Compression pedal basic question

[BlueTalon]

A compressor will give you access to that area by basically allowing you to pluck harder if needed

That's what drove me bonkers when I tried using a compressor -- I hate the feeling of plucking harder and not getting a corresponding increase of attack and volume.

 

[revd]

L

That's what drove me bonkers when I tried using a compressor -- I hate the feeling of plucking harder and not getting a corresponding increase of attack and volume.

Increase the attack time to allow transients through by delaying the onset of the compression, and reduce the ratio /increase the threshold to reduce the compression amount.

That's how you adjust a compressor.

 

[BlueTalon]

Increase the attack time to allow transients through by delaying the onset of the compression, and reduce the ratio /increase the threshold to reduce the compression amount.

That's how you adjust a compressor.

I believe you. But until I can hear a demonstration of it, preferably with a good bass player who knows what they're doing and who's a patient instructor, I don't know what I'm missing. Hence, I'm not missing it.

 

[andare]

I believe you. But until I can hear a demonstration of it, preferably with a good bass player who knows what they're doing and who's a patient instructor, I don't know what I'm missing. Hence, I'm not missing it.

Demos are useless for compressors. You have to play through them to feel and hear what they do.

Compressors simply reduce how much your volume does or can swing.

On bass, they can be used to: even out volume across strings and registers on the fretboard, curtail excessively spiky peaks, boost wimpy notes from dead spots, present a robust and more consistent signal to pedals that are dependent on dynamics (like envelope filters, which might be hard to trigger and/or control), keep a consistent volume between plucked and slapped/popped notes.

On guitar they can even out volume and attack between single notes, arpeggios, doublestops and strummed chords when using a clean tone. Any level of dirt, from boost to fuzz, adds compression, as do tube amps as the tubes are cooked. Country players have used intense compression to add sustain to notes and chords as a very audible effect.

In the studio compression is used on everything to ensure instruments stay in their lane, volume-wise, and every note is audible. Reducing the transient, i.e. the sharp and loud attack of a note, results in the note being fatter, which is an effect of compression on bass and drums.

As with everything, how you set an effect is crucial.

Having said that, ignorance can be bliss. Stay away from this and other gear forums

 

[BEADist]

A note that is played loud has a different harmonic content (especially the attack) compared to a note that is played softly. A compressor does not change harmonic content, only volume.

So even if the compressor makes the soft played note as loud as the loud played note, both notes will still sound different. Our brain can still 'translate' which is the soft note and which is the loud played note based on the harmonic content of the note. Therefore a compressor doesn't change the perceived dynamics as much as you would think.

 

[Deleted member 271037]

Compressors can be useful for a lot of stuff:

-Shape the envelope to soften/harden the notes (attack) or make the bass "breathe" with the tempo of the song (release).

-Reign in the dynamic range that your bass and bass amp is capable of but that can cause damage to other types of sound systems/listening devices.

-Reduce strong peaks to preserve headroom and make the bass "sit" better in the mix. Compression = overall louder bass in the mix, especially when recording.

Whether you like compression or not is a different matter. If you like your tone better without compression, great! But unless you have sublime playing technique be prepared for a fight with the engineer every single time you play a gig or record/mix anything in a studio. Well, it's either that or the engineer will most likely sneak in some compression anyway without telling you.

Also, compression is by far the easiest effect to mess up. Compression in the hands of an inexperienced person is more likely to do harm than good. But when done right it should bring MORE life into the bass, not less.

A recorded SVT rig in a mix doesn't sound like a cranked SVT rig in the room. A photograph doesn't look like the real world. Both are processed reproductions of the real thing. How much processing you want/need is partly down to technical limitations and partly down to personal taste.

 

[jschulman]

Man, where did you find this stuff?

Never heard them or of them, very interesting, makes me want more like it.

Oh man both those artists are great. Scott Walker especially, his career arc is amazing. That track is from Scott 4, one of my favorite albums.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

Nothing forcing you to use a compressor if you don’t want to but photography analogies won’t help your bass playing. Maybe a limiter is more to your liking.

 

[BEADist]

Or maybe try an envelope filter

 

[31HZ]

I didn't know that I wanted a compressor "always on" until I listened back to a rehearsal where I was playing through one.

Bam, there it was: easier to hear, more "solid" in the mix, and more like I expect a bass to sound in terms of how it functions within a band context.

In terms of a photo analogy, let's say that you were selecting an image to be the backdrop of an advertisement, over which there would be text and perhaps even other images. It would need a fair amount of processing and tweaking to "look right" in ways that served the finished product for impact, readability, and the desired aesthetic. The image would be the foundation, yet would need to not draw attention to itself in a way that distracted from the cohesive whole of the end result.

The use of a compressor -- much like, say, using curves for color correction in PS -- isn't always intuitive, and requires sensory skills (listening/seeing) as well as an understanding of what the controls do, but can be a very powerful tool that improves the final product without ever calling attention to itself.

 

[LanEvo]

virtually all bass you’ve ever heard on any record would have had some degree of compression and limiting on it.

cranked tube amps (a sound many of us love) will naturally compress quite a bit.

Compression doesn’t have to squash all your dynamics. You can be subtle with it. Try a good compressor and see what you think.

 

[BassBrass]

I'm a photographer and all I can think of is not technical (because one is light and the other is physical vibration) We know when a photograph works. Somehow it says one thing and has some impact vs an image with so many data points it's a documentary if anything.
We know when a bass sound works, you can hear it for one. Using underpowered amps starting out I found out with a compressor I could be heard. Later I found out why and now use a compressor with a clean mix and adjustable attack time (slow). (also watts overpower for headroom)

A compressor regulates a note's amplitude (volume) from attack to decay. A Limiter doesn't even do anything unless there is a volume spike, that's useful for protecting speakers.

Acoustic physical properties add compression also, so you can get used to making a sound in a room with it's own compressive characteristics and adjust your plucking/strumming to the speaker/amp natural envelope (note shape). Tube amps have a compressed feel, also using overdrives. Or old strings, a foam mute. Whatever makes a good picture. too, ah, tie it up

 

[Danny O Danny]

I've only ever intentionally used compression when recording, and primarily on vocals--or if there was a good engineer who applied it to my bass (particularly back in the "slap 'n pop" days). But I never used one for live work. But last week I bought a Cali76 bass compressor pedal, after about a year of considering it, reading reviews, listening to demos, etc. After hooking it up I was able to dial in what I wanted in about 5 minutes. And I must say, I'm very impressed. It doesn't alter my bass sound so much as it just makes it "more" of what it is. It's difficult to explain, and I don't have the technical aptitude or the eloquence of words to describe it in precise terms. It adds an aliveness and punch. Upper register notes really sing. But it's subtle (at least the way I have it set). I can still use dynamics in how I play each note. Would an audience member or bandmate notice if I turned it off? Probably not consciously. It would just sound a little duller.

 

[HolmeBass]

Interesting. So the compression is aimed within each note, not high and low range of notes.
I have some thinking to do.

You can set a comp to make the bass brighter. But it’s not really an EQ. Someone did you a disservice in how they explained compression.

 

[fishdreams]

Not using compression ( and other effects) is like deciding that your raw-files equal your image output. - maybe some cropping, but nothing more.

And that is fine-nobody says you HAVE to photoshop everyrhing to the hilt, or use compression.

However, it is safe to say that the commercial standard for both photography and sound production requires at least some, and sometimes considerable, manipulation of the orginal material.

 

[BlueTalon]

Demos are useless for compressors. You have to play through them to feel and hear what they do.

Apparently you missed what I meant. By "demonstration" I meant being in the same room with a bass player who is playing through an amp, using a compressor, so I can witness for myself what it actually does, and if it does it in a way that makes me not feel like I'm in a straight jacket.

Compressors simply reduce how much your volume does or can swing.

I fail to understand how that's different from reducing dynamics.

On bass, they can be used to: even out volume across strings and registers on the fretboard, curtail excessively spiky peaks, boost wimpy notes from dead spots, present a robust and more consistent signal to pedals that are dependent on dynamics (like envelope filters, which might be hard to trigger and/or control), keep a consistent volume between plucked and slapped/popped notes.

I'm used to doing all that with my fingers. (I don't slap much, and I don't use any expression pedals.)

On guitar they can even out volume and attack between single notes, arpeggios, doublestops and strummed chords when using a clean tone. Any level of dirt, from boost to fuzz, adds compression, as do tube amps as the tubes are cooked. Country players have used intense compression to add sustain to notes and chords as a very audible effect.

In the studio compression is used on everything to ensure instruments stay in their lane, volume-wise, and every note is audible. Reducing the transient, i.e. the sharp and loud attack of a note, results in the note being fatter, which is an effect of compression on bass and drums.

As with everything, how you set an effect is crucial.

I'm not anti-compression. If a FOH or studio engineer wants to use compression on my signal, that's fine with me

Having said that, ignorance can be bliss. Stay away from this and other gear forums

Ignorance can indeed be bliss. But so can learning.

 

[BlueTalon]

A note that is played loud has a different harmonic content (especially the attack) compared to a note that is played softly. A compressor does not change harmonic content, only volume.

So even if the compressor makes the soft played note as loud as the loud played note, both notes will still sound different. Our brain can still 'translate' which is the soft note and which is the loud played note based on the harmonic content of the note. Therefore a compressor doesn't change the perceived dynamics as much as you would think.

That's helpful to know.

 

[andare]

Apparently you missed what I meant. By "demonstration" I meant being in the same room with a bass player who is playing through an amp, using a compressor, so I can witness for myself what it actually does, and if it does it in a way that makes me not feel like I'm in a straight jacket.

I fail to understand how that's different from reducing dynamics.

I'm used to doing all that with my fingers. (I don't slap much, and I don't use any expression pedals.)

I'm not anti-compression. If a FOH or studio engineer wants to use compression on my signal, that's fine with me

Ignorance can indeed be bliss. But so can learning.

My point is you have to personally play through a compressor to feel what it does. Being in a room with a bass player doesn't help.

As for the rest of my comment, I used the words "can be used to" because some people take care of those issues with their fingers, like you. Clearly you don't need a compressor.

 

[BlueTalon]

My point is you have to personally play through a compressor to feel what it does. Being in a room with a bass player doesn't help.

As for the rest of my comment, I used the words "can be used to" because some people take care of those issues with their fingers, like you. Clearly you don't need a compressor.

Perhaps I worded it poorly. I agree, just being in the same room with someone using a compressor isn't necessarily going to do anything for me. What I meant was basically taking a lesson from someone in how to use a compressor, where the other bass player and myself would both be playing through it alternately, while he/she shows me what's happening with it.

Believe it or not, I am prepared to be blown away by how much it can help. Others in this thread have mentioned how they were surprised at how much it helped after not using them before. I had a revelation when using a HPF for the first time. I believe a similar epiphany with compressors is possible. Is it likely? I kinda doubt it, but I do believe it's possible.

 

[BEADist]

(just my second 2 cents):

If you have a vocal track with whispering and screaming and you compress it 'flat' you can still hear where there is whispering and where there is screaming. The volume might be 'grey' but the expressiveness of the vocals is still there. The expressiveness is not only in the volume but a large part is in the 'timbre' of the sound.

Because of the make-up gain of the compressor the nuances of the whispering are more clearly to hear so you could argue that the compressor is actually giving more 'color' !

With a bass guitar it is the same, if you play a series of notes with increasing loudness and you compress it 'flat' you will still hear that the intensity of the notes is increasing. I think the difference with vocals is that our ears are less trained to hear the difference between 'whispered notes' and 'screamed notes'. (But I am not arguing that everything should be compressed 'flat')

And, a musician might feel a compressor as a straight-jacket, the listerner might feel it as a comfortabel sweater. And the other way around too !