Double Bass CANCEL New EUB Day or "Some People DO Learn".

[rickwolff]

My first EUB was a 5-string Eminence. I think it's a shame that Mark wasn't able to get these back into production. They're nice basses. I ended up selling it because, nice as it was, it seems there is nothing as nice as a decent Double Bass. My current (and I hope, last) DB is a Shen Hybrid, which plays beautifully and gets enthusiastic compliments on my sound. (I know, "sound comes from the fingers", but that's only part of the equation.)

Down the road a year or two, and the old 'EUB Itch' struck again. This time it was a BSX Allegro. Another nice bass and another EUB that can't keep up with the 'real thing'.

Next, it was a Palatino. This one has to win the 'bang for the buck' award. I don't remember what I paid for it, but I'm pretty sure it was well south of a grand. Maybe should have kept that one (but, of course, I didn't.)

Since moving back to my old hometown of Mpsl/St. Paul a couple of years ago, I entered a total Gig Desert. I was hoping it might be a 'Gig Dessert', but although I had played regularly here some 20 years ago, it turns out Thomas Wolfe was right when he said 'You can never go home again'. Many of the musicians I worked with are now gone, and the few that are left have a firm grip on the few remaining gigs.

Sidebar: I have come up with an occasional gig, subbing in an every-other-week gig that is 45 minutes away and pays $25 (or is it $30). But, hey, that's EACH.

Last week I did a little 'garage session' with two very talented local musicians (1 hour away). Again, they were thrilled with the sound I got from the Shen through an Ischell Air Mic and my Genzler Acoustic Pro (Gollihur Model). Unfortunately, by the time I got home, I was exhausted. I attributed that to lugging that overgrown cello and an amp - even though the amp is only 29 pounds. Now I have an additional explanation. After coughing for the last 4 months, I went back to the doctor who diagnosed 'walking pneumonia'. I figured I only had two choices: quit walking or get a lighter bass.

Hence, the order for an 'open-box' Stagg from Guitar Center. And before you start any anti-GC flaming, I have to say they treated me very well by buying some of the equipment I hadn't been able to sell through other channels - Including on this website - just sayin.

So, is this how it ends? Not with a bang but with a whimper? Who knows. I do have one more trick up my sleeve if this doesn't work out.

 

[lurk]

Oh man. Hang in there. I'm a former midwesterner and have memories of a pretty good scene in Minneapolis. Too bad. I miss your compulsive and informative reports on bass equipment. My 2 cents is that you won't be happy with any fake upright and your exhaustion has nothing to do with the weight of your bass, but with your illness. If you're really concerned about the schlep, consider a tiny amp like the Double 4 or Traynor 6.

 

[ted burik]

I hear you, Rick. Life certainly can throw a lot of curve balls as we get older.

I’ve always appreciated how well you play upright and your incredible tone. I’m sure I’ve listened to just about all of the audio you’ve posted on TB. You’ve literally helped me improve my technique and tone just by listening/watching your playing. I’m now even more impressed that you get that marvelous tone with a Shen hybrid—I might have to rethink the value of those basses

I’ve also owned several EUBs over the years but always return to my upright without regret. For what it’s worth, when I want to travel light, I bring my trusty GR Bass 112 Cube combo—it’s just 19lbs and I get a consistently decent acoustic tone through it.

 

[rickwolff]

Oh man. Hang in there. I'm a former midwesterner and have memories of a pretty good scene in Minneapolis. Too bad. I miss your compulsive and informative reports on bass equipment. My 2 cents is that you won't be happy with any fake upright and your exhaustion has nothing to do with the weight of your bass, but with your illness. If you're really concerned about the schlep, consider a tiny amp like the Double 4 or Traynor 6.

Thanks, Lurk. And yes, I have pretty good memories of the scene in MPLS as well. I hate becoming a grouchy old man, but maybe some of that is due to my illness also (and, as the Dr pointed out, to recent stress I've been under).

I do have a lighter amp that weighs about 11 pounds and will cover most anything I do. Far more than the Double Four or Bass Cub Pro, both of which I had and sold. I also have an end-pin wheel for my bass.

Anyway, thanks so much for the encouragement. It means a lot.

 

[Wasnex]

The EUB I chose was an NS Design USA series 6-string. FYI, the current EU6 us almost identical.

I asked the military band I was in to buy it and it was over $7K with a flight case. I didn't expect it to sound like an an actual upright. I did however perform some experiments with muting material to see if I could nudge it in the right direction. I considered the experiments an utter failure. My observation is that I could adjust the mutes to dampen the strings along a certain range of the neck, but it would severely degrade the sound on the rest of the neck. Since I play up and down the neck, I didn't find this useful. Instead I decided to embrace to natural voice of the bass. FYI, this is what I recommend you do as well.

I did lot's of gigs were I switched between bass guitar, upright, and electric upright. I typically favored the electric upright for certain ballads and modern jazz. I remember doing one gig were the stage was rather small, so there was only enough room for one bass. I chose to do the gig on electric upright even though most of the repertoire was jazz standards. I did my best to use technique to modify the way notes speak, but of course there is only so much you can do.

After the concert we had a reception with the audience. Some of them expressed significant curiosity in the NS Design. They were not sure if it was actually a bass, although they agreed it sounded like a bass. They said it fit the music just fine and thought it sounded great.

What I learned is the different sounds of the three basses mattered a lot more to me than either my peers in the band or the audience. As long as I played well, the others seemed rather unconcerned with which instrument I chose. However since it mattered to me, I continued using all three basses whenever it was logistically reasonable.

I use one finger per fret on bass guitar. Part of my motivation for getting the EUB was to support practicing double bass fingering during a period when I was playing primarily bass guitar. Other motivators: 1. I thought EUB would be useful for the jazz combo background gigs I did on a regular basis (it was). 2. I tried multiple times to get comfortable on fretless bass guitar and my intonation would never settle. I was instantly comfortable on the NS Design and IMHO it sounds more like a fretless BG than double bass...actually why I chose the NS Design over the Eminence or other options. As you probably know, the EUB that most closely emulates the sound and playing experience of a double bass is the high end Yamaha Silent Basses

 

[Don Kasper]

doctor who diagnosed 'walking pneumonia'

Well, what other form of pneumonia do jazz bassists suffer from????
(Sorry...I couldn't resist.)
Feel better soon, rick - just stay in a "2 feel" for a few days/choruses.
(Sorry...I couldn't resist.)
I'll show myself out now.

 

[rickwolff]

I hear you, Rick. Life certainly can throw a lot of curve balls as we get older.

I’ve always appreciated how well you play upright and your incredible tone. I’m sure I’ve listened to just about all of the audio you’ve posted on TB. You’ve literally helped me improve my technique and tone just by listening/watching your playing. I’m now even more impressed that you get that marvelous tone with a Shen hybrid—I might have to rethink the value of those basses

I’ve also owned several EUBs over the years but always return to my upright without regret. For what it’s worth, when I want to travel light, I bring my trusty GR Bass 112 Cube combo—it’s just 19lbs and I get a consistently decent acoustic tone through it.

Thank you for the kind words, Ted. I'm surprised and very humbled that you feel my postings have been helpful.

 

[bherman]

I can relate, I own both a Shen Hybrid and an Eminence EUB, much as I love the sound and feel of the Shen, at 70 yrs old I don't enjoy dragging it around. Right now the Eminence is in the shop, trying to see if I can get it a bit more comfortable to play at lower action. I'm relatively ok with the sound of it - I use a Realist Lifeline pickup, and decent preamp into a good amp. I'm almost always playing with a drummer and usually pretty loud so the tone difference is acceptable most of the time.

As to lack of gigs, I know from moving that it takes time to get to know people (and for them to get to know you also). For me the gateway was a local blues jam that led to a few bands, then a Craigslist ad for a bluegrass player looiking for a bass player.

 

[bass player 53]

Rick said “After coughing for the last 4 months, I went back to the doctor who diagnosed 'walking pneumonia'. I figured I only had two choices: quit walking or get a lighter bass.”

I’m not a doctor, but maybe a third choice is to drive over to Rochester for a second opinion at the Mayo. Just sayin’

I’ve enjoyed your posts over the years.
Keep up the ‘good fight’.

I have the Eminence, and once well set up, I find it easy to play sitting using
‘the strap’ and short stool.

 

[Ketbass]

“So, is this how it ends? Not with a bang but with a whimper? Who knows. I do have one more trick up my sleeve if this doesn't work out.”

And so does mankind. But that’s a different subject. Congrats on the new Stagg

 

[rickwolff]

I don't see how this fits here, but I just came across this, and it brought back such wonderful memories that I just had to share it. By the way, this is not my current hybrid, but my Shen 7/8 Gemunder, which I had previously.



Be sure to listen on headphones (unless you have really good speakers attached to your computer). Thx

PS Here's the original caption from when I first posted this:

I went over to my pianist-friend Jonathans today to do a recording to test several microphones. It was meant to be a 'technical' kind of thing. But once we were done with that part we kept playing a couple of tunes and really ended up creating something quite wonderful. Listen to Jonathan's solo. He is my favorite pianist. It's like he's composing a beautiful classical piece of music with theme and variations right in the moment. This tune is called Ceora, by the trumpeter Lee Morgan. It is a beautiful, relaxed, flowing Bossa Nova and it's just a real pleasure to play this tune. I hope you enjoy it.

 

[Don Kasper]

Beautiful tune (Ceora), Beautiful Bass Sound (and notes).
IMFO, and I'll fight ya'.

 

[rickwolff]

Beautiful tune (Ceora), Beautiful Bass Sound (and notes).
IMFO, and I'll fight ya'.

Thanks, Don. Good to have you in my corner.

 

[Huy Nguyen]

My first EUB was a 5-string Eminence. I think it's a shame that Mark wasn't able to get these back into production. They're nice basses. I ended up selling it because, nice as it was, it seems there is nothing as nice as a decent Double Bass. My current (and I hope, last) DB is a Shen Hybrid, which plays beautifully and gets enthusiastic compliments on my sound. (I know, "sound comes from the fingers", but that's only part of the equation.)

Down the road a year or two, and the old 'EUB Itch' struck again. This time it was a BSX Allegro. Another nice bass and another EUB that can't keep up with the 'real thing'.

Next, it was a Palatino. This one has to win the 'bang for the buck' award. I don't remember what I paid for it, but I'm pretty sure it was well south of a grand. Maybe should have kept that one (but, of course, I didn't.)

Since moving back to my old hometown of Mpsl/St. Paul a couple of years ago, I entered a total Gig Desert. I was hoping it might be a 'Gig Dessert', but although I had played regularly here some 20 years ago, it turns out Thomas Wolfe was right when he said 'You can never go home again'. Many of the musicians I worked with are now gone, and the few that are left have a firm grip on the few remaining gigs.

Sidebar: I have come up with an occasional gig, subbing in an every-other-week gig that is 45 minutes away and pays $25 (or is it $30). But, hey, that's EACH.

Last week I did a little 'garage session' with two very talented local musicians (1 hour away). Again, they were thrilled with the sound I got from the Shen through an Ischell Air Mic and my Genzler Acoustic Pro (Gollihur Model). Unfortunately, by the time I got home, I was exhausted. I attributed that to lugging that overgrown cello and an amp - even though the amp is only 29 pounds. Now I have an additional explanation. After coughing for the last 4 months, I went back to the doctor who diagnosed 'walking pneumonia'. I figured I only had two choices: quit walking or get a lighter bass.

Hence, the order for an 'open-box' Stagg from Guitar Center. And before you start any anti-GC flaming, I have to say they treated me very well by buying some of the equipment I hadn't been able to sell through other channels - Including on this website - just sayin.

So, is this how it ends? Not with a bang but with a whimper? Who knows. I do have one more trick up my sleeve if this doesn't work out.

View attachment 7437439

Don’t forget you can also have glass jugs filled with water too!

 

[rickwolff]

Well, the Stagg arrived today. It's really quite a well-built instrument (all things considered). Has a really nice finish, Great Gig Bag.

But it was obvious to me why it was returned (and hence sold as an 'open box')

IT HAD ONE DEAL KILLER: THE END PIN RATTLED TERRIBLY, NO MATTER HOW HARD I TIGHTENED IT DOWN.

HOWEVER, I WAS ABLE TO FIX THAT.

It turns out the hole that is drilled through the solid body through which the end pin passes is TOO WIDE. The rattle was coming from inside the bass.

I was able to fix that by removing the plastic plate and wrapping some cloth tape around the endpin so it now fits snug inside the hole. Not TOO snug, it can still slide in and out but it no longer rattles.

HOWEVER: Try as I might, I just couldn't bring myself to like the bass. It's partly the ergonomics, but IT'S MOSTLY THE 'TONE'. It just doesn't sound like a Double Bass. (Do I hear a loud choruse of "I TOLD YOU SO". (Go ahead, Don. You've earned it.

Since my main motivation was ease of transport, I took out my El Capian again and tried that. IT SOUNDS WAY BETTER THAN THE STAGG AND MORE LIKE A DOUBLE BASS.

I once worked for a manager whose mantra was "If you're 80% happy, SHUT UP'. I guess that's where I've ended up.

LASTLY, I pickup up my wonderful DB and played that for a few minutes. HEAVEN.

 

[Don Kasper]

but IT'S MOSTLY THE 'TONE'. It just doesn't sound like a Double Bass. (Do I hear a loud choruse of "I TOLD YOU SO". (Go ahead, Don. You've earned it

ABON - "A Bass, Only Not" has now entered the Gear Junkie lexicon.
I do admire your tenacity and thoroughness in your relentless pursuit of perfection, (or of 80% satisfaction.)

I pickup up my wonderful DB and played that for a few minutes. HEAVEN.

I TOLD YOU SO!

 

[rickwolff]

Don Kaspar, the soul and conscience of Talkbass. (Also, it's a curmudgeonly comedian).

Thanks, Don.

 

[bass player 53]

I had the same ‘rattle’ issue with the foot accessory that was available for the Ampeg Baby Bass. I wrapped electrical tape around the top of the pole that goes inside the bass, and that solved the rattle.

My piano player friend, Manny Valera,
tremendous player from NYC performed years ago in Delray Beach at the Arts Garage with his trio. The bass player rented a Stagg, and had the same reaction. Lesson learned.

 

[bassically_eli]

I find it almost impossible to believe that a metro area of almost 4 million people doesn’t have gigs for bassists. I think you just need to find the right circles and connections.

 

[marcox]

Finances permitting, is there a reason you haven't given the Yamaha SLB a shot? It is regularly touted on TB as the most DB-like of the EUBs.