Well, all that I can say is that my amp easily has more than enough power for my needs and with the other features that are bundled in, it's really a great value at it's cost in my opinion. So yeah, I'm happy with the purchase. I've paid more for amps that did not work out as well for me as I would have liked. The back of the amp states 1000 watts at 8 ohms and 2000 watts at 4 ohms. I've already mentioned that the manual states 2000 watts peak. Here's the back....
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Bugera Veyron Now Available
- Thread starter Acoustic356
- Start date
Well, all that I can say is that my amp easily has more than enough power for my needs and with the other features that are bundled in, it's really a great value at it's cost in my opinion. So yeah, I'm happy with the purchase. I've paid more for amps that did not work out as well for me as I would have liked. The back of the amp states 1000 watts at 8 ohms and 2000 watts at 4 ohms. I've already mentioned that the manual states 2000 watts peak. Here's the back....
I have great respect for your opinions and have tried out gear based on your recommendations. Thanks for that. It isn't the wattage spec that makes me refuse to look at the amp; it's the deception involved. As you said, deception is in the eye of the beholder, and that's what my eye is telling me about the wattage spec. I wouldn't gig with a deceptive bandmate, so it's consistent if I don't want to gig with equipment that has deceptive elements, in the eye of this beholder.
I respect your opinion. I do question what you base the idea that the stated wattage is deceptive on. Have you tried the amp?
Here's my actual experience with the amp... testing it against my Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0, my Veyron easily got louder. My Shuttle was rated at 900w, I think that was RMS, I could be wrong. What would that be peak? Would an amp that was louder than that possibly have higher wattage?
The only rig that I ran that got louder than the Veyron even more easily was my lightweight rack with a Mike Pope preamp and a Crown Drivecore XLS1500 bridged mono at supposedly 1550w. So for me my Veyron was somewhere between the Shuttle and the rack. I didn't find anything deceptive about the actual performance. So when I saw people early on who hadn't even touched one loudly proclaim what it couldn't do...
I didn't really compare my Quilter against these amps as far as max loudness... again, it can easily get way too loud and stay clean at a rated power of 800w into 4 ohms. To my ears it also sounds like it controls the speakers better.
The reason I wasn't concerned about the power rating was simple... both of the above amps got ridiculously louder than I could ever need anywhere I play. I could blow stuff up with either of them if that was my goal.
I don't see where the deceit is. I do see assumptions.
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Yes, based on my use I believe it could be 1,000 RMS. My 900w Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 was not as loud. My Peavey Minimega rated at 1000w was no louder than my Veyron and didn't sound as clear and dynamic. Is the Peavey rating reasonable or deceptive?
As far as people needing to learn how to buy gear, yes, it would likely be beneficial for them if they actually learned how to buy gear. There is no simple formula for that. If there were then I wouldn't have been able to successfully gig my Bag End based rigs for so many years without a hint of a problem. They sounded damned good and it would be a shame if someone avoided them because they believed that specs told the entire story.
No, I will not pull the cover off of my amp.
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Search the internet archives.
When the iNukes were first released Behringer did publish "RMS" ratings.
It was published at 2/3rd of the "Peak" output.
Different models of iNukes were bench tested several times independently at different sites.
The benchtests confirmed this.
Behringer dumped the "RMS" label and that was a smart move in my book. No need to discuss it again here as it's not going to change anything.
In life, there's a whole lot more information on a yellow water heater sticker, or numbers on a tire sidewall than will ever be printed on MI amps. Except regulations will probably die and this will all change.
When the iNukes were first released Behringer did publish "RMS" ratings.
It was published at 2/3rd of the "Peak" output.
Different models of iNukes were bench tested several times independently at different sites.
The benchtests confirmed this.
Behringer dumped the "RMS" label and that was a smart move in my book. No need to discuss it again here as it's not going to change anything.
In life, there's a whole lot more information on a yellow water heater sticker, or numbers on a tire sidewall than will ever be printed on MI amps. Except regulations will probably die and this will all change.
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,960
- 5
- 220,625
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
Compare the back panel to certain other popular amp and I think you will come to understand why some folks here are suggesting that the feature set and layout (down to the text font) are "very" familiar to them...
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,960
- 5
- 220,625
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
Regarding RMS power, there's a fairly easy way to calculate the maximum RMS power of an amp, as the safety agency requirements for UL/IEC 60065 state that the power consumption listed on the back of the unit must be calculated at a minimum of 1/8 rated audio power (in RMS terms).
This amp states 110 watts power consumption, so with 80% efficiency end to end (pretty typical at 1/8-power for a decent design), you have (110W/.125) x 0.80 = 704 watts (RMS). If it was 85% (pretty hard to achieve at 1/8-power but possible) then this value would be 750 watts (RMS).
If the amp was designed, intended and marketed for duty cycle higher than 1/8-rated power (>.125), then the .125 factor would get larger and the stated power consumption would be higher. For example, I never design around .125 duty cycle but usually somewhere between .333 and .500, so the power consumption for the same "rated power" would be higher to account for the greater duty cycle.
This applies to all amps that conform to UL/IEC 60065 safety standards.
This amp states 110 watts power consumption, so with 80% efficiency end to end (pretty typical at 1/8-power for a decent design), you have (110W/.125) x 0.80 = 704 watts (RMS). If it was 85% (pretty hard to achieve at 1/8-power but possible) then this value would be 750 watts (RMS).
If the amp was designed, intended and marketed for duty cycle higher than 1/8-rated power (>.125), then the .125 factor would get larger and the stated power consumption would be higher. For example, I never design around .125 duty cycle but usually somewhere between .333 and .500, so the power consumption for the same "rated power" would be higher to account for the greater duty cycle.
This applies to all amps that conform to UL/IEC 60065 safety standards.
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,960
- 5
- 220,625
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
Revisiting this discussion, I went to my Christian bass player friend's church and he was going to rehearse that night. He was early, and I asked him to crank the Bugera Veyron and 115 cab I sold him since no one was there. He turned up the volume, and the room, which is a converted small gym, instantly filled with deep, full bass.
The tone from his Jazz bass was clear and concise, and when I asked him how much he had turned up, he said he was at about 33%! 1/3 volume! He didn't have his bass volume cranked either. Now I'm kind of sad for myself that I sold the amp for so cheap. The good news is that it's being put to good use. But make no doubt, for the cost of the head and cab, it sounded and compared to an amp stack with similar specs that would have cost twice as much new. There are always going to be Bugera/Behringer haters on TB. But the fact is, they are a good value product for the cost. Having said that, I nowadays play GK, Ampeg, and Eden.
The tone from his Jazz bass was clear and concise, and when I asked him how much he had turned up, he said he was at about 33%! 1/3 volume! He didn't have his bass volume cranked either. Now I'm kind of sad for myself that I sold the amp for so cheap. The good news is that it's being put to good use. But make no doubt, for the cost of the head and cab, it sounded and compared to an amp stack with similar specs that would have cost twice as much new. There are always going to be Bugera/Behringer haters on TB. But the fact is, they are a good value product for the cost. Having said that, I nowadays play GK, Ampeg, and Eden.
Revisiting this discussion, I went to my Christian bass player friend's church and he was going to rehearse that night. He was early, and I asked him to crank the Bugera Veyron and 115 cab I sold him since no one was there. He turned up the volume, and the room, which is a converted small gym, instantly filled with deep, full bass.
The tone from his Jazz bass was clear and concise, and when I asked him how much he had turned up, he said he was at about 33%! 1/3 volume! He didn't have his bass volume cranked either. Now I'm kind of sad for myself that I sold the amp for so cheap. The good news is that it's being put to good use. But make no doubt, for the cost of the head and cab, it sounded and compared to an amp stack with similar specs that would have cost twice as much new. There are always going to be Bugera/Behringer haters on TB. But the fact is, they are a good value product for the cost. Having said that, I nowadays play GK, Ampeg, and Eden.
You KNOW that I've got to take a dig at you! You actually said that the combination lacked volume and low end response!
I'm glad that you found a rig that satisfies you.....
You KNOW that I've got to take a dig at you! You actually said that the combination lacked volume and low end response!
I'm glad that you found a rig that satisfies you.....
One of the worst faults one can have is the inability to admit an error in their judgement.Having said that, I'm glad I got to hear it redeem itself (in a church no less LOL). I think it sounded excellent, something about the way my friend used it-- different passive bass-- great acoustics in a gym sized room. I used it in small rooms and I think the large gym where it now lives allows it to open up.
I've gone much smaller with my Ampeg GK and Eden stuff but I don't suffer from lack of volume. The Bugera cab was quite large compared to my Ampeg and Eden cabs. Ampeg, Eden, GK, Bugera-- all nice stuff. We live in a great time for bass amplification.
EDIT: Other TB'ers have pointed out that probably only about 10% of the world of bass players actually use TB. No matter how much negative comments, Bugera and Turbosound is going to be successful because a lot of other musicians appreciate the value they deliver for the buck.
Similarities? Yes. A copy? Not so much.
Much in the same way that when Benavente came out with their first singlecuts many called them Fodera copies. Thought there would be confusion between the two brands. Even squinting hard they looked different to me.
Having said that, I'm glad I got to hear it redeem itself (in a church no less LOL). I think it sounded excellent, something about the way my friend used it-- different passive bass-- great acoustics in a gym sized room. I used it in small rooms and I think the large gym where it now lives allows it to open up.
I've gone much smaller with my Ampeg GK and Eden stuff but I don't suffer from lack of volume. The Bugera cab was quite large compared to my Ampeg and Eden cabs. Ampeg, Eden, GK, Bugera-- all nice stuff. We live in a great time for bass amplification.
EDIT: Other TB'ers have pointed out that probably only about 10% of the world of bass players actually use TB. No matter how much negative comments, Bugera and Turbosound is going to be successful because a lot of other musicians appreciate the value they deliver for the buck.
I've also got a Quilter Bass Block 800 and an Ashdown Rootmaster RM-800 EVO. With the EQ controls set to noon on those two and the Veyron, the Veyron is the more modern sounding or brighter of the three. The low end is still there but the M just has more upper mids & highs at those settings. I've never tried to push each to maximum volume but I did turn the masters up to noon while bouncing between the heads as they fed a pair of old Genz Benz 112s. My conclusions? All three amps bring a smile to my face. I need a new cab or cabs that pair better with the heads. I like my 112s but they really don't do those heads justice. Each can get extremely loud. That noon on the master test got me yelled at!
When I play too loud in the house wife has three words for me-- "To the SHED!"
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,960
- 5
- 220,625
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
Nice carry handle. I also like how big the master volume is.
As far as numbers go, I could care less. I know it matters as far as matching cabs and ohms and all that, but my ears ultimately make the call.
I’m not a big fan of the blue lights amp and pedal makers are using.
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The Ford Fusion got better looking when they put an Austin Martin grill on the front end...
Ha, indeed it does! I was thinking about just that when reading through this thread a few days ago. With that being said, doesn't Ford have a significant stake in Aston Martin or something?
