Boutique 3-way 115 and 215 on a budget

[greenboy]

I myself had planned on getting a DSP into my bass rig by late summer so I could do better half-space testing in the backyard. I'll talk more about this in my next post...

I built a deck off the back of my home which affords a nice area for placing amplification and whatnot, and have about an acre of relatively flat yard with no buildings on it back here. Easy enough to run 50 feet of 10 gauge Speakon to a cradled cab facing upwards, and attach a reference mic to my video boom which can get it as much as 13 feet up into the air.

I don't trust my computer's audio card so much as I would trust my current RTA. But my purpsose was not so much to run a bunch of tests and publish them, so much as it was to incorporate a DSP product into my bass rig and have a real good idea what the cab could do in half-space - without the anomolies and variables introduced by any room's reflecting surfaces and boundaries. That way I could find what DSP settings would optimize the already fine cab at every level from bedroom and studio to loud loud stage.

Alas, I got busy with other things, and now the weather is changing, and I still haven't chosen my biamping and DSP solution ; } ...This would have provided Skip with the measurements he asked for a few pages back, good ones that would at least be useable when comparing to any graphed responses that came from reliable sources and conducted with AES standards in mind.

I must also admit that after doing a number of gigs where I ran the PA from stage as is often the case with club gigs around here, I cared less about testing and optimizing - because the PA was getting the same signal as my LS1503 was, little or no board EQ, and it always worked out well. All my V-bass patches were represnted well both on the dance floor and on stage.

More recently we played a venue with its own decent, room-optimized reinforcement and competent soundman, and the verdict was much the same: little or no board EQ or dedicated compression needed, no mix problems from song to song or patch to patch, no need to run any bass into monitors (because of good cab placement for stage mix) - in general a good one-to-one translation of rig to PA.

We will see if I have sufficient motivation next summer to do a bunch of testing and graphing and optimization... but for now the LS1503 is right and fine, and for me it's more fun to play and listen than it is to drag stuff out onto the deck and beyond ; }

 

[greenboy]

I really do feel I've hit one of those magic moments of tonal nirvana, and the LS1503 is the piece that moves all the right air molecules- the key link.

Great, Michael - I'm glad to hear that so many different peoples' heads and amps are showing what relative transparency of cab is all about: reproducing that which the bass and upstream electronics are doing! Sure is fun to hear the differences!

 

[pedro]

According to UPS its 'Out for Delivery'. Band practice at 5pm.

 

[seamonkey]

Great, Michael - I'm glad to hear that so many different peoples' heads and amps are showing what relative transparency of cab is all about: reproducing that which the bass and upstream electronics are doing! Sure is fun to hear the differences!

+1
For me it's all about getting the sound that's in my human head out. Which may be one sound for a whole gig, and different from time to time, or song to song, or between parts of songs. I just can't get this without full range speakers.

The ls1503 is such a bargain for a well designed cabinet. They would be much better than what I'm using. Just need to figure out the funding.

If they came with 4x10" silk-screened on the grills I bet they'd pick up a lot more converts.

 

[edgerunner]

Ok - first a quick intro. New here - soon to be 15 yo son's a bass player for about 18 mos (Fender MIM Jazz 2002 or so) and I had another thread looking for advice on a new rig for him. He's been playing through a Crate BT100 since he started. They've been playing out in local clubs/bars about 2x a month and have a gig next month on the main stage at The Chance in Poughkeepsie, and are in a battle of the bands at The Knitting Factory in a few weeks. They are writing and play originals as well as classic rock covers.

Anyway - I wanted to get him a new rig because for the last several gigs (in and outdoor) he's been getting buried under the guitars and drums and is frustrated with his tone. So - while I have some resource available I wanted to help him out and front him for a new rig and he'll pay half over the next year or so. I decided to go the component route to give him the most flexibility over the next several years. I've purchased a SansAmp RBI for his pre, and a Crown xti1000 for his power amp, and I was looking for advice on a 410 cab when I was pointed to this thread by UncleJam I believe.(THANKS!)

So after about three days of reading through this thread in my spare reading time, I've pulled the trigger. Ordered my son an LS 3015 based on the strength of the recommendations here. Now, I am hoping to talk to Greenboy (Thanks for the offer!!) this weekend to confirm my understand of how to wire all this up to best advantage. I am a little (very little) technical - but just enough to be dangerous!! ;-) I also want to dummy proof it for my son (NOT that he's a dummy - just a teen who wants everything set to 11. ;-) )

Anyway - I placed the order online late last night. I figure that I ought to call this AM to confirm since I got no online warnings of backorders, and given the recent stories of credit card mixups.

Now we anxiously await the new gear. YIPPIE!!! Thanks everyone and especially Greenboy for taking the time to share all this great insight and knowledge. This place is THE BEST!!!

Cheers!
ChuckT

 

[pedro]

Ordered my son an LS 315

Which one is the 315?

 

[Bass Below]

Ah, it's all in the mix, I thought, as far as topicism....

My post didn't make much sense after MichaelVee edited his, nevermind.

 

[edgerunner]

Which one is the 315?

Doh!!! Mixed up my numbers. Sorry - LS1503. Is that right? Anyway - I definitely ordered the right one!!! Just a case of malfunctioning brain cells today. ;-)

I'll go edit it.

Cheers!
Chuck

 

[pedro]

Yep that's the right one. I was confused because some other options have been discussed here and I thought perhaps I had lost track of one.

I'm still toying with the idea of buying my son one of the power versions. He's been using my Bass POD and thought it would be a great combination for him. Light, powerful and able to reproduce the POD signals more accurately.

 

[greenboy]

Edgerunner,

Great to talk instead of type ; } - I'm excited to hear how things are progressing for your son; I kinda help some of my friend's kids with bass and guitar and PA stuff, and I always wonder if something's going to get blown up before I get a plea for help or advice ; } ...It can be frustrating for young players because budget as well as inexperience is a huge factor, and having parents who can be mentors is invaluable.

Pedro,

And with that I think I might be able to say something about the powered version of the LS1503. It might not be a bad way to go for a new player. For a manufactuer putting such a cab together at a lower price point, it makes sense to design them so that it's tough to damage anything. Keeping support and service issues low is important if you want to keep the product on the market. So the amount of power going to each component is limited enough to be "safe", yet large enough to get loud. I've used a number of "active" powered cabs and most of them have been very reliable and simple to operate.

The little info and photos of the module I've been able to google makes it look like it's worth checking out at any rate. I myself would have considered the 1503A if I didn't already have DSP and driver retrofits in mind. But it may be just the ticket for people who aren't experienced tweakers (or crazy) ; }

 

[Michael Vee]

Edge, I like the idea of a Sansamp RBI pre and the XTi 1000 poweramp with the built-in DSP processing, powering the 1503. That should be a heckuva amp setup for your son! Wish I could have started out with that!!

 

[Michael Vee]

According to UPS its 'Out for Delivery'. Band practice at 5pm.

Danggit! If your UPS delivery is like mine (and I think everybody's!), you are not going to get your 1503 in time for rehearsal, Pedro!

You gonna go on and play tonight without the 1503, and use it next time out?

We are all waiting on your report!!

 

[Supertanker]

An orchestra at full crescendo never sounds strained. Ever cruised in a big block equipped car, then punched the throttle?

That's it!

That's exactly what the 1503LF affords me. I tried to blow it up. It just sat there laughing at me.

Even with the stock woofer its never sounded strained...

 

[greenboy]

“I tell him.. when I'm out of Jamaica... he must dominate the place with bass. And he did."
Family Man speaking of Robbie Shakespeare

I'd so like to do some dubworthy with a 1523! Biggest places around here that'd be steppin' wit'out PA support.

 

[pedro]

And with that I think I might be able to say something about the powered version of the LS1503. It might not be a bad way to go for a new player.

Greenboy its not that he's inexperienced, he is after all in his third year of music school. But he is even less technical than his father and again, since he's into the Bass POD thing I thought it would be a terrific way to get a more 'essential' reproduction of the POD signal. What do you think?

 

[pedro]

Danggit! If your UPS delivery is like mine (and I think everybody's!), you are not going to get your 1503 in time for rehearsal, Pedro!You gonna go on and play tonight without the 1503, and use it next time out?We are all waiting on your report!!

I hope that won't be the case as it would result in delay in testing it out and more importantly require an explanation to the wife about a new package.

 

[greenboy]

Greenboy its not that he's inexperienced, he is after all in his third year of music school. But he is even less technical than his father and again, since he's into the Bass POD thing I thought it would be a terrific way to get a more 'essential' reproduction of the POD signal. What do you think?

Well, the technical stuff is all part of the game too, as is music theory, gigging, study of acoustics, etc ; }

Essentially, using the POD stuff is little different than using a V-Bass, but with the powered version of the cab it makes carrying a power amp unnecessary, and in the bargain you are getting tri-amping with no weight and space penalties.

 

[greenboy]

I hope that won't be the case as it would result in delay in testing it out and more importantly require an explanation to the wife about a new package.

That's a Christmas present for you, dear - I swear! I just ordered it early because it was on special.

 

[pedro]

That's a Christmas present for you, dear - I swear! I just ordered it early because it was on special.

Hmmmm you sound experienced in such matters. That just might work.

 

[Bass Below]

Hmmmm you sound experienced in such matters. That just might work.

The big bold black letters C-A-R-V-I-N on the box might get you in trouble.... Carvin needs to smarten up and go with "discreet" packaging