• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Club Alleva Coppolo (Part V)

Status
Not open for further replies.
#661
Hi Narud,

I'm trying hard to understand the phenomenon you're talking about, and am wondering which particular AC basses your are talking about. I've played a number of early 60s jazz basses, and I can't say that I have found them more suitable for slapping than either my RA5 (alder/maple) or standard 4 (alder/rosewood).

However, being as interested in varied viewpoints any anyone else, what do you ascribe this "note sinking" to? Body and/or neck materials? Weight? Electronics? Or is this what you yourself are trying to sort out?

Or are you in the position of being interested in the buzz, then trying one out and it not meting your expectations?
 
#662
XavidmanX said:
Vision, since you just played both, and have heard both, can you hear what narud is talking about, and/or did you feel/hear any of that when you played them?
Click to expand...

I've played 3 A-C's at this point (Ken's two and the LG5 that Mikebass had for a while) and I hear none of that at all on the LM5 or on the other LG5 I tried. Ken's LG5 has some "give" in the feel, which IMO is part of the authenticity of the vintage feel that bass has. I don't "hear" that give though if that makes any sense. Either way, all 3 of the A-C's I've tried have been very responsive.

Also, narud mentioned that these may not be made to do the "marcus/stanley" hard plucking thing - I really don't see that...I'm a guy that likes to thump/pluck, and I love the marcus thing (I've been playing my heavy ash Celinder for close to a year for reference). While the Celinder has more of a marcus "scoop" to the tone, the LM5 is actually more "meaty" when plucking hard on the G and D strings. (This is more evidence that the A-C's are incredibly even from the G string down to the B string, while on the Celinder the sound gets bigger on each lower string.) I'll know more about this tomorrow morning when I play the LM5 in a mix, but I don't think I'll have any problem at all with my plucks cutting through the mix, while at times the plucks on the Celinder can get lost in the mix because that bass is so bright with less upper mid "bite" on the G string than the LM5.
 
#663
vision said:
I've played 3 A-C's at this point (Ken's two and the LG5 that Mikebass had for a while) and I hear none of that at all on the LM5 or on the other LG5 I tried. Ken's LG5 has some "give" in the feel, which IMO is part of the authenticity of the vintage feel that bass has. I don't "hear" that give though if that makes any sense. Either way, all 3 of the A-C's I've tried have been very responsive.

Also, narud mentioned that these may not be made to do the "marcus/stanley" hard plucking thing - I really don't see that...I'm a guy that likes to thump/pluck, and I love the marcus thing (I've been playing my heavy ash Celinder for close to a year for reference). While the Celinder has more of a marcus "scoop" to the tone, the LM5 is actually more "meaty" when plucking hard on the G and D strings. (This is more evidence that the A-C's are incredibly even from the G string down to the B string, while on the Celinder the sound gets bigger on each lower string.) I'll know more about this tomorrow morning when I play the LM5 in a mix, but I don't think I'll have any problem at all with my plucks cutting through the mix, while at times the plucks on the Celinder can get lost in the mix because that bass is so bright with less upper mid "bite" on the G string than the LM5.
Click to expand...

Cool...thanks for the info. I'm interested to hear your impressions after playing the LM5 live.
 
#664
narud said:
im talking about a specific phenomenon that i find odd to be happening in an instrument like that. at this point ive played more that a couple and to see that across the line is weird. its not a slam, its an observation on the line and its something that i havent experienced in vintage fenders.

imo, its important info to have out there rather than just love fests. its realistic. not everyone is getting to play before buying. and just like what happened with carey, people were buying them without playing and end up in the classifieds. after all the years ive been here and not ever seeing any of jimmy's basses in the classifieds, theyre starting to turn up. if im reading nothing but praise and none of the warts im going to bummed after dropping a ton of cash and then find some stuff i hadnt heard brought up.

we're also not talking about fender or gibson here, these are high end custom luthiers that are relatively new to the game. nobody's trying to turn them into something theyre not;) hell, jimmy told me he'd build me a 20 lb bass if i wanted:D dude's a great builder and super helpful....same experiences ive had with nordstrand.
Click to expand...

Interesting and very true. People should try a particular bass first before buying. I even go back and remember when there were very few if any Sadowskys in the classifieds. You seem to have some good basses and you have given up some what I know to be high end basses which some I played and some I did not. But all in all I agree with you. But there are players with more than a few basses and less than a few. When I see Will Lee live - not on Letterman - he plays a number of different basses. Players like Marcus and Anthony Jackson stay with one. To me any and every bass will have its "warts" that you mentioned. I do not think any bass is perfect. That is why I like the idea of Marcus and Jackson. They work with it for so long it becomes part of them and they make it sound to there personality. They know where the warts are and the good points and work with it. But i am not taking anything from Will. He kicks a$$ with any bass he plays. But getting back to what you are saying you have to know first what you want but it will never be perfect. But you do have some nice basses and let go a few good ones too. Maybe you are searching for that perfect instrument. Let me know when you get it as I might buy it too. AND IM NOT POKING FUN. But the love fest for an instrument usually dies down after a year or two. Its what you bring out of it, after the honeymoon is what makes that bass special. But again I totally agree with you.
 
#665
vision said:
I've played 3 A-C's at this point (Ken's two and the LG5 that Mikebass had for a while) and I hear none of that at all on the LM5 or on the other LG5 I tried. Ken's LG5 has some "give" in the feel, which IMO is part of the authenticity of the vintage feel that bass has. I don't "hear" that give though if that makes any sense. Either way, all 3 of the A-C's I've tried have been very responsive.

Also, narud mentioned that these may not be made to do the "marcus/stanley" hard plucking thing - I really don't see that...I'm a guy that likes to thump/pluck, and I love the marcus thing (I've been playing my heavy ash Celinder for close to a year for reference). While the Celinder has more of a marcus "scoop" to the tone, the LM5 is actually more "meaty" when plucking hard on the G and D strings. (This is more evidence that the A-C's are incredibly even from the G string down to the B string, while on the Celinder the sound gets bigger on each lower string.) I'll know more about this tomorrow morning when I play the LM5 in a mix, but I don't think I'll have any problem at all with my plucks cutting through the mix, while at times the plucks on the Celinder can get lost in the mix because that bass is so bright with less upper mid "bite" on the G string than the LM5.
Click to expand...

this isnt a tone thing. this is a how hard you have to work to get the tone thing. i like the hard plucking/digging in sound but i dont play at the end of the neck to get it. i stay back by the bridge pickup. playing back there and getting that clack required much more right hand effort and attack. you can get it, but you have to work hard to get it out. in that thread about 70's style jazzes where i posted clips of baron,marcus,fima and myself, the clip of myself has that digging/harder touch sound, but im not digging in that hard with my right hand to get it. i had to dig in harder on the basses of jimmys ive tried.
 
#666
esoxhntr said:
Hi Narud,

I'm trying hard to understand the phenomenon you're talking about, and am wondering which particular AC basses your are talking about. I've played a number of early 60s jazz basses, and I can't say that I have found them more suitable for slapping than either my RA5 (alder/maple) or standard 4 (alder/rosewood).

However, being as interested in varied viewpoints any anyone else, what do you ascribe this "note sinking" to? Body and/or neck materials? Weight? Electronics? Or is this what you yourself are trying to sort out?

Or are you in the position of being interested in the buzz, then trying one out and it not meting your expectations?
Click to expand...

i dont know what to attribute it to. i dont know wood, i just play it:D the necks feel rock solid, ive played ac's on the lighter end of the spectrum to the heavy end and i still felt it. it aint the electronics. i bought one of jimmys stompbox pre's that i use with my old fenders and its my favorite pre by far to use with those basses
 
#667
XavidmanX said:
I'm curious, narud...

Can you hear any of that phenomena in Ken's clips, or is it more of a feel thing? Does that make sense?

Vision, since you just played both, and have heard both, can you hear what narud is talking about, and/or did you feel/hear any of that when you played them?

I'm just wondering what another set of ears hears.

I know what narud is talking about, as I've heard it before in "vintage" style instruments, which is why I was shocked when I played Jimmy's basses...especially the one I ended up taking home. Mine is really punchy and the slap tone is nice.

However, I've only played one or two of Jimmy's basses and some of you have played many more.
Click to expand...

its not a hear thing, its a feel thing.
 
#669
esoxhntr said:
Hey Ken,



Nor was I implying that it should, but you have unloaded a nice Celinder and are considering unloading another Sadowsky too. Also, I'd be willing to bet that with the LG5 and LM5 around, your MV5 is getting a little less play time than before. Alleva Coppolo basses do seem to do that... ;)
Click to expand...

+1 to the above!


.....and Narud, you know I love these types of discussions. Nothing wrong with them and I do think they are helpful. I agree that those who love a 13 pound instrument, and love it because of its weight, would probably not be happy with a 9 pound instrument, no matter what the brand.

And while I have felt what you are describing in a variety of other basses (so I do get what you are saying), I personally have not felt that at all in my LM, and only feel what I would call (and as Vision describes) an 'appropriate' amount of that little bit of give in the LG. I assume an LM that is massively heavier than mine would probably 'feel' different. Luckily, for me, the difference in feel would not be a positive relative to the weight cost.:)

I guess I would say be careful on spec'ing out a heavy one and assuming your issue will be fixed. I've played some BOAT ANCHOR Fodera NYC/FClef J's, and they had no more authority, bounce and immediacy than my relatively lightweight LM. Lot's of stuff comes in to play here IMO and painfully IME.
 
#671
Mothra2 - my basses are all about 9.5 lbs, or just over. From what I gather reading the forum(s) here, 7 and 8 lb. basses are considered light, 9 and 10 lb. basses are considered medium, and 11+ lbs. considered heavy. Does that seem to be the general consensus?
 
#672
esoxhntr said:
Mothra2 - my basses are all about 9.5 lbs, or just over. From what I gather reading the forum(s) here, 7 and 8 lb. basses are considered light, 9 and 10 lb. basses are considered medium, and 11+ lbs. considered heavy. Does that seem to be the general consensus?
Click to expand...

That's pretty much how I categorize them. It's kind of like the Goldie Locks thing.... 'this one is too light and thin sounding', 'this one busts my ball's' (if Goldie Locks had balls), and ... 'ah, this one is JUST RIGHT':D
 
#673
esoxhntr said:
.

Okay, just to clarify - are we talking about your regular slapping and popping here, or an aggressive hard attack fingerstyle?
Click to expand...

Narud (Joe) can speak for himself, but I listen to his music quite a bit (I was listening to it while I was skiing at Timberline on Friday) and he has a very hard and fast two-finger technique at the bridge. Joe would not "toot his own horn (bass)" but he is an absolutely phenomenal player and writer.

I see alot of people nitpick instrument and builders that can't really play at all. I'm not saying their comments are invalid (in fact, alot of them are quite perceptive and accurate). Either way, Joe is not in this category. :p

In fact Joe, I think you may be feeling something in the AC basses that alot of people simply wouldn't ever notice due to your particular style/requirements. (I probably wouldn't get it).
 
#674
Wilbyman said:
Narud (Joe) can speak for himself, but I listen to his music quite a bit (I was listening to it while I was skiing at Timberline on Friday) and he has a very hard and fast two-finger technique at the bridge. Joe would not "toot his own horn (bass)" but he is an absolutely phenomenal player and writer.

I see alot of people nitpick instrument and builders that can't really play at all. I'm not saying their comments are invalid (in fact, alot of them are quite perceptive and accurate). Either way, Joe is not in this category. :p

In fact Joe, I think you may be feeling something in the AC basses that alot of people simply wouldn't ever notice due to your particular style/requirements. (I probably wouldn't get it).
Click to expand...

+1 It's clear that the moderate weight typical J spec that Jimmy builds is not to Narud's taste or preference. Nothing wrong with that at all:)
 
#675
Well then, easy to understand why the Alleva Coppolo wouldn't "do it" for him, I think there are better basses for that sort of thing - that Fodera I bought from you could do that pretty well as I recall.

BTW, just listened to a couple of Joe's tracks on Myspace - I really like Lucky Charms :bassist: - but I'm not convinced that an Alleva Coppolo is the right tool for the job, at least not for Joe.
 
#676
esoxhntr said:
Well then, easy to understand why the Alleva Coppolo wouldn't "do it" for him, I think there are better basses for that sort of thing - that Fodera I bought from you could do that pretty well as I recall.

BTW, just listened to a couple of Joe's tracks on Myspace - I really like Lucky Charms :bassist: - but I'm not convinced that an Alleva Coppolo is the right tool for the job, at least not for Joe.
Click to expand...

+1 The tone on that track sounds more like a Sadowsky Modern to me... that big soapbar crammed right next to the bridge fat burp, or like the Tommy Kennedy Fodera thing, which again is that big soap bar pickup placed very close to the bridge. I like it! I'm not hearing much 'single coil J grind' at all, but it sounds darn good!

Joe, IMO a Sadowsky Modern with Nordstand Big Splits, and the blend favoring the bridge pickup, would probably make you cry and go to heaven!!!!
 
#677
esoxhntr said:
Well then, easy to understand why the Alleva Coppolo wouldn't "do it" for him, I think there are better basses for that sort of thing - that Fodera I bought from you could do that pretty well as I recall.

BTW, just listened to a couple of Joe's tracks on Myspace - I really like Lucky Charms :bassist: - but I'm not convinced that an Alleva Coppolo is the right tool for the job, at least not for Joe.
Click to expand...

Joe who?. Would love to hear this to put the subject into context.
Have ye a link...
 
#680
esoxhntr said:
Well then, easy to understand why the Alleva Coppolo wouldn't "do it" for him, I think there are better basses for that sort of thing - that Fodera I bought from you could do that pretty well as I recall.

BTW, just listened to a couple of Joe's tracks on Myspace - I really like Lucky Charms :bassist: - but I'm not convinced that an Alleva Coppolo is the right tool for the job, at least not for Joe.
Click to expand...

thats the fodera which i use about 10 percent of the time because i dont get a chance to play much fusion. however, theres a track up there with my 78 jazz. lusitanos

i pay my rent playing earth wind and fire and the gap band and play a jazz bass 90 percent of the time (my main gigging bass is actually ace of bass's old r.i.) hence, my looking for a 5 string jazz
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back