Cheap Bass Reality Check

[ojutan]

My very first base guitar 20 years ago was a Vision 20 combo and base guitar. Single coils, mesh wood body with black paint, crappy hummy combo. Stopped me from playing it, but what to do? Learned to fix it - other pickup, potentiometers, strings - and during fixing it the truss rod broke apart. On an 100 Euro invest... put glue in the truss rod hole to silence it, put paper under the neck mount to compensate the missing truss rod tension. Living on budget I couldn't afford something more "real" than the another 150 I did invest for repair.

 

[prowla]

10 years ago I snagged a Squire Vintage Modified Jazz bass Guitar Center was blowing out for $200, took it home, set it up, and immediately started using it on a weekly guitar gig for 3-4 songs. The nut was cut perfectly, and the neck felt great, and now it seems that its rosewood fretboard isn't something you find on cheap basses anymore.

For me, its all about the feel of the bass. Everything else is easy enough to fix. Forget about the branding. You like the feel of the neck on your Squire Vintage Modified Jazz, which has a nice looking rosewood fretboard, and you have already upgraded the pickups, wiring, pots, jack, and bridge to your liking. The only issue is weight. Just find yourself a lighter weight jazz body and you should be good to go.

The brand is Squier, squire; it's written on the headstock.

However, my favourite cheap bass is a Rickenbacker 4001S, which I bought for £200.
(OK, it was in 1977, though...)

 

[Cutter8]

The brand is Squier, squire; it's written on the headstock.

Autocorrect apparently doesn’t care.

 

[petermwright]

A modern "high end" Squier (high in their lineup at least) is every bit as good of a musical instrument as most of the vintage Fenders - it's certainly better made (with CNC machining and all) - there are also a lot of other basses made in Asian factories nowadays that are that good (or better). The reality check is that the best Custom Shop Fender is only a marginal improvement from there.

This is something I've been thinking about - how much difference is there really between a modern Squier and a vintage Fender? I don't really know the answer, but find myself wondering if it's "not much".

I have an MIA jazz I bought new 2010, back when I thought that it was important to get a higher end instrument, and I recently acquired a Squier CV 60's fretless jazz. Surprisingly little difference in quality between the two, and in terms of things that matter to me, hardly anything, really. The pickups sound very similar. The MIA Jazz has a satin finish on the neck, whereas the Squier is gloss poly, which I know would bother some people, but doesn't bother me.

Fender have been trying to further and further refine their higher end models for years, finding bits and pieces to change and 'improve', making pickups less noisy etc. But when you compare a vintage Fender without those refinements to a Squier, how much difference is there?

I acknowledge the pickups sound different, but the pickups in higher end modern Fenders don't sound like the vintage ones anyway (at least mine doesn't). However, I just got a set of SD Antiquity II pickups second hand and put them in the Squier, and it sounds amazing, much better than the MIA Jazz.

A Squier will be made of 'less desirable' woods, too. I don't want to start a debate about what difference that makes, but... yeah, I'm not too worried about that.

 

[39-Bassist]

I built my basses for under $500 each, and used some really quality parts...

LQ II bridge, SPB-1 PU, P-bass alder body, VM Maple w/blocks Jazz neck, Dunlops.

Love the feel and tones.

 

[Rick Penrose]

Who else has taken a cheaper bass and invested time, effort and $ into making them sound like better instruments to the point where buying a more expensive bass feels like a step backwards?

Take this with a grain of salt please - I'm a meat-and-potatoes bassist who's recently gotten back into bass-as-primary instrument after gigging guitar for decades. Bass gigs I've been picking up have been mostly simple fare bar blues, soul, rock deals ranging from SRV to Marvin Gaye to Otis Redding to Tom Petty.

10 years ago I snagged a Squire Vintage Modified Jazz bass Guitar Center was blowing out for $200, took it home, set it up, and immediately started using it on a weekly guitar gig for 3-4 songs. The nut was cut perfectly, and the neck felt great, and now it seems that its rosewood fretboard isn't something you find on cheap basses anymore.

OTOH, it's a heavy bass, even for a jazz (or P-bass) style body, and all the electronics were pretty not-great. The electronics were an easy fix - I pulled out the soldering iron and replaced wiring, pots, jack and pickups about a year into owning it.

The bridge was last - I found a Gotoh hi-mass one in a local tech's used-parts drawer for $5 plus my old bridge.

Next at bat, if I keep it, will probably be a higher-ratio tuner key upgrade.

Now, there's been some interest from other bassists who've used it at jams I've hosted, and I might have an opportunity to upgrade to a slightly more expensive, and lighter weight bass.

Problem is "slightly more expensive" will still probably mean a pickup upgrade at least - not a fan of stock pickups on anything I've tried. And I'm not sure anything I've tried outside of one feels better - most feel worse, so I'd have to trust that a setup will get it done. Then there's the whole unknown-to-me-newer-fretboard-material thing (and while I love J basses, I don't love maple neck J basses).

So has anyone else had a similar experience? Am I making too much of a thing out of this? What did you end up doing and was it a good choice?

View attachment 4822804

Did this just recently. I bought a Sire P5 that sounded good, but I dropped a Delano pickup and a tone styler in it and WOW! The bass came alive and is now my main....plays way above its price points, has a ton of different sounds, and I has a good time making the mods! Highly recommended!

 

[sxaxsx]

Now, there's been some interest from other bassists who've used it at jams I've hosted, and I might have an opportunity to upgrade to a slightly more expensive, and lighter weight bass.

If other bassists have played it and liked it enough to ask about buying it then it might be special enough to keep it. Ignore the name on the headstock, if everyone who touches it falls in love that is testament enough. On the other hand I personally don't believe there is much magic about a CNC made Squier, what makes that bass special is the work you put into it, and you could put the same amount of work into a new bass and maybe even make that one better.

 

[kodiakblair]

My cheap bass reality check hit 8 years back.

Purchased a simple P-bass for under £80 new. Bass turned up with a great feeling neck, no high frets, no rough edges.
Tuners held their tune and the bridge does both intonation and string heights. Stock 250k mini pots turned freely and quietly, 0.068 uf cap was a nice mid point between standard 0.047uf and the 0.01uf I normally go for. Bass also shipped with one of the sweet single coils I've had the pleasure of hearing Heck, it even looked great

The joy I got from buying that bass offset the sickening reality that it held it's own against basses costing 20 times as much. I wasn't alone in my thinking as I heard another player say 99% of his needs could be handled by a £120 Harley Benton jazz bass ; for the other 1% he needs his Wal 6 strings

My opinion hasn't changed since then; bass is still stock/ no adjustments have been necessary. I can't even claim I got lucky as I've picked up several of those cheapies, every one has been up to scratch

Another cheap bass reality check was having £15 to 18k tied up in basses I no longer play

 

[Rib 13]

I just did a whole video on this topic a few weeks ago

Rib13 Bass (and Weirdness) YouTube Channel

 

[bigdaddybass12]

Slightly more expensive? Remember all the indo basses are made in the same location, some of the same parts, same wood source. A new lighter bass may be a downgrade from your current bass. Especially if the current bass neck is stable. I once serviced some equipment at a mattress manufacturer. I watched expensive and inexpensive mattresses being made side by side. Same people, same tools, some of the same parts. At the end a person had a box with the big ‘name brand’ labels that are ironed on. In other words my $300 bass may be almost the same as your $1000 bass other than the finish. Maybe a better QC. GC usually has several so You can hand pick a good one. That is why sometimes you find a killer $300 bass.

 

[groooooove]

Love it! Now I need to practice a whole lot more to be half as good, and, of course, go out and buy a 6er.

well, if you do buy a 6, definitely the "beat to hell old carvin" and modify with custom pickups/pre is going to be the absolute best bang for the buck, just like my sunburst bass in that video.

that bass really started out as me thinking "i bet you i can get that sound on a tight budget." I honestly planned on using the bass to keep in my classroom, rather than lug back and fourth my other basses. It's hard to say it's my favorite bass, but it seems to be the best sounding of them.

which further proves the point, my budget bass became my best sounding by doing careful mods

 

[bigdaddybass12]

My cheap bass reality check:
The joy I got from buying that bass offset the sickening reality that it held it's own against basses costing 20 times as much. I wasn't alone in my thinking as I heard another player say 99% of his needs could be handled by a £120 Harley Benton jazz bass ;

You can’t say this on here!! You will be disowned by the gear snobs!!

 

[kodiakblair]

You can’t say this on here!! You will be disowned by the gear snobs!!

Was being a 'gear snob' got me into this mess

Went from

" £79 for a P-bass ! it must be terrible."

to

" Man , this is sweet; where's my TIs"

after just 5 minutes play

 

[Mike Sorr]

I happened to have an extra Allparts P bass neck in my "extraneous gear" pile that I can't even remember how I got, and decided to look for a cheap PJ body to use with it. I found this black Squire PJ that I won for like $50 bucks on eBay and slapped on the neck which already had Gotoh tuners on it. I have to tell you, I wasn't expecting much. I wanted a bass that I could leave out on a stand and not worry if the cats knocked it over. To my shock and amazement it's one of the best sounding basses I own. Maybe I just got lucky with a good set of stock Squire pickups, maybe the previous owner upgraded them and didn't say anything, but this bass is a monster. As an added bonus it's also the lightest bass I own at around 7.5 pounds. I didn't even bother upgrading the bridge and may just leave it as is. It's easily the cheapest bass I've ever owned and I find myself reaching for it over my US made Fenders.

 

[MVE]

Forget bridges and tuners…

The best “upgrade” you can do to any instrument is a top-notch fret leveling and polishing.

 

[Nev375]

My #1 is a $1200 Squier I bought brand spanking new for $200.

Of course $600 of that is a very special Moses Graphite fanned fret neck.

It was a perfectly fine bass when I brought it home. Played beautifully. Nothing to complain about at all.

Unfortunately it met me. I believe that only the strap buttons are the only stock unmolested parts on it.

I know. I'm not right in the head, but it's been my main for almost a decade now. I'm still happy.

 

[eastcoasteddie]

I don’t think I could mod this *cheap* bass any further…

2014 Squier Affinity Jazz V body (bought complete bass for $120, defretted and sold the neck for $100 - $20 total cost for body)

2016 Squier VM Jazz V neck ($120…?)
Hipshot Kickass bridge ($65)
Hipshot HB7 tuning machines ($130)
Hipshot string retainer ($13)
2 Carvin/ Kiesel HB MM pickups ($200 at that time)
Duncan STC-2BOC preamp ($59)

About $600 give or take $10 here & there…

Sounds great, plays great…but it’s still a *cheap* bass…no getting around that.

 

[getBAK]

I've gone both ways. I toured the US and did multiple records with a Peavey Foundation Fretless - I think it was $299 new when I bought it in mid late 90's. Good instrument, but not great. I've done the Glarry build. Today I have a collection of pro-quality stuff.

In general I've found that while modding a cheap instrument can make it better, you're still chasing the good stuff. Instruments, like cars are not a collection of parts, they are a system intended to work together. Higher quality instruments have a system of parts, and better quality control. Yes, you can find a gem of a Squire, but if you put 10 of them in a room there will be significant variation between them. Several of them will probably be out of spec somewhere. Put 10 Yamaha NE2's in a room, all be good and difficult to tell the difference between.

A good instrument system (as opposed to a bunch of surplus parts) with decent QC- generally means a new bass will cost $750+.
By the time you mod out a $200 squire, assuming your labor is worth something it's easy to dump $500 into a bass.. while not knowing what you get at the end. In that respect, modding really doesn't make sense.
Some people enjoy working on instruments and the thrill of the hunt... that's a different discussion.
For me, it's not worth playing around with cheap stuff anymore.

<addendum> when I discuss buying "pro-quality" basses, I am NOT talking about a $10K Fodera. I'm talking about top of the line (non signature) instruments from major manufacturers. Price point of $700-$2000
Most of the time if you're spending over $2000, it's for a pretty finish. That's fine too, but not what I want.

 

[Engle]

Who else has taken a cheaper bass and invested time, effort and $ into making them sound like better instruments to the point where buying a more expensive bass feels like a step backwards?

Take this with a grain of salt please - I'm a meat-and-potatoes bassist who's recently gotten back into bass-as-primary instrument after gigging guitar for decades. Bass gigs I've been picking up have been mostly simple fare bar blues, soul, rock deals ranging from SRV to Marvin Gaye to Otis Redding to Tom Petty.

10 years ago I snagged a Squire Vintage Modified Jazz bass Guitar Center was blowing out for $200, took it home, set it up, and immediately started using it on a weekly guitar gig for 3-4 songs. The nut was cut perfectly, and the neck felt great, and now it seems that its rosewood fretboard isn't something you find on cheap basses anymore.

OTOH, it's a heavy bass, even for a jazz (or P-bass) style body, and all the electronics were pretty not-great. The electronics were an easy fix - I pulled out the soldering iron and replaced wiring, pots, jack and pickups about a year into owning it.

The bridge was last - I found a Gotoh hi-mass one in a local tech's used-parts drawer for $5 plus my old bridge.

Next at bat, if I keep it, will probably be a higher-ratio tuner key upgrade.

Now, there's been some interest from other bassists who've used it at jams I've hosted, and I might have an opportunity to upgrade to a slightly more expensive, and lighter weight bass.

Problem is "slightly more expensive" will still probably mean a pickup upgrade at least - not a fan of stock pickups on anything I've tried. And I'm not sure anything I've tried outside of one feels better - most feel worse, so I'd have to trust that a setup will get it done. Then there's the whole unknown-to-me-newer-fretboard-material thing (and while I love J basses, I don't love maple neck J basses).

So has anyone else had a similar experience? Am I making too much of a thing out of this? What did you end up doing and was it a good choice?

View attachment 4822804

I would get a lighter body and transfer all the parts.

 

[swink]

I don’t think I could mod this *cheap* bass any further…

LED lights, mirrors and tiger stripes??