcription, performance, and listening. You can't really do enough of any of them, and when you get into discovering new things that really inspire you to play, there is no stopping the creative process.

Hey, Anthony's great by the way. Have always been a big fan of his playing. Much more of his groove playing than his improvising. I think his groove playing is his true improvising voice. His sound is totally unique in the low register, and his lines like no other bass player in the world. kind of sad that Wayne Krantz no longer plays at the 55bar on thursdays. I used to enjoy dropping in there and being moved across the floor on my chair by AJ's low notes.

Easy,

Janek