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Black bassists and "their sound"

#123
peledog said:
Maybe if we took this debate into the realm of guitarists...

Name a black guitar hero (other than Hendrix) or anyone who plays blues.

Sort of empty - Vernon Reid maybe?
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Really not getting your point other than it seems you don't know much about Black guitarists.
:D

Anyway, back to bass...sort of
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That is probably a wise move;)

You can take this debate and expand the scope to bands in general. The whole David Chappelle skit with John Mayer - awfully stereotypical - but like a lot of stereotypes, there is some truth to it.

One example I like to bring up is Fishbone. I've seen them six times and they just flat our ROCK. They mix ska, punk, funk, metal, rock and everything in between - but their mashed up sound didn't really make them big. I think, there are a couple reasons - one, because they're black and not supposed to play rock/metal/punk - and two, the audience that I've seen are mainly white. I'm sure a sociologist or anthropologist can chime in with something that would make sense, but to me - I just don't get. As Funkadelic said - who says a funk can't play rock?
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You know who's really popular? Justin Beiber.
:D

My point is that there are all levels of success, who is supposed to propel Fishbone's? There certainly could be racial reasons why some won't support Fishbone or Megadeath or Rush or Jay Z or whatever. That would still leave plenty of people who do... but maybe not in the numbers you expect. I'd think they'd all understand that going in unless they were truly naive... or just really, really optimistic. People are people.

I guess I've heard the old saw that the reason Blacks don't succeed in Rock is because Black people don't support them one time too many. Why wouldn't the same audience that supports other Rock bands be enough? Is the flip side of that adage also part of the "problem"?
:cool:
 
#125
TapyTap said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn0o4ENlb90&p=133EAD4A5FFDB574&playnext=1&index=48

Perhaps I misunderstood peledog, but I was a bit surprised at his statement...so I suggested some rather prominent names. Not really sure what this has to so with anything either. :)
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Haha, I'm cool with it though. Half the time I end up derailing my own threads anyway :D

About the clip, I find it funny and awesome that despite the song being a blues Greg sounds so... Greg, lol. I clicked the link expecting to here some SRV type playing or something in that vein. Some guys can do that; just flip a switch and their a totally different player. Sounds like Greg just said "F that, this is me." And I dig it :). It's kinda like Scott Henderson but in reverse. Even when he's playing with Tribal Tech you can hear the blues trying to come out.
 
#126
Dr_Funkdamental said:
Sometimes I think to disagree. Kind of like the clapping on 1 and 3 vs. 2 and 4 thing. I also think the African historical aspect has validity. In the history (and maybe still now) there wasnt any music really notated, it was just caught on to and passed down by experience. They would start the song and everyone would join in, thus gravitating more to grooving and locking in with the music. Even in slavery, they were forbidden to read, have books, or be educated, so alot was internally tied to music, whether it was congregational work songs, or songs to give hidden messages, etc. I think somewhere in there theres a possibility for genetic transfer. Of course as we continue to mix and branch off, it gets more "diluted" for lack of a diff term, but I think theres something to it.
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This train of thought would take tens of thousands of years to occur not hundreds.

The beat, the rhythm, as every foot soldier knows keeps the beat and men in time for the march. And, thats pretty much how the rhythm came out of Africa with the first migration of humans --- keeping the beat on the march as they skimmed the coastline to populated the earth.

In that case the rhythm is in all of us. But the funk is a cultural thing, learned behavior. IMHO
 
#128
Brad Johnson said:
Really not getting your point other than it seems you don't know much about Black guitarists.
:D



That is probably a wise move;)



You know who's really popular? Justin Beiber.
:D

My point is that there are all levels of success, who is supposed to propel Fishbone's? There certainly could be racial reasons why some won't support Fishbone or Megadeath or Rush or Jay Z or whatever. That would still leave plenty of people who do... but maybe not in the numbers you expect. I'd think they'd all understand that going in unless they were truly naive... or just really, really optimistic. People are people.

I guess I've heard the old saw that the reason Blacks don't succeed in Rock is because Black people don't support them one time too many. Why wouldn't the same audience that supports other Rock bands be enough? Is the flip side of that adage also part of the "problem"?
:cool:
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Name a guitar hero who doesn't play blues and isn't named Hendrix, King (BB or Albert), Berry. Someone on par with Eddie Van Halen. When kids/adults play the game 'Guitar Hero', what guitarists come to mind?

Fishbone's music does not appeal to a mass black audience. They were promoted as such, didn't work now did it? Was it their own fault? Not really. It is what it is. Victims of their own talent and direction. 311, however - man, they got somewhere decent with their ska/toasting/rap/melodic rock thing - and they're good at it. Is it because they're white? I don't know.

Living Colour was promoted as a 'black' rock/metal band. Why the need to do so? Why point it out? The 'novelty' factor?

Doesn't matter. One of the best hardcore bands around is called Bad Brains. But then, not a lot of black people in the hardcore scene - generalization, I know - but watched a couple documentaries about that - so...don't know if that makes my opinion hold any water.


Bite your tongue about Bieber. He's going to be the next Bootsy. :spit:

:p

Sorry to hijack your thread Kwesi.
 
#129
Beck McCartney said:
Have you guys ever heard of Jesse Stern? He played with P Funk, and Sly for a while, and he played for Jordin Sparks. He plays a lot like the players in the video, and he's a white guy. Of coarse, his wife is black. I think race isn't really a color thing though. It's a culture thing.
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Now that made me chuckle, as if he 'recieved it' somehow by osmosis or some other type of transmission ;)


You f***in' guys!
 
#132
peledog said:
Name a guitar hero who doesn't play blues and isn't named Hendrix, King (BB or Albert), Berry. Someone on par with Eddie Van Halen. When kids/adults play the game 'Guitar Hero', what guitarists come to mind?

Fishbone's music does not appeal to a mass black audience. They were promoted as such, didn't work now did it? Was it their own fault? Not really. It is what it is. Victims of their own talent and direction. 311, however - man, they got somewhere decent with their ska/toasting/rap/melodic rock thing - and they're good at it. Is it because they're white? I don't know.

Living Colour was promoted as a 'black' rock/metal band. Why the need to do so? Why point it out? The 'novelty' factor?

Doesn't matter. One of the best hardcore bands around is called Bad Brains. But then, not a lot of black people in the hardcore scene - generalization, I know - but watched a couple documentaries about that - so...don't know if that makes my opinion hold any water.


Bite your tongue about Bieber. He's going to be the next Bootsy. :spit:

:p

Sorry to hijack your thread Kwesi.
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Name five great black anythings that are household names that don't sing in their songs. Thats because in most forms of "urban" or "black" the musicians are more in the background the singer takes the forefront. You don't have as many bands( a group of musicians with a singer who probably also plays an instrument.) You're more likely to have groups(a group of singers who in most cases don't play anything.) So most black guitar and musicians in general are in the background in the studio or traveling on tour but, they don't appear on mtv and do interviews, so thats why you can't name any. It's not because black people don't play guitar.

Here are some great black guitar players
Jairus Mozee
Jubu Smith
Rick Watford
Catfish Collins
 
#133
Brad Johnson said:
There is and always has been another way to deal with this and I know because my musical tastes growing up were at odds with what some of my friends were listening to. Ask yourself the simple question...

Do I need their approval for what music I like?

If you're like me the answer was a resounding "no". So if someone did want to attempt to give me grief over what I listened to, it was all too clear that while they have a right to whatever opinion they may have, they were clearly talking to someone who didn't give a damn what their opinion of me was. So I was the kid listening to James Brown, T Rex, Weather Report, Jimmy Smith, Yes, Roy Clark, Tony Bennett, The James Gang, etc. while they listened to whatever the box they were self-imposed into allowed. I liked my way better and I wasn't quiet about it.

That attitude may have had a lot to do with why people didn't bother me about what I listened to or played. I was a student of good music and as such I had a big school that was always in session. And in contrast it sucked to be them.
;)

So if I got the dumbass question "Why are you listening to that "fill in the blank" music (granted, a rarity for me), I'd respond with "Why shouldn't I?".
:eyebrow:


A truly baffling question for people who aren't used to putting thought into what they say.
:D
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Awww man! Brad I get the same question from time to time. And if the question comes from a black person, they (in general) tend to be "confused" by my answer. To like - and play music from artists such as Patsy Cline, Harry Connick Jr. , Rogers & Hammerstien ... and at the same time get into The Ojays, Mary J Blige, Beyonce, The Eagles, etc. doesen't seem to fit into their "picture" of what I should presumably be into as a black man. I've actually been told that I wasn't black! It's pretty amusing actually .... and I chuckle at the fact that many of them don't get it ; and probably never will.:)
 
#135
Kwesi said:
Haha, I'm cool with it though. Half the time I end up derailing my own threads anyway :D
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:cool:

I'm glad that you started this thread...very interesting.

Kwesi said:
About the clip, I find it funny and awesome that despite the song being a blues Greg sounds so... Greg, lol. I clicked the link expecting to here some SRV type playing or something in that vein. Some guys can do that; just flip a switch and their a totally different player. Sounds like Greg just said "F that, this is me." And I dig it :). It's kinda like Scott Henderson but in reverse. Even when he's playing with Tribal Tech you can hear the blues trying to come out.
Click to expand...

Agreed...Greg's musical personality comes out no matter what style he is playing...as it should be. ;)
 
#138
peledog said:
Greg Howe is a guitar hero?
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Greg Howe is a guitar hero.

peledog said:
King plays blues, Stanley Jordan plays piano :D I kid.
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:)

peledog said:
No, where are the rock guitar heroes who are black? Are they household names? (remember no Hendrix or Berry or blues/jazz guitarists - only 'rock god' guitarists).
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Now I see that I partially misunderstood your original statement...partially. ( ) placement makes a world of difference to the reader. ;)

Greg Howe and Tony MacAlpine are two virtuosos of electric guitar that also happen to be of African lineage. If they do not play "rock" music, then I don't know what "rock" is. These two men shred like there's no tomorrow! They are heroes in my household.

I wonder what Steve Vai would say? :D
 
#140
I grew up surrounded by old-skool 50s & 60s R&B and soul (my mom's genre of choice). It shows in my singing voice but not sure about my bass playing. I'm a mostly white mutt, but have always been culturally out of sync with my larger redneck family in my musical/social tastes because I don't like metal or country :). I think Kwesi was cool to start this thread and it hasn't degenerated into PC blather.
 

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