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Double Bass Bowing stuff

M

menoluv

Jun 24, 2009
33
0
#1
Is it important for the bows to be perpendicular to the strings? My instructors, mostly said that it is more important make a focal point for my bow hair to continuously grip the strings at a point, without changing it, because it would cause a swish-swoosh sound. Also, they told me to slant the bow a bit, as I am very used to playing the bass in a quite slanted way. Is this wrong?

Oh, btw, when should I move my wrist, even though my arm makes the movement?
 
#2
The most important thing about bowing is to have complete control over the bow; once you have that, you can play with all the variables and find out for yourself.

Your instructor is making sense, just go with it for now.

Wrist movement is one of those impossible to describe things... and it's totally different between French and German bows anyway. Main thing is keep it relaxed and natural; you really can't think of timing those things anyway, it's all about the feel.
 
#6
menoluv said:
Oh, btw, when should I move my wrist, even though my arm makes the movement?
Click to expand...

I would first like to address the question on wrist movement. The poster C Bass is correct that it is impossible to describe. At least that is what my instructors have always told me.

I can share with you some facts and mental approaches that have worked for me.

fact: its not matter of when, because the wrist is loose, it flows as extension of the shoulder, which is where all bowing must come from. Power and agility of are a function of shoulder. So its really not an issue of when should you move your wrist, that's entirely not a good mental strategy.

What is a good mental approach is just to think of the wrist as being "unlocked" in fact this entire process is called unlocking the wrist and will take a decade to master(I am not a master of flawless bowing technique).

Fact: It is mandatory to practice bowing on each open string in front of a mirror, and seriously do not try and make any movement of the wrist on your own, when the wrist and mind have been unlocked it will happen.

So remember the goal is not to move the wrist at the correct time it is rather to unlock the wrist along with the mind.

Fact: It is ok to drop your bow. In fact it is a good thing, it is a sure sign your hand is gripping the bow with the proper distribution of force. The bow must be loose in the fingers and hand. This is necessary for the wrist to flow.

The reality is you never will drop the bow, if your thumb is bent and properly located in the curve of the frog(this is the proper place regardless of what older publications may say). Again its a mental thing, you have to feel as loose and as free as you would if you didn't really care if the bow fell. Or even if you were trying to hap hazardously drop the bow.

The last thing I would like to add to this is do not focus on tone when gunning for wrist technique, the light pressure and tension free grip will not produce good tone....AT FIRST, in this stage your goal is simply to unlock the wrist.

Do practice/warm up sessions of just bowing, then be musical and have fun. each time you focus on pure technique for short periods of time, it will slowly creep its way into your playing, when your focus is musicality and not bow/wrist tech.

Finally you must go see a symphony orchestra and sit in the front row with a good head on view of the cello section(bass bowing is hard to see from anywhere in a hall) and cello wrist movement is close enough to give you an idea of what it is you are trying to mimic.
 
#7
menoluv said:
so having the bow being perpendicular to the string is not a very big problem?
Click to expand...

It should always be fairly close, but don't go mad trying to keep it that way. Do try to keep the angle, whatever it is, reasonably consistent... the bow should draw along its own line, and the contact point should stay in the same place.

Letting the bow draw sideways or moving the contact point around without good control is what makes funny noises.

The basic principle is totally control what the bow does while using the least muscle you can; use the weight of your arm and the bow instead.
 
#11
Don Higdon said:
When my sound sucks or squeaks, I usually find my bow not at 90 degrees. When I when I restore perpendicularity (!) my sound improves. On the other hand, I've seen many German players with great sound who don't bow at 90 d. It all seems so unfair.
Click to expand...

Its cuz when we bow from the back/shoulder(something all bassists should do regardless of bow) the contact point stays the same and we are able to maintain weight in the string. Wit the way the French bow works its more pertinent to stay perpendicular and it is also possible to bow from the back and still maintain a 90 degree angle.
 
#12
Don Higdon said:
When my sound sucks or squeaks, I usually find my bow not at 90 degrees. When I when I restore perpendicularity (!) my sound improves. On the other hand, I've seen many German players with great sound who don't bow at 90 d. It all seems so unfair.
Click to expand...

Out of interest are your strings steel with a low amount of dampening material? Maybe you use less rosin?

Dont think of it as sqeaking, think of it as "easy access to harmonics" :hiding:
 
#16
i think it's best to learn to get a consistent note front and supported tone from frog to tip with the bow perpendicular to the string, and maintaining your position on the string (not sliding up and down through the bow stroke). after you really know what it should feel like, you can get a good tone at just about any angle, but it's hard to learn if your bow is all over the place. the important thing is that your bow usage is entirely controlled.
 
#17
My sound and volume improved very significantly when I noticed that I was bowing at an angle. I use a German bow. I also notice that it is easy to get lazy on the g string and not reach out with my bow hand when the bow is at the tip. That contributes to a bad bow angle too
 
#20
There is a neat trick here!

The bow can be angled more or less than 90 degrees to the string as long as the ENERGY is drawn at 90 degrees, ie the bow contact point will move to and from the bridge a little but the bow retains its grip on the sound which remains clear. It is a neat way of preparing, while holding a long note, to shift your left hand to a higher or lower position or string without a break in tone colour. The sound does not distort because the string moves in the same way as if the bow were 90 degrees. Once the new contact point (distance from the bridge) is reached you square up the bow angle to 90 degrees again and continue as normal.

Austrian players in particular can pull a huge sound out of bass while apparently bowing at 45 degrees and it looks like they use this energy trick.

Will the bow be at 90 degrees to all strings if it is parallel to the bridge? My observation is that this is not so on the G and E strings because of the curvature of the bridge, the neck leaning back and the different bend angle of each string over the bridge?

What say ye, gentlemen?

DP
 

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