Bumping up a Gauge

[micguy]

GC gets bulk rates.

Ampless without IEM is sort of pointless, in my opinion. The main benefit of ampless is the silent stage where FOH sound isn't messed up by the stage bleed. Replacing an amp with a monitor speaker doesn't do it.

.148 B string?

If you look into the Physics of string tension, you find that each string on a fourths tune instrument needs to be 1.33 x the diameter of the next smaller one for them to have equal tension. I like really light gauge strings, and a 95 E has the same tension (35 pounds) as a 130 B. My string gauges with most brands are 40-55-70-95-130, which is a well balanced set. With Kaliums, I use 37-51-70-94-130

All those 5 string sets with a 100 E and a 120 B - why does your bass have a floppy B string? It's not the bass's fault, it's a string design problem - you should have a 135 B if you want it to not be floppy. With a big enough B, it'll work just fine. For a 95 E, you need a 130 B. For a 105 E, you need a 140 B, and so on.

 

[TheArchitect]

If you look into the Physics of string tension, you find that each string on a fourths tune instrument needs to be 1.33 x the diameter of the next smaller one for them to have equal tension. I like really light gauge strings, and a 95 E has the same tension (35 pounds) as a 130 B.

All those 5 string sets with a 100 E and a 120 B - why does your bass have a floppy B string? It's not the bass's fault, it's a string design problem - you should have a 135 B if you want it to not be floppy. With a big enough B, it'll work just fine. For a 95 E, you need a 130 B. For a 105 E, you need a 140 B, and so on.

This is the issue that the variable scale length instruments are trying to overcome

 

[micguy]

This is the issue that the variable scale length instruments are trying to overcome

If that's what they're trying to do, they're doing a poor job at best. A variable scale instrument doesn't really fix the tension differences between a 40 gauge G and a 60 gauge D string - it makes that problem worse, not better. The 80 gauge A string tension (again, higher than the G string) is also made worse by a variable scale instrument. If you want balanced tension sets for either a standard or a variable scale instrument, you have to design them for that situation - sets that you buy off the rack today aren't designed to work well with either one at present.

If you make the strings the right gauges, there isn't a problem to be overcome.

 

[StatesideRambler]

There are dozens (hundreds?) of threads on TB about stringing up with different strings in order to find a desired sound or feel. For some reason, using the search function and a range of vocabulary, I can’t find any threads on the EB side about modifying or adapting plucking and fretting techniques toward the same end. I do think they’re here but it’s yet another iteration of the notion that buying “the right gear” (in this case, heavier strings) will make you sound the way you want to sound.

Ant Wellington said in a clinic that he loves his high-end basses but if he lost ‘em all and had to use something from a pawn shop he’d still sound good because he works his ass off. It isn’t the instrument, it’s the woodshed.

Heading out to don my kevlar suit, now.

 

[taketwo]

If that's what they're trying to do, they're doing a poor job at best.

After setting up my (single scale) 5er with the .148 balanced set, I think I figured out that the main benefit of multiscale would be the reduction in differences in string gauge. As you moved from a 34" G to a 37" B, there would be less increase in string gauge, which means less difference in action, and thus more similar intonation adjustment. Thinner lower strings also means less inharmonicity as you move up the fretboard.

My .148 B sounds fantastic at the low end, but rapidly changes in timbre as I go up the neck (and gets harder to fret cleanly). It also requires an action of 8/64th to play the same as the other strings, which isn't possible without bridge modification.

But it's worth it to get that extra tonal option by playing around the 5th and 7th frets, and the low D is delicious.

 

[taketwo]

Obligatory mention: String Tension Calculator

It's set up with the Kalium gauges, but the resulting tensions are still a close match to the nearest conventional gauge. Very useful for composing custom string sets, even if you just end up cross referencing this to the d'Addario string tension charts.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

I think I want to bump up from 45-105 to 50-110 or 115. I am hoping that will take a little flop out of the strings and add some thump and punch tonally.

GHS H3045

or

Rotosound RS66LE Swing Bass 66 Stainless Steel Bass Guitar Strings (50 70 85 110)

Standard tuning

What has your experience been with heavier strings?

I play .105 - 50 (I prefer a 55 G though)

105 86, 65, 50

135 for a B

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

I think I want to bump up from 45-105 to 50-110 or 115. I am hoping that will take a little flop out of the strings and add some thump and punch tonally.

GHS H3045

or

Rotosound RS66LE Swing Bass 66 Stainless Steel Bass Guitar Strings (50 70 85 110)

Standard tuning

What has your experience been with heavier strings?

They take a little getting used to. But, they're much more even toned. I feel, at least.

Oh, and you can get your action much lower.

 

[Deleted member 271037]

This will obviously vary between different types of strings but I generally find that the tone starts to suffer with heavier gauges than 45-105(ish). The attack may get a bit less pronunced, the general dynamic "envelope" may get less thumpy/bouncy and the E-string may not sound great when playing up the neck (weird overtones). Personally I also think the lows start to suffer when going heavier than 45-105. The lows start to feel "deep" (in a piano-string kinda way) rather than fat/warm. You might like this of course. I don't.

These things will also depend on your style of playing. If you're digging in really hard (especially if you're using a pick) I'm sure 50-110 could give you more clarity and a tighter feel. I wouldn't go all the way to .115 on the E-string though. At that point the tone will definitely start to suffer (IMO).

You will need a setup of course. The truss rod will need to be tightened a little bit. The intonation will also have to be adjusted. The nut slots might need to be filed to accomodate the larger strings.

The good news is that you will probably get away with slightly lower action as heavier strings will generally vibrate with a smaller amplitude (which is probably why I feel heavier strings than 45-105 can be lacking a bit of of "bounce" and fatness in the lows).

The only way to find out is to test this yourself as this will massively depend on your style of playing but if you're looking for more "thump and punch" I honestly don't think heavier strings is the answer.

 

[_Tay_]

Going up to 110-55 NYXL's i can get the action much better and really dig in nice with little effort. It's a win over smaller gauge strings for me.

 

[TheArchitect]

This will obviously vary between different types of strings but I generally find that the tone starts to suffer with heavier gauges than 45-105(ish). The attack may get a bit less pronunced, the general dynamic "envelope" may get less thumpy/bouncy and the E-string may not sound great when playing up the neck (weird overtones). Personally I also think the lows start to suffer when going heavier than 45-105. The lows start to feel "deep" (in a piano-string kinda way) rather than fat/warm. You might like this of course. I don't.

These things will also depend on your style of playing. If you're digging in really hard (especially if you're using a pick) I'm sure 50-110 could give you more clarity and a tighter feel. I wouldn't go all the way to .115 on the E-string though. At that point the tone will definitely start to suffer (IMO).

You will need a setup of course. The truss rod will need to be tightened a little bit. The intonation will also have to be adjusted. The nut slots might need to be filed to accomodate the larger strings.

The good news is that you will probably get away with slightly lower action as heavier strings will generally vibrate with a smaller amplitude (which is probably why I feel heavier strings than 45-105 can be lacking a bit of of "bounce" and fatness in the lows).

The only way to find out is to test this yourself as this will massively depend on your style of playing but if you're looking for more "thump and punch" I honestly don't think heavier strings is the answer.

A setup is no big deal for me. I have been doing my own work since I was a teenager. I generally try different strings on a new instrument to see what works so this is just an opportunity to kill a few birds with one stone. The bass needs a setup regardless and I get to play with different string gauge and materials. Its been a long time since I taste tested the bass string market. The SS Rotos will still be there to go back to if I want.

 

[TheArchitect]

Going up to 110-55 NYXL's i can get the action much better and really dig in nice with little effort. It's a win over smaller gauge strings for me.

Also a perk if everything is favorable

If you think about it, guitar players make much more significant changes. 9-42 to 10-46 is a lot bigger percent change than 45-50 or 105 - 110

 

[Aloe]

my experience was that really thick gauges (like 60-115) are, uhm, stiff and thick.

I've somewhat recently moved from 45-135 to 40-130 on my 5-string (same strings, but different gauge) and for me it gave tad more highs and lows, but less mids and zinginess (like natural overdrive). exactly what I was looking for. IME, different gauges do sound a bit differently.

if a 45-105 in standard tuning are floppy for you -- uhm, I'm afraid, that's the bass. or you really like them very stiff. I have a 45-105 SuperBrights on my 30" scale and don't find them floppy, but had a 34" bass where the same strings were. I know, this is kinda against physics, but this is my experience. I explain it by different basses having different neck stiffness, if the neck is floppy, strings will be floppy.

 

[ahbradot]

Back in February I found these cryogenic activated, blue steel Dean Markley bass strings, medium 50 to 105 gauge.
I never remembered buying the strings. I’ve had them for decades.
I never once had to adjust the truss rod in the neck on this 1985 Gibson Explorer, even with these tighter tension strings. Absolutely no effect on the neck.
Normally, I use only Rotosound 45 to 105 gauge.
The reason why I put those 50-105 strings on was because I haven’t used that Gibson explorer in decades. So I figured what the heck try out these old strings with the old bass.
I love the sound of it. It kind of reminds me of a piano, very clear, rich tone, and the tension feels good on that bass. Very comfortable to play.

 

[logdrum]

Here's my take. Having done latin gigs in the past, a common trick on the upright or Ampeg baby bass is to use solo strings which need to be tuned to F#, B, E. A but tune them to regular tuning in effect lower gauge. The result is actually deeper thumpier bass (tumbao) and easy on the hands - well almost because you raise the bridge also and you had higher action. Last year I got me some light Cobalt flats but raised the action and now I get more thumpier bass. If you are looking for more stiffness then hexcore or tune the bass up. My hybrid bass+guitar (29.5 scale) is tuned up to a G. Even though I loose 3 semitones, the bass really pops and thumps.

I really do not think heavier gauges produce more thump except maybe for the G string. That's what I did on the cobalt strung bass, I kept the older 50 G string. Another thing I have done in the past is tune to an F. Handy with horn players

Just a thought.

 

[fatz treeboy]

for more "thump and punch" I honestly don't think heavier strings is the answer.[/QUOTE]

you are a good writer..... thanks...... i just bought a 'Mediem" set that starts at 120... for my 4 string 2006 p-bass deluxe...... i got 105 flatwounds now..... i do not know details like you, i just thought ....bigger strings, bigger thump!!!!!! typical bonehead rock n roll logic thats me........ i wanted more growl and more bass thump.....after the truss rod adjustment i prolly gonna stop there.....but these 120 sixe string set is here on the bench i also just bought the correct wrench and tightened my truss rod 1/2 turn and am so happy w/ that.... i fretted n worried for a month and was gonna spend 75 and go to a shop..... not sure about the new strings now that i read your post...... cheers and have a great leo fender day!!!!!

 

[Ricky Rioli]

I've been used to 45–105 sets, but when I got my SB-1 both Boomers and Roto Bass felt really underwhelming on it, jangly and shallow. So I shifted to 50-110 and the bass stopped sulking and came to life. Swing Bass, Roto Bass and DTFs all felt right at those gauges.

In general, my fingers find the sound they're looking for more easily with slightly higher tension. Why one bass needs yet more of it, I've no idea.

 

[GTHintz]

I'll share something I'm going through. So my set up is situated around stainless steel and I've always played medium 45-65-80-105-128 or something close. This time I'm trying a little heavier. 135 b string and the a string is 85 I believe. I don't mind my b string and I think it's the only positive of this. The other strings are a little stiffer than I am used to and I feel like it took something away in my overtones and mids that I'm missing. I would just recommend to the op and anyone reading that going up a gauge is fine but be careful about how much you go because it definitely changes your attack and overtones due to the thicker mass of the string. It will help with floppyness but be prepared to deal with other changes including stiffness and the timber changing. Could be good or bad depending on what you want out of your strings. For me I'm thinking I'm cool with a thicker b string but I definitely want to go back to the smaller gauges on the others. 130 or maybe like 132 if I got custom built strings would be fine. I tried 125 and wasn't so happy with how clanky it was. I play fairly heavy handed and it's easy to clank the low b. You just have to find the happy medium for tension and fundamental and stick to it.

 

[bobyoung53]

I think I want to bump up from 45-105 to 50-110 or 115. I am hoping that will take a little flop out of the strings and add some thump and punch tonally.

GHS H3045

or

Rotosound RS66LE Swing Bass 66 Stainless Steel Bass Guitar Strings (50 70 85 110)

Standard tuning

What has your experience been with heavier strings?

To me, a fuller tone. I use Roto Swing bass too, I'd go with the Swing bass if I were you.

 

[TheArchitect]

Then the Roto SB66 Stainless Steel 50-110 may be the logical choice for you. The Boomers, being nickel-plated steel, have a very different tonal character from the Roto Stainless Steels.

Thats true, nickel does have a different character and I want to explore that also. I need to only change one variable at a time though to know what is doing what to the sound