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Can You Tell The Difference??? ASH vs. ALDER

WHICH IS ALDER? WHICH IS ASH?

  • 1-A and 2-A are Alder, 1-B and 2-B are Ash.

    Votes: 17 15.7%

  • 1-A and 2-A are Ash, 1-B and 2-B are Alder.

    Votes: 48 44.4%

  • I can hear a difference between the "1" recordings, but not the "2" recordings

    Votes: 16 14.8%

  • I can hear a difference between the "2" recordings, but not the "1" recordings

    Votes: 3 2.8%

  • I can't hear a difference between any of them!

    Votes: 24 22.2%
  • Total voters
    108
#641
Tone is most definitely produced by the density of my head.

I thought I heard a very subtle difference in clips A, but then I thought I heard a very small difference in clips B too, so I guess in this experiment I'm pretty unreliable.

This means I'm free to commission a bass made from whatever I want. I'll never hear the difference anyway. :hmm:
 
#642
I'm a bit late for the party, but I was looking for stuff to help me decide on a j body. The scrap lumber test was a disaster for me, this one gave mixed results. I absolutely picked the A1 example as the one I liked most and as being different. :hyper: On the other hand I did think I heard a difference in the other 2 clips too. :bawl: So this helped me in making a choice for a swamp ash body, and on the other hand helps me rationalise away the importance of that choice. OK, now for the fingerboard ...
 
#643
Matthijs said:
I'm a bit late for the party, but I was looking for stuff to help me decide on a j body. The scrap lumber test was a disaster for me, this one gave mixed results. I absolutely picked the A1 example as the one I liked most and as being different. :hyper: On the other hand I did think I heard a difference in the other 2 clips too. :bawl: So this helped me in making a choice for a swamp ash body, and on the other hand helps me rationalise away the importance of that choice. OK, now for the fingerboard ...
Click to expand...

I think I posted a test thread with rosewood vs. maple. If I wasn't so lazy I would find it for you. :smug:
 
#647
I "educated guessed" correctly, but my personal experience is that I can hear more of a difference between Ash & Alder when they're teamed with a top wood of sufficient width to not be simply for looks. For example, I took one of my Spector Euro Bolt-On DLXs (equal measures Flame Maple top and Alder back) to compare to a similarly-designed late '90s USA Bolt-On with a Flame Maple top but Ash back that my local Guitar Center purchased used (and quickly sold, I was saddened to learn - she was a beaut!) to evaluate this very point (both have 3-piece Graphite Reinforced Maple Necks with Rosewood fretboards).

After a good amount of playing through the same amp with the same pickups & setting and no Active EQ boost/cut, I found that I as well as several of the staff and even a few customers could hear the difference between the two. It was certainly minimal and I'm sure on the stage of your average, non hi-fi FOH club it would be blasted out of existence, but the studio for something Bass-driven, in the front of the mix and well-produced? I'm sure some people besides me would be able to tell the difference. I know *I* can, especially with more current USA Bolt-Ons that now have a Mahogany back (one of the many reasons I've stuck with the Euro Bolt-Ons... I'm not a fan of the tone of Maple & Mahogany paired together, which I know well having played a Bass near-exclusively of that combo for 5 years). No grandiose statements to end this post, just the results of my own interesting experiments in this field as well. :)
 
#649
EagleMoon said:
I think wood differences are much more obvious on a passive bass than an active bass, and may be the resonance and mid tones felt and heard mainly by the player. To me, alder brings out the mids while ash tends to suck out the mids. But that's in general. A good quality piece of wood isn't going to make as much difference to tone as a crappy piece of wood will.

That being said, the first two sound like the ash bass to me.
Click to expand...

I strongly believe it's the fretboard woods, and not at All the body. The mids are "sucked" out of ash basses, usually because ash bodies feature maple fretboards, which are brighter than rosewood, usually featured with alder bodies.
 
#651
FWIW, I couldn't hear a damn difference in any of the clips that was definitive. I liked the tone in each. About the only methodological gripe I had - the bass player designed the experiment, and it is entirely possible (indeed, almost certain) that the playing was different between 2a and 2b. To really test this scientifically, you'd need a robot calibrated to play the basses perfectly identically in each take, AND a lot more samples.

The experiment proves, more than anything, the power of suggestion when it comes to tone. Which is pretty cool.

I think it would be interesting to plot the incidence of getting offended by the experimenter's deception with the listener's political inclinations.
 
#653
This is bizarre, and I'm also getting myself in knots. I did the "other thread test" first, the alder/rosewood vs ash/maple one an thence came here for this one. First off, and please don't kick me for a bit of a criticism, but both quizzes had info that spoiled a true-doubleblind (or even single-blind) test. Please, don't beat me up; both were fun. Anyhoo, here's my story:

The other test thread - I "think" (results not revealed) blind #3 could be alder/rosewood but would also be unsurprised if all three were in fact the same sample.

This thread test - I scrolled past all the blurb as quickly as and just listened. I thought 1a and 1b different, 2a was same bass as 1b and 2b I couldn't be sure (by elimination, presumably same as 1a). Less confidently, 1a was ash and 1b/2a were alder. Then I went back up to your poll and couldn't see an option to match what I thought I heard. Went straight to post #79 for the reveal.

Just as I was starting to think body wood's nothing and I can re-buy those ply-basses I sold, it turns out I might have the hearing of a youthful canine. Hmm, if the other thread does turn out to have a "they're all the same soundclip" <twist>, then I'll really worry.
 
#654
-=DanAtkinson=- said:
I think I posted a test thread with rosewood vs. maple. If I wasn't so lazy I would find it for you. :smug:
Click to expand...

Well thanks, I found the thread and I'm ready to be humiliated once again.

My choice is between a ebony or epoxied rosewood fretless board, I guess I can't bother you to put up one of those? :D

Of course it's not all about sound in that choice, but also playabilty and feel. Can't test that over the internet can you?
 
#655
I've only just noticed this thread and I really like these kind of posts. The blind tests can take out peoples prejudice about these things.

The funny thing was, I tried to do the test before looking to the answer. My gut feeling appeared to be right. I know this is really easy to say when you can allready see the answer, but my gut was right. The 1A was definetely Ash. More lows and highs (and high mids). 2A was alder to my ears, the sweet round low mid sound that sits perfectly in the mix to my ears. The 1B and 1A sounded a lot like alder both, but I thought that one had to be ash, so I said to myself: if one has to be ash, it would be 1B. But apperantly my gut feeling was right, both 1B and 2B were alder.

I stopped trying to convince people my belief that wood is important for the tone. I know a lot of people don't think so, but I cant understand that people with a lot of experience with basses can still believe that wood is not important. I know that every piece of alder is different and every piece of ash is different, but you have in these differences, similarities to within all the pieces of alder an similarities within all the pieces of ash.

In real life i've heard this with all the ash and alder basses I've played and I also think the fretboard wood matters a lot.

I've played alder and ash bodied basses that sounded dead when played acousticly. No matter what pickup of strings you put in or on them, they sounded dead. I also wonder, is there any well respected builder of basses that really believes that wood is of no importance? I know a lot of good builders go through a lot trouble to select the good pieces of wood. I remember for example reading an article by roger sadowsky where he says the bass is first and foremost an acoustic instrument. This is also my opinion on this subject.
 
#658
I believe you, Alfik; it's just an indication of how close the three sounded. The "catchout" in this thread did make me wonder if yours might have one. Whatever your result, right or wrong, I heard nothing more than a whisper of difference, if at all. This thread seemed to have more for my ears to lock onto and that may just be that the control variables were not as ironed out in this case.
 
#659
After being on TB for some time now, I too wonder about some of these debates. The bottom line is if it sounds good it sounds good. If you want a bass made from Alder, get one. If you want one from ash, get one. The choices today are many and they are ours. I have basses made from ash, alder, nato, basswood, and mahagony (spelling?)and I like them all. I prefer maple boards but rosewood and ebony and other types sound good as well. I say if it makes a difference to YOU the player, then it makes a difference. None of us wants to play on something we don't like and these days we don't have to.
 
#660
I'll give you a Mahogany Sterling vs a Ash Sterling Musicman... you WILL tell the difference, Alder vs Ash? Pretty close

WOW does Mahogany darken up the tone, its a HUGE difference.

Thanks for this thread, helped me out a bit.
 

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