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cab issues. farting out / speaker problems ?

tedsalt

tedsalt

Supporting Member
Aug 5, 2010
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Kansas City
#1
I picked up a new Fender Rumble 500 head and (2) used Bassman Neo 410 cabs (from different GCs). Finally got to give them a good test at a semi-outdoor rehearsal (open garage). Guitarist is running a Carvin V3M 100w tube amp with a 212 cab. Drummer is not mic'd, singer thru PA. We have an outdoor gig mid July, and I'd like to be ready gear wise, so I figure this is a good time to test out the head and the used cabs.

The only effect I am running is a Markbass Compressore.

So I dial up the gain to about 9 o'clock and master to noon, and one of the 410s sounds like its farting out or something, or may be damaged? So I disconnect the one that is giving me problems, and run on one cab. When I try to push it a little more, it seems to be farting out also, so I back off on the gain and a little on the volume.

I have bass set to around 10:30, low mids at noon, high mids around 1:30, and treble around 1:30. Gain is now turned off and I am just running master around 11 o'clock. Cab horn dial is set about half way on.

We will be able to mic and/or di my gear for the outdoor gig, but I was interested in testing to see what my rig would do without pa support.

Is there something I am doing wrong (setting wise), or is it likely that I do have cab problems? If it is cab problems, there is a speaker repair shop near me I can take it to (http://www.sliceinc.com), or should I look into Fender Neo speakers for replacement?

Any and all comments appreciated! Thanks!
 
#2
read the Underpowering cabs FAQ http://www.talkbass.com/threads/underpowering-cabs.267625/. The Rumble 500 head is rated at 350W at 8 ohms, and 500W at 4 ohms. The cabs have 1000 watts (Program), 500 watts (Continuous) Handling Capability per cab. Is this an underpowered cab situation? Do I likely need an amp capable of supplying 1000 or 2000W to not underpower these cabs? Or trade 'em for some Rumble cabs? I don't think the latter is the answer as the Rumble 410s have the exact same power handling capability as the Bassman Neo cabs.

Or maybe it's the horn? I was running horns at about 50%, so maybe if I turn them off ...
 
#3
I don't have an answer, but I'm intrested in your post based on I usually run a decent amount of bass and I hate cabs farting out (I once bought a Eden 2x12 cab that started farting right above bedroom levels and they had a pretty high wattage rating??) and I'm thinking of picking up some Bassman Neos myself. I would be pretty bummed if they farted out after buying them and a matching head! Hopefully some expert will pipe in.
 
#4
The point of that thread being that so called 'underpowering' of your cabinets is a myth. You should be in perfect shape as your Rumble 500 head is pumping half its power into each cab.

I'm wondering if what you're hearing is the sound of your amp clipping and putting your woofers in distress. At such low levels I wouldn't think so, but you still need to eliminate that posibility first.

I'd ditch your compressor, and run a passive bass. Run all your EQ at noon even though this is not actually 'flat'. Fender's engineers have designed the Rumbles to sound good at this setting. Set your gain at noon too, if this is not too hot. Otherwise back off. Then start raising the master slowly and notice when the woofers start to protest. Do this with each cab. You should be able to reach stage volume with a live loud drummer cleanly and with ease, and sound great doing it too.
 
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#6
I am not experienced with either the amp or speakers specifically, but have some thoughts. It doesn't seem that you have too much low end being boosted to me from what you posted. That's usually the first thing to check. Two 4x10 cabs should be a good match for the head. Do you have 8 ohm cabs? If your cabs are 4 ohm, you can't use them both.
Also have you tried the amp's eq settings to more extremes? You said you've got all four knobs +/- "2 hours" of noon. Have you tried putting bass to about 8:00 and low mid at like 3:00? Take hi mid up to 4:00 and roll highs down to 10:00, etc etc. Maybe truly "flat" for that amp means all eq knobs should be cut, and by having the bass up around 10:30 is just too much boost.
Those would be my suggestions to check first. Otherwise, you just might have a cab problem, and it may just be the way those cabs are, not something damaged. I've played plenty of "Reputable brand, mid-level cabs, great condition" that I wouldn't trade my DIY cabs for. Sometimes your tone is just a bad deal for perfectly fine cabs.
Don't ever worry that you're under-powering your speakers. Always be concerned (if you know your speakers handle way more power than the amp has) about overpowering the amp. Farting has little or nothing to do with either. Farting is a sign of physical limitations. There's more cone movement required than the physical limitations of the speaker will allow in order to reproduce the frequencies at the desired sound pressure level. Low bass is the enemy of high volume unless you have tons of speaker area. Mid bass or low mid is your friend when you need volume and cut-through. When you get louder, lots of low end coming from the stage isn't typically desired anyway.
 
#7
take the grill off your cab. gently push each speaker back and forth. if it easily moves, its fine. if it feels really stiff, you have a blown speaker.
If thats not the case. maybe its the gain structure. However, 9o'clock sounds like a pretty reasonable setting so I doubt thats the case. Hope this helps.
 
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#8
Thanks everyone for your responses. Jamesray - I'll try the gentle speaker push first. Basscooker and Linnin, we are having another rehearsal next Saturday, so I'll get another opportunity to try suggested settings soon. Will post results after various tests ...

Thanks again!
 
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#10
I would think the Fender amps and cabs should play well together, but what do I know. Maybe I was pushing them too hard? I wouldn't think so. I didn't have the head anywhere near cranked. And I purposefully turned down the bass (from noon), as I know that's hard on amps and cabs. But I'll try the other suggestions and see what happens.
 
#11
Search up the "battery test" and do that on both cabs to ensure all drivers are indeed working. Along with the other typical "push the cone" and DCR readings to know you indeed have 4 (or 8) working speakers.

Also, if the Rumble uses the old-school "Fender tonestack", know that it is also by nature bass and treble boosted and mid scooped. Your eq settings are already starting to "un-do" that to some degree, just might need to take them further.

I think GC used comes with some short-term warranty, like 30 days, so check the speakers, and return them if need be soon. A 410 with any appreciable amount of power (150 watts or more) should hang with an acoustic drum kit Assuming there isn't some problem with it.
 
#13
Also, don't rely on the position of any gain or volume knobs as an indication of how much power is used......meaning "halfway up" does not mean you're using "half the power"....at all.

Also, you've got a small enough amp and a large enough amount of speakers, you sure it's not the amp distorting and not the speakers? Check that your input gain isn't too hot.
 
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#14
The first thing I would suggest, if it's possible, would be to try the cabs (first one at a time then together) with another head.
Also, try the head with different cabinets.
Solid state heads with blown input sections can "fart" out.
Just take the cabs to the GC you bought them from and tell them you are shopping for bass heads and want to test them with your cabinets.
Do the same/opposite with the head.
 
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