Compression pedal basic question

[Phagor]

Lots of good info here. The only things I would add are:

Bass has been compressed on records for years, through a compressor or through the processes of tape, distortion, preamps etc. Live bass is compressed by almost every sound engineer. So 99.9% of every bass you've ever heard recorded or live has been compressed - that's the sound of bass. Your choice about whether you compress, but for me, I want to sound like all those great bass players and tones on records or gigs.

I can relate to those who say they struggle with losing dynamics on a gig to the point where they play too hard and get nothing back. That was me too until I got a Cali 76 Compact Bass compressor with a blend knob (or dry/compressed. This is parallel compression which has been used for many years in studios. It gives you back most of your dynamic range, with the smoothing and attack shaping of the compressor on top.

 

[Rogulus]

Lots of good info here. The only things I would add are:

Bass has been compressed on records for years, through a compressor or through the processes of tape, distortion, preamps etc. Live bass is compressed by almost every sound engineer. So 99.9% of every bass you've ever heard recorded or live has been compressed - that's the sound of bass. Your choice about whether you compress, but for me, I want to sound like all those great bass players and tones on records or gigs.

I can relate to those who say they struggle with losing dynamics on a gig to the point where they play too hard and get nothing back. That was me too until I got a Cali 76 Compact Bass compressor with a blend knob (or dry/compressed. This is parallel compression which has been used for many years in studios. It gives you back most of your dynamic range, with the smoothing and attack shaping of the compressor on top.

Do you still run a compressor for live gigs knowing that soundies are gonna run you through one anyway? I'm always shy of taking a comp out live for this reason as it seems pointless to compress a compressor so to speak, just like preamping a preamp. How do you view this?

 

[scott sinner]

A compressor can be use for different thungs.

The way I usually use my compressor, it is actually not usually doing anything. I use it as a limiter, it is only doing anything on the loudest lowest notes and only when I have a lot of effects applied (understand regular compression before you get into multiband). It is there just to protect the amp and speakers. I.e. the threshold is very high, ratio is high.

Other times, I use a compressor to really even out things. There, the threshold is lower, affecting anything above p maybe mp, but the ratio is low too, around 3:1. This, I find useful on styles that are extra dynamic, like slap and pop.

I dont really need a compressor otherwise. My dynamics are otherwise pretty precise. I often even get away without much compression in recordings. I surely wasnt always that good at keeping them even though.

 

[Phagor]

Do you still run a compressor for live gigs knowing that soundies are gonna run you through one anyway? I'm always shy of taking a comp out live for this reason as it seems pointless to compress a compressor so to speak, just like preamping a preamp. How do you view this?

Good question. Sometimes they do and I like it. Sometimes they do and I don't like it, so I'll back off my compression a bit. Sometimes I get them to back off theirs, but talking to sound guys is not always productive...

You're right though, I think they almost always compress just as a matter of routine or template or something.

I normally aim to deliver the tone I would like to hear out front, in terms of eq, compression, effects etc. If the sound guy wants to do something on top, or cut my low end or whatever, that's their job and I try not to get involved. After all, I can't hear the front of house like he/she can.

That works well for IEM gigs where the soundie doesn't do much to the monitor mix - at least the bass will be ok in everybody's IEMs.

 

[jschulman]

Good question. Sometimes they do and I like it. Sometimes they do and I don't like it, so I'll back off my compression a bit. Sometimes I get them to back off theirs, but talking to sound guys is not always productive...

You're right though, I think they almost always compress just as a matter of routine or template or something.

I normally aim to deliver the tone I would like to hear out front, in terms of eq, compression, effects etc. If the sound guy wants to do something on top, or cut my low end or whatever, that's their job and I try not to get involved. After all, I can't hear the front of house like he/she can.

That works well for IEM gigs where the soundie doesn't do much to the monitor mix - at least the bass will be ok in everybody's IEMs.

Yeah this is my philosophy too. I shape my tone for what I want my bass to sound like when I'm on stage. I have no idea what the sound guy is doing and I have no idea what the front of house sounds like - only what's on stage and what's in my monitors. So I build my signal chain for that.

 

[Patrick Warneka]

I get what you are saying. to stay w/ the Analogy, I would never let photos out in public without editing. So I was asking does a compressor edit before it is heard or is this just adding more data to the raw file, that my fictitious sound guy can work with. And that seems to be the answer. A compressor gives more data to the mixing board. I bought one and I hear the difference. To me, it compresses the data that is needed to give the sound engineers more room to work.

 

[SteveCS]

I get what you are saying. to stay w/ the Analogy, I would never let photos out in public without editing. So I was asking does a compressor edit before it is heard or is this just adding more data to the raw file, that my fictitious sound guy can work with. And that seems to be the answer. A compressor gives more data to the mixing board. I bought one and I hear the difference. To me, it compresses the data that is needed to give the sound engineers more room to work.

This is a really poor analogy - there is no added data. Audio compression is not like digital data compression where size reduction is the aim. The only thing they have in common is 'getting more in'. Don't confuse audio compression in the signal chain with the compression used to create digital audio files such as *.mp3 or *.flac - these are not the same processes.

Audio compression modifies the dynamic range of the audio signal in real time. Most of the time compression is used to reduce or limit that range, but sometimes it is increased ('expanded'). The fact is that sending a pre-compressed signal to the FOH gives them LESS to work with. Sure they might appreciate you not slamming the desk with over-enthusiastic peaks, but that is about it. Once the dynamics are squeezed out they are very difficult to restore - the expansion settings have to be an exact mirror of the compression settings (look up Dolby NR).

 

[Blue Swede]

I think this is a tricky subject for alot of reasons, but especially all of the different compressors (kinds as well as brands) available and the difference in terminology in their respective literature. I would personally never play a live show without a compressor these days.

Its important to differentiate between the actual difference in volume that a compressor aims to even out, and the difference in the tonal envelope that your instrument produces when your digging in or playing softly.
The tone your bass produces, provided you set your compressor up properly and to allow for it, shouldn’t necessarily change when compression is engaged.

This requires some knowledge of the various controls your compressor has, but also you need to play - listen - adjust and repeat until you find something that suits you and your playing style. Again, I find the biggest difference is how the bass sits in the mix when playing live with other people, not by yourself.

 

[SteveCS]

...
Its important to differentiate between the actual difference in volume that a compressor aims to even out, and the difference in the tonal envelope that your instrument produces when your digging in or playing softly.
The tone your bass produces, provided you set your compressor up properly and to allow for it, shouldn’t necessarily change when compression is engaged.
...
Again, I find the biggest difference is how the bass sits in the mix when playing live with other people, not by yourself.

Excellent point, and an important distinction. A note played pp will still sound like a 'soft' note even at stadium volume, and a note played ff will still sound 'loud' at bedroom levels.