Double Bass Building Energy in Funk Tunes

[Rompi]

Hey

I'm mostly into straight ahead jazz but recently, I've been looking into playing better bass lines over funky/riff based tunes (on the Double Bass). I've been using 'Strasbourg St Denis' as a reference to start, using this video with the Roy Hargrove quintet.



I chose this tune as I love the way the energy builds throughout each solo. It just gets you feeling really good! Also, the progression certainly is rather simple, most of the progression being based around the Ab major scale. For this reason, I'm more trying to work on my rhythm and feel without worrying too much about fancy harmonic complexity.

However, I'm having some issues trying to get that funky sound on my bass lines. Firstly, I tend to think in terms of note names rather than hand shapes, which is great for straight ahead jazz, but for riff based music, often slows me down and impedes my rhythm. I imagine this is an unusual issue, but would anyone give me any advice as how to learn hand shapes that could help me play funkier lines over Strasbourg St Denis?

Secondly, I just thought I'd ask, what is a good way to build energy as a bassist during someone's solo. In this video, it seems like it is primarily the drummer and the soloist are feeding off each other's energy, but I'd like to know how bassists can further augment this and bring a tune to its climax!

Thanks, any help would be great!

 

[sean_on_bass]

Sweet tune. Honestly i think the best way to get into this type of groove is listening to a lot of it, and playing along with recordings like this one. Check out some of Roy's RH Factor recordings. He does alot of the soul/funk jazz thing on those records. You'll likely have to take some cues from electric players on this one.

Some general ways of upping the energy:

-Increase the rhythmic complexity and density of your line as the rest of the band starts to take off

-Dynamics: Play a little harder when the energy is high

-Fills: Play fills at the end of logical phrases, this can enhance the tension and energy

 

[pacojas]

F'N AWESOME BAND!!!!! (best piece of music i've heard on this site) everybody slayed,.. drummer was ridiculous,.. loved the bassist,.. pianist was inventive,.. horns were as good,... IMHO!

thanks for posting!

 

[Sharp5]

Wow. Thank you for posting that.

 

[vin*tone]

Great band.

As Bootsy said... put it on the 1.... and this groove is all about the 1.

As far as fills and note choices go I'd think more modally on the Bb and Cm rather than AbMaj- even F minor Pentatonic. The turnaround on the Maj chords are very gospel sounding. I'm hearing that prominent semitone walkup to the F (Eb, E, F)

 

[Sean Riddle]

• When I was reading through Standing in the Shadows of Mowtown, a drummer who played with Jamerson mentioned how once Jamerson told that when you fill it's not about how much you do, it's about what you do. And that Bootsy quote is so true. If you don't hit the downbeat there is no groove. Don't play too much as well. Less is more is a really good motto to follow in a groove context. I would say you have to think about it less analytically and more about creating a certain feeling. For backing up a soloist, just keep your ears perked and listen to what he is doing and give them the best support you can but don't overshadow them. In my opinion, you really should only play more intricate lines if there isn't a piano or guitar comping. I'll see if I can post a video I have of Alphonso Johnson grooving on a Coltrane tune

 

[Tom Lane]

Sweet tune. Honestly i think the best way to get into this type of groove is listening to a lot of it, and playing along with recordings like this one. Check out some of Roy's RH Factor recordings. He does alot of the soul/funk jazz thing on those records. You'll likely have to take some cues from electric players on this one.

Some general ways of upping the energy:

-Increase the rhythmic complexity and density of your line as the rest of the band starts to take off

-Dynamics: Play a little harder when the energy is high

-Fills: Play fills at the end of logical phrases, this can enhance the tension and energy

Seanto called it; all of the devices Sean listed the bassist employed. One more: harmonic tension - playing outside and resolving.

 

[Don Kasper]

I chose this tune as I love the way the energy builds throughout each solo. It just gets you feeling really good! Also, the progression certainly is rather simple, most of the progression being based around the Ab major scale. For this reason, I'm more trying to work on my rhythm and feel without worrying too much about fancy harmonic complexity.

However, I'm having some issues trying to get that funky sound on my bass lines. Firstly, I tend to think in terms of note names rather than hand shapes, which is great for straight ahead jazz, but for riff based music, often slows me down and impedes my rhythm. I imagine this is an unusual issue, but would anyone give me any advice as how to learn hand shapes that could help me play funkier lines over Strasbourg St Denis?

Secondly, I just thought I'd ask, what is a good way to build energy as a bassist during someone's solo. In this video, it seems like it is primarily the drummer and the soloist are feeding off each other's energy, but I'd like to know how bassists can further augment this and bring a tune to its climax!

Thanks, any help would be great![/QUOTE]

Rompi,
(I've attached a sketch of the basic harmony of the tune, below). I think it's valuable to know the specific harmonic structure of the tune, even though you're not incorrect in your general analysis of "Ab Major...".
1. Note how the bassist, (and pianist), clearly continue to outline the harmony and root movement throughout the tune, even when (they and) the soloist and drummer get "energetic".
2. One possible approach is to begin by shortening the length of some of your notes, which creates more space in the feel - (check out the track starting @1:39, for example). This seems to lock with the drums, (esp. the bass drum), and provides a staring place from which to build.
Thanks for your time and interest.

 

[sean_on_bass]

Another thought...in straight ahead you are usually grooving with the drummers ride cymbal. In a tune like this you might be better off grooving with the drummers bass drum.

 

[azureblue]

Play simple. You can get more tension sometimes with a single note per measure, if you know where to put it. Funk is the rhythm section working together as a unit, and it's all about interlocking rhythm patterns. You play with, and off of the other players, as a team. You can know all the funk riffs in the world, but if your drummer is not working with you, then you'll just sound like you are trying too hard. It is your job to know how the other people play, and to play off of them, and to know what to do when they start building.

 

[tmntfan]

funk is very close to the blues so work on your pentatonic/blues shapes.

easy way to add energy is to pedal. then take that pedal up a octave.
walking up chromatically is fun.
imposing simple chord progressions can help to (1 ,b7,b6,5) or walking up (b6 b7 1)

check out a band called "the Cat Empire" killer stuff soy y sombra is a wicked tune that builds.

 

[Phil Smith]

Compared to straight ahead I guess you could say this is funky but compared to what Christian McBride does on the CD "Face The Music" this isn't funky at all. To me the groove here isn't locked in, but again listen to some tracks off of the CD I mentioned and you'll hear what I mean.

 

[Don Kasper]

The George Duke recording is a great example of a bassline rhythm that follows (religiously!) the kick drum/bass drum rhythm.
Thanks for posting this "Phil Smith".

 

[Harry D'Agostino]

Transcribe James Jamerson and Carole Kaye on your upright, not just for the note choices but play along for the articulation. That really helped me dig into this kind of stuff. The note choices should come naturally if you don't think so much about them and focus more on getting a punchy articulated sound IMO.

 

[Jim Nazium]

... Christian McBride on the [George Duke] CD "Face The Music"

I bought that album after reading this thread, and I really like it. McBride's playing is fantastic as always, but the whole thing is great - the tunes, the arrangements, the recording. Definitely check it out.

 

[BrotherMister]

I double on electric as well and at now point do I ever think in hand shapes. The tune could be a static E7 chord for 20 minutes and I'm not thinking in shapes at all. I'm not really understanding how learning a hand shape is going to help you in this situation at all.

Honestly to build intensity you do it the same way you do with a jazz soloist. If you are listening then you are going to react to stuff, just because you are playing something with a repetitive groove don't be a afraid to do away with it when things are really cooking. Let's just say you have a groove over that E7 and things get intense sometimes I'll ditch the groove altogether and just pedal the root or whatever to build tension as things really start to build then when you reach the climax and come back into the groove people lose their minds. That is just a very rough example and not a sure fire way to get things happening. Just listen, you will hear it!

 

[shwashwa]

me personally on this tune, id keep it simple, maybe adding more fills as the energy builds, but really not all that much. the drummer and soloist are really building the energy here, but someone still has to mind the store. in this setup it seems that the bass is the foundation, giving the drummer the freedom to stretch. nothing wrong with knowing your job and doing it well. horace silver used to tell larry ridley to never vary the groove on the jody grind. even though larry did vary it some on the recording, horace always asked him to keep to the basic groove.