Chinabacker 4005

[Ric5]

This bass is fooling nobody, it looks nothing like a legit 4005. The TRC should say 'Dickenbacker' based on that top horn. If these Rick copies were close to the real deal, I'd own one. I'm still holding out for a dead on C64 copy. That's when I'll scoop one up. There's no need to get worked up since odds are you aren't going to see to it that these copies are taken down.

The Chinese copies are never "dead on" ...

 

[Pumpkin]

How would you fee if you owned the original (and paid a premium for it) and the market became flooded with cheap knock offs?

I'd feel like there were a lot of people who wished they were me, but weren't. As an owner of the real deal, I'd have that feather in my cap.

As for the US thing- Rickenbakcer is located in the US, so it seemed pertinent.

 

[Ric5]

I agree that buying a copy of a bass thats been out of production for 50 years isnt theft. Also for consideration is the fact that rics will sell for high prices regardless of whatever copies are made, because only a ric is a ric!

actually more like 30 years ... but the point is still valid

 

[johnson79]

Woody, out of curiosity, does Rimini make this bass in any finish OTHER than "Mother of Toilet Seat"? It's not a bad design, but that finish is a real deal-breaker for me.

ITALIA GUITARS

Looks like they're still available in a handful of colors. I actually really dig the pearloid!!

 

[Gorn]

I'm sorry - is this TB US edition? I'm not in the US at the moment.

It's a forum with mostly Americans and you know that. The OP is American. The bass being copied is American. Your profile doesn't say where you are.


We've established it's not illegal in America. Please cite laws from other countries where it's illegal to buy counterfeit, since this is TB World Edition. I like to learn new things.

 

[Anachronism]

It's a forum with mostly Americans and you know that. The OP is American. The bass being copied is American. Your profile doesn't say where you are.


We've established it's not illegal in America. Please cite laws from other countries where it's illegal to buy counterfeit, since this is TB World Edition. I like to learn new things.

You haven't established that it is legal to knowly buy counterfeit goods for personal use in the US. At most you've established that it's not an enforcement priority.

 

[Gorn]

You haven't established that it is legal to knowly buy counterfeit goods for personal use in the US. At most you've established that it's not an enforcement priority.

I didn't claim it's legal. If I did, I misspoke. I hereby make no claims regarding the legality of knowingly buying counterfeit merchandise.

However, @DigitalMan claimed it's illegal.

A claim has been made. I withhold belief until evidence is provided. I'm ready to be convinced.

 

[Ric5]

How would you fee if you owned the original (and paid a premium for it) and the market became flooded with cheap knock offs?

No problem at all ...

 

[Coolhandjjl]

I think that it's important to note that this model is not in production. That seperates it from the majority of copies/ imitations in a very meaningful way. @DigitalMan out of curiosity, how do you feel about pedal clones of in production/ out of production pedals?

I think if any product has been out of production for a couple decades, it should loose all protections and be fair game. How can a company justifiably claim actual financial losses if they aren't even manufacturing and selling any anymore?

 

[Anachronism]

I think if any product has been out of production for a couple decades, it should loose all protections and be fair game. How can a company justifiably claim actual financial losses if they aren't even manufacturing and selling any anymore?

This I generally agree with. According to Paul's book, it has been 33 years since a 4005 was made, and I have no objection to the 4005 aspects, such as body shape, that aren't in use on current products becoming public domain.

 

[Ric5]

These 2 have caught my interest

2016 New + Factory + Rickenback custom 6 strings 4003 bass guitar black ricken bass Free Shipping 6 string 4003 fireglo bass-in Guitar from Sports & Entertainment on Aliexpress.com | Alibaba Group

Newest 2015 new unfinished 4 String 4003 Electric Bass Kit Guitar through body in wooden no paint top quality 151012-in Guitar from Sports & Entertainment on Aliexpress.com | Alibaba Group

 

[fdorn]

You haven't established that it is legal to knowly buy counterfeit goods for personal use in the US. At most you've established that it's not an enforcement priority.

Invalid Link Removed

 

[Ric5]

This is an interesting one

 

[snarebear]

How many of you use avatars or pics on your computer that are copyrighter or owned by someone else, or have downloaded music? Girlfriend have a knock off bag? Have a chinese computer with stolen technology used in its building of it? Perform copywrited music for your monetary gain? Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

 

[Londo Molari]

I've got an Italia Rimini, it's a very good bass in it's own right. Not a Rick 4005, but it has a nice Rick sort of vibe, the last time I played a 4005 was in 1972, one of those light show versions and as I recall it was pretty awful. I'd go for a Rimini over the Chickenbacker, you could always put a Rick style pick guard on it and it really would look the part.

 

[bassstrangler]

How would you fee if you owned the original (and paid a premium for it) and the market became flooded with cheap knock offs?

I own a Dillion Rick copy(tribute). It is a really nice bass. Compared to a Rick it is a cheap knockoff. Compared to other basses that were the same price it blows them out of the water.

What happened is originally I was not a fan of Rickenbacker, my friend had this Dillion and needed to get rid of it. It was brand new and played and sounded great. Not being a fan of Rickenbackers I became one because of this Dillion. I sought out a Rick and played a few and love them now.

I decided to sell the Dillion to help get money towards a new Rick. After reading this thread I took down the sale. Why? Until I get my actual Rick I'll keep this fine instrument. Is it the real deal? No! Is it a fine instrument that resembles a Rick? Yes! Do I feel like I am hurting anyone's business less by owning it? No, it actually helped Rickenbacker sell me a bass in the near future.

 

[InhumanResource]

How would you fee if you owned the original (and paid a premium for it) and the market became flooded with cheap knock offs?

Just fine? There's cheap knockoffs of just about everything floating around...clothing, accessories (handbags, wallets, watches). If I spend 8k on a Breitling watch and then someone buys a knockoff in times square that kinda sorta looks like it, what do I care?

 

[DigitalMan]

I get it folks. No consequences. Everyone does it. Abstract harm.

Proceed.

 

[Paul Boyer]

"U.S. Patents filed after June 8, 1995 expire 20 years from the date of filing. U.S. Patents filed prior to June 8, 1995 expire 17 years from the date of issue, or 20 years from the first non-provisional application in the family - whichever is later." - some patent focused blog. I don't feel like digging up the actual statutes right now, nor do I feel like checking to see Rickenbacker's petent filings, but my guess is that a manufacturer would be in the clear for the body. The headstock would definitely still be off limits.

But this is not patent, and it is not copyright. It is trademark. I am not a lawyer (not even on TV!), but the criteria on trademark violations is different and I am not sure that there is any sunset on them. RIC holds trademarks on many of its shapes, features, names, and styles. I don't know for sure, but they probably have the shape of the 4005 protected as well. Just because they haven't made it 30 years (actually, they have on occasion for special customers, IIRC), doesn't mean that they have abandoned protection. What if JH got a wild hair and decided to produce a one-time run? (Yeah, right!)

One thing about trademark that I think is similar to copyright: If you (the producer/author) become aware of someone copying your product without permission (read licensing/leasing/franchising), you must make every effort to notify the copier that he is violating copyright/trademark and needs to cease and desist. If you (the producer) allow some to copy without an agreement/license, and you force others to stop, you lose copyright/trademark protection because you are not claiming the protection equally.

Obviously, this is harder to "enforce" globally as each country has its own laws and enforcement levels that are not nearly the same as those in the U.S. So that is why many of the counterfeits are turned back/confiscated at import - we can enforce these "laws" much easier here. Woe to the U.S. guitar shop that successfully receives these knockoffs (with fake Rickenbacker truss-rod covers or not) and gets a visit from customs agents. The real problem now is that you don't need to have a middleman to get one of these. You order direct from some overseas outfit and it may be unlikely that the non-descript box it comes in gets more than a passing sniff from a talented canine.

One of my beefs is that some of you clowns out there who think it is OK to purchase an "illegal" knockoff like this are the same guys who are fist-pumping "U S A" at sporting events and political rallies. Yea, right.

 

[Axstar]

This is what one of these basses looks like up close:

Argue the legal technicalities all you want, but these things don't look enough like a proper 4005, in my opinion. The body geometry is clumsy, the knob placement is dreadful and the fretboard is some cheap rosewood, whereas it should be lacquered Bubinga or similar.