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Compressors: Empress v Diamond v Whirlwind v ?

Robus

Robus

Aug 25, 2013
1,172
1,289
Chicago Area
#1
First things first: Yes, I've visited the OVNI Labs site. :smug:

Hi all. I'm looking to buy a pedal compressor and would like suggestions or comparisons from people who have used these units.

I want a compressor for home recording direct in through a Sans Amp BDDI. I'm not really looking for the most transparent sounding compressor. I'd like something that fattens up the tone of my Jazz bass. My Jazz has a somewhat scooped sound inherently, which the BDDI exaggerates. The result is a weak and thin sound.

I have focused in on the following:

Whirlwind OC Bass
Diamond Bass Comp
Empress Bass Compressor

I've heard good things about the FEA Opti-Comp but those do not seem to be easily available.

If there are other units that I should consider, please let me know. My price range is under $300. Thanks.
 
#3
I would check out the MXR M87 Bass Compressor. You can adjust the ratio which isn't a common feature with other units and it has an LED meter, which is good for those of us that are new to compressors and want to maintain a strong signal. There also under $200!
 
#7
Rolling back the blend knob of the BDDI helps a lot. I think this pedals has its real strength in fattening up the tone by just being blended in. Then it just makes the sound wider. With the blend knob turned fully clockwise, this 800Hz midscoop is way too strong for me, steals the character and gets easier buried in the mix.

But the Empress is great nevertheless.
 
#8
Not to make this tougher, but I just bought a Wampler Ego. Aside from positive Bongo's review (I've bought 3 compressors based on his advice and love them all) the blend really intrigued me. Seems to make it more flexible. That being said, symmetrix and rane make really nice rack compressors and since you're recording with it they may be an option. The rane dc24 is a dual band and I've really been happy with it in my big rig. Very affordable on the used marked, I paid less than $100 for each of them.
 
#9
I really appreciate the suggestions. You have helped me to think a more clearly about what I am trying to get out of a compressor, and whether the tone shaping might be better done by an EQ as therhodeo pointed out.

While I was out today I snagged a Boss GEB-7 graphic eq pedal and spent the evening playing with it. It certainly fattens up the Jazz. I think that with a little experimenting between the settings on the pedal, the BDDI, and EQ plugins on the DAW that I am using (Reaper), I'm going to be able to record meatier bass tracks.

I am still definitely in the market for a compressor. But if I can get the tone I need from the EQ, then that opens up more options on the compressor. I can consider ones that have a more transparent sound like the MXR M87.

I'm open to all suggestions.

I've been playing with an old guitar compressor that I bought back in the 90s, a Boss CS-3. It's extreme--more an effect than a subtle utility sort of pedal--and way more squeeze than I want for bass. Not to mention noisy. But it's fun to play around with. On some settings it makes the bridge pickup on my Jazz sound vicious.
 
#10
I've been using the Diamond for about 5 years now. As I've been experimenting with different signal chains between the pickup and the amp I've tried to get rid of it, since it's an 18v power and therefor limiting my pedal board mounting options, but … man, the sound is just a bit of magic. This is on both electric and upright. If you're looking for a rounding of the tone I can verify that this is exactly what you'll get form this box. While I can't speak to the others based on direct experience with their compressors I'd have to assume that unless Whirlwind has seriously stepped up it's game in the last 5 years then I can't imagine it would come close in quality of tone…and I'm just not familiar with Empress. Best luck with your search.
Danimal
 
#11
You should check out Ovni... Oh wait, nevermind. ;)

I own the Empress and I love it. It is pretty transparent, but it can still fatten up your tone. You can use the mix knob to blend in your compressed signal with your uncompressed to beef up the tone in a beautiful way. It's fairly flexible in that you can adjust the attack, release, and go with a 2:1, 4:1, or 10:1 ratio.

I love Diamond pedals. I have the Vibrato, the Memory Lane Jr, and I would have the compressor if I didn't own the Empress. Diamond pedals just sound amazing imo. From my research (I haven't played though one), it seems the Diamond colors your tone more. And with the EQ knob you can bump up the bass, which might seem fatter than what you can get on the Empress. The Diamond is set at a 3:1 ratio with a fixed attack/release.

I don't know the Whirlwind.

I'd say if you are just looking for one great tone and are going to leave it at that, it sounds like the Diamond is a great option. If you want a few more options like being able to go from a slightly smoother to a slightly punchier sound, and need something a bit more versatile, the Empress is the way to go.

If you want lots of versatility and don't mind the wait, I've heard FEA Labs are great.
 
#14
Are you looking for a compressor for tracking? If you are recording into a DAW, I would recommend you got straight into a DI/ADC. Then run software comps on the recorded track. If you already have a really good comp and want that sound, then use a passive DI to re-amp.
 
#15
Robus said:
..... I'd like something that fattens up the tone of my Jazz bass. My Jazz has a somewhat scooped sound inherently, which the BDDI exaggerates. The result is a weak and thin sound........
Click to expand...

I know you didn't have it on your list but I use a Markbass Compressore for thickening up my J bass. It's subtle but it brings up the mids in a non-harsh way. Sounds different than boosting mids or going for a barky bridge pickup mid heavy tone.

That said I've been wanting to try a Diamond Bcp-1 forever and have one coming within the week! :hyper: Should be fun to A/B the it with the Compressore.
 
#16
Originally Posted by Robus View Post

..... I'd like something that fattens up the tone of my Jazz bass. My Jazz has a somewhat scooped sound inherently, which the BDDI exaggerates. The result is a weak and thin sound........


I used to have a jazz bass that had that sound, it took me a while to figure it out, after I did, it was a beast! I wanted to change everything, my guitar player is a good sound man, when it sounded too scooped, and had little bottom, he used to say, "that thing rocks, please set up your amp", I did not understand, finally I said "You set up my amp"... he did. It was kinda heavy on the eq, but I was blown away, and fell in love with the bass. I had a good, but too clean sounding amp at the time, it was a Carvin. This is what he did; Treble=0, bass=+5, 120hz= +3, 600hz= +3, drive up a bit, but not crazy. I do not know if preamp, or amp settings will help, but it was a lesson for me, after that I was able to get a great sound with a Sansamp bass driver DI too.

Also +1 on the Markbass compressor,
 
#17
Growlmonkee said:
This is what he did; Treble=0, bass=+5, 120hz= +3, 600hz= +3, drive up a bit, but not crazy.
Click to expand...
This is basically how I've EQ'ed my ShuttleMax to get my Jazz to sound full and punchy. Works well for my P-bass too.

But for my actives, it ends up being a bit shy in the high-end.

I have been thinking about this for days, since the thread about over-EQ'ing. Still thinking about it, not sure what to do. Maybe instead of a clean and OD channel, I should have an Active and Passive channel on the amp? Thing is, I never switch between active or passive on a gig- some gigs I use the passive basses, some I use actives.

Still thinking. Plus I really like my amp's OD sound.
 
#18
Robus said:
I really appreciate the suggestions. You have helped me to think a more clearly about what I am trying to get out of a compressor, and whether the tone shaping might be better done by an EQ as therhodeo pointed out.

While I was out today I snagged a Boss GEB-7 graphic eq pedal and spent the evening playing with it. It certainly fattens up the Jazz. I think that with a little experimenting between the settings on the pedal, the BDDI, and EQ plugins on the DAW that I am using (Reaper), I'm going to be able to record meatier bass tracks.

I am still definitely in the market for a compressor. But if I can get the tone I need from the EQ, then that opens up more options on the compressor. I can consider ones that have a more transparent sound like the MXR M87.

I'm open to all suggestions.

I've been playing with an old guitar compressor that I bought back in the 90s, a Boss CS-3. It's extreme--more an effect than a subtle utility sort of pedal--and way more squeeze than I want for bass. Not to mention noisy. But it's fun to play around with. On some settings it makes the bridge pickup on my Jazz sound vicious.
Click to expand...
kudos to you for trying EQ first. An ever so important foundation (so often overlooked) in the quest for the "tone in my head". Not only a great tool for shaping tone but a great tool for learning about the relationship of various frequencies. I will echo those that commented on using software comp. for your home recordings. Can be undone and changed. Also add that if you're still wanting to go down the comp.trail, know what you're goals are before you open the wallet. I am a Diamond user/praiser as well. For what it does it does it extremely well. low ratio/subtle compression for a smooth fattening effect. For those wanting more of a control and tame aggressive peaks and spikes or put a tight ceiling on volume levels look elsewhere. It does color a bit but it's a color that so many of us really like. For me it doesn't kill my finger dynamics though I've learned where to set the input level appropriately. I also own an MXR bass comp. and I've really enjoyed using it to learn more about compressor settings and how they interact. I like it a lot too. Versatile and not near as expensive as the big boys. I think it would the best choice for you to learn what it is you really want a compressor to do for you. Using various software plug ins is a good way to learn also.
 
#19
Growlmonkee said:
Originally Posted by Robus View Post

..... I'd like something that fattens up the tone of my Jazz bass. My Jazz has a somewhat scooped sound inherently, which the BDDI exaggerates. The result is a weak and thin sound........


I used to have a jazz bass that had that sound, it took me a while to figure it out, after I did, it was a beast! I wanted to change everything, my guitar player is a good sound man, when it sounded too scooped, and had little bottom, he used to say, "that thing rocks, please set up your amp", I did not understand, finally I said "You set up my amp"... he did. It was kinda heavy on the eq, but I was blown away, and fell in love with the bass. I had a good, but too clean sounding amp at the time, it was a Carvin. This is what he did; Treble=0, bass=+5, 120hz= +3, 600hz= +3, drive up a bit, but not crazy. I do not know if preamp, or amp settings will help, but it was a lesson for me, after that I was able to get a great sound with a Sansamp bass driver DI too.

Also +1 on the Markbass compressor,
Click to expand...
to remedy a scooped sound you boosted the lows to +5 ? Granted I'm not familiar with your amp, that seems somewhat counterproductive to me. I've always found that cutting the bass just a bit and boosting 120-200 Hz was an effective way to fatten or tighten up the (usable) low end. Another thing I've found to work good for adding mids back into jazz bass is Fender flatwounds. I actually end up cutting a bit around 500Hz.
Don't overlook string choices in your tone quest.
 
#20
PhatRon said:
to remedy a scooped sound you boosted the lows to +5 ? Granted I'm not familiar with your amp, that seems somewhat counterproductive to me. I've always found that cutting the bass just a bit and boosting 120-200 Hz was an effective way to fatten or tighten up the (usable) low end. Another thing I've found to work good for adding mids back into jazz bass is Fender flatwounds. I actually end up cutting a bit around 500Hz.
Don't overlook string choices in your tone quest.
Click to expand...

Thanks for all the tips. The forum is a great resource. I'm making a lot of progress and getting a better understanding of what I need.

I'm playing Chrome flats on the Jazz which give a solid fundamental. Even so the bass has a kind of airy, openness to the tone that is quite attractive solo but difficult to record or fit into the mix.

The EQ has helped a lot. I've got a six band EQ on the Boss. What I'm finding works is to cut at 50 HZ and boost at 120 HZ. That's a major improvement right there, giving me a stronger bottom with less boom. I'm also using a slight boost at 500 HZ and a bigger one at 800 HZ.

That combination works well with the bridge pickup on the Jazz with the tone knob rolled back a bit, giving a real aggressive growl. I hadn't found much use for the bridge solo until now.

It's become clear to me that what I need from a compressor is better control of levels and dynamics going into my A/D, rather than tone shaping. I had been debating between the Diamond and Empress units until I understood this, then the choice became clear. The Empress offers more control and flexibility (probably not as much as the M87 though).

I ordered the Empress. Should be here on Tuesday. We'll see how I like it.

I appreciate the comments saying I should use the plugin options in the DAW, or re-amp if I prefer the sound of the outboard gear. Re-amping is a technique I've never used but plan to try. I do use the software EQ and compression sparingly for mixing. But at my current level of experience, I think the more practical approach is to get the tones as close as possible at the tracking stage, rather than leave problems to be solved later in mixing, which is already the most complicated part of the project for me.

Many thanks. I'll report back on the Empress.
 

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