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Double Bass Considering Orchestra String Choices-again!
- Thread starter BHBassist
- Start date
Dang! At that string length I'd recommend 4/4 weich or Solo spiro AE and find DG to match!
You may have all o the info you need already, but i thought I'd chime in. I find longer string lengths benefit from strings with more flexibility, and, as you OP mentioned, lighter gauge/tension.
The Pirazzi strings in my experience are slow. I could never get what i wanted without beating the bass (and thereby my hands wrists and the rest of my body).
In general, I'd recommend looking for flexibility- obligato over spiro weich is where I'd start, especially if you have some in your drawer. Other recommendations are much more expensive, but viable. These days a set of gut or boutique European strings will set you back $1000.
I find that most modern strings work great on 41-42" strings but not in my 42.5". If my bass had your string length we'd have to use solo's tuned down to orchestra pitch.
For darker tones Orig flexocors are the most flexible of the flexocor line up. They play nice with spiros, too. Spiro E/C under orig flexocors ADG for arco. Sprio AE under DG for all styles. And Deluxe over spiro, belcanto over spiro. As someone else mentioned, the 5/4 flexocor (92) might be made for you.
You may have all o the info you need already, but i thought I'd chime in. I find longer string lengths benefit from strings with more flexibility, and, as you OP mentioned, lighter gauge/tension.
The Pirazzi strings in my experience are slow. I could never get what i wanted without beating the bass (and thereby my hands wrists and the rest of my body).
In general, I'd recommend looking for flexibility- obligato over spiro weich is where I'd start, especially if you have some in your drawer. Other recommendations are much more expensive, but viable. These days a set of gut or boutique European strings will set you back $1000.
I find that most modern strings work great on 41-42" strings but not in my 42.5". If my bass had your string length we'd have to use solo's tuned down to orchestra pitch.
For darker tones Orig flexocors are the most flexible of the flexocor line up. They play nice with spiros, too. Spiro E/C under orig flexocors ADG for arco. Sprio AE under DG for all styles. And Deluxe over spiro, belcanto over spiro. As someone else mentioned, the 5/4 flexocor (92) might be made for you.
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Thanks SeayBass. I do appreciate your & all replies for my dilemma.
(I’ve never tried Solo Gauge Strings, Spirocore Weichs or Belcantos…)
I’m aware that every Bass/player/season/ Rosin is a factor and “Gear is not the Answer”(Sung to ‘What’s Goin’ On’)…
However, lately, my Bass does sound great acoustically and amplified-but I am working hard to Bow (as in your reply) fast & staccato passages to get full even tones, especially on the E/C.
As mentioned, I’ve stood next to Bassists in Orchestra sections playing with a variety of string brands, including mixed sets, but not EPs(most all of them strictly “classical” not Jazz players) and not working as hard as I seem to need to get a full/even bowed sound in all registers -which is the my reason for questioning my EP string choice.
I do plan to visit a Bass Shop soon with many Basses displayed and bring a Bow to try Bass with strings that have been spoken about in the threads.
Practice time now.
Thanks again.
(I’ve never tried Solo Gauge Strings, Spirocore Weichs or Belcantos…)
I’m aware that every Bass/player/season/ Rosin is a factor and “Gear is not the Answer”(Sung to ‘What’s Goin’ On’)…
However, lately, my Bass does sound great acoustically and amplified-but I am working hard to Bow (as in your reply) fast & staccato passages to get full even tones, especially on the E/C.
As mentioned, I’ve stood next to Bassists in Orchestra sections playing with a variety of string brands, including mixed sets, but not EPs(most all of them strictly “classical” not Jazz players) and not working as hard as I seem to need to get a full/even bowed sound in all registers -which is the my reason for questioning my EP string choice.
I do plan to visit a Bass Shop soon with many Basses displayed and bring a Bow to try Bass with strings that have been spoken about in the threads.
Practice time now.
Thanks again.
For the record, I don't think Pirazzis are bad strings. They just haven't worked for me on the several different instruments where I've tried them. Always logy.
That said... I have a buddy whose bass gets along swimmingly with these strings (EP weich), both arco and jazz. They fit that bass as close to perfect as you'll find. Fast, loud, clear and full.
And I'd like to correct the first line I wrote above- it should say "Spiro Weich 4/4 or Solo gauge tuned down." As in a full set of them. . . the DG to match comes later in the post and also in the process if you need something more bowable or darker up top...
I've found solo gauges often play just fine when tuned down, but they're made for melodic playing, so the 2nd and 3rd string are noticeably more playable at the expense of big bottom. This presents on the bass as less tension and lighter gauge. On a 45" string, I'd think that would be a good thing.
That said... I have a buddy whose bass gets along swimmingly with these strings (EP weich), both arco and jazz. They fit that bass as close to perfect as you'll find. Fast, loud, clear and full.
And I'd like to correct the first line I wrote above- it should say "Spiro Weich 4/4 or Solo gauge tuned down." As in a full set of them. . . the DG to match comes later in the post and also in the process if you need something more bowable or darker up top...
I've found solo gauges often play just fine when tuned down, but they're made for melodic playing, so the 2nd and 3rd string are noticeably more playable at the expense of big bottom. This presents on the bass as less tension and lighter gauge. On a 45" string, I'd think that would be a good thing.
Hello again Seaybass. Appreciate your new reply and clarification.
I’ve used EPs since they came out-feel they have a warm/dark Gut-like quality and make my Basses project.
Pirastro even sent me a set of Weichs when they came out after I emailed them a recording (MP3) of me playing the EP Mediums playing with a Big Band-they were very complimentary and wanted me to try the Weichs.
My three Basses sound good both acoustically & amplified. EPs Mediums are on my EGerman Full Size Bass with CExt and on an American Standard that previously had EP Weichs. Also have EP Weichs on a 1940 Kay, all with an Underwood PU, and own many Amps & Cabs. ( I’ve had lots of repair on those two Ply Basses due to sinking tops)
Forgot to mention that I play German Bow-have several-prefer Black Hair.
Your ‘logy’ bowing with EPs (sometimes Pizz) description seems accurate especially after standing next to Bassists in Orchestra Sections with different strings more suited for Arco-including various Flexocors, Perpetual and even Spiro Weichs. Only know of a couple other Orchestra Bassists that use EP Med & Weichs-they also play shows & Jazz. Many of the Basses were older Italian, French and German which obviously is a factor that is making me curious and considering a string change.
I’ve been practicing more and resisting an immediate change or trip to a Bass Shop, but will go soon…
I’ve used EPs since they came out-feel they have a warm/dark Gut-like quality and make my Basses project.
Pirastro even sent me a set of Weichs when they came out after I emailed them a recording (MP3) of me playing the EP Mediums playing with a Big Band-they were very complimentary and wanted me to try the Weichs.
My three Basses sound good both acoustically & amplified. EPs Mediums are on my EGerman Full Size Bass with CExt and on an American Standard that previously had EP Weichs. Also have EP Weichs on a 1940 Kay, all with an Underwood PU, and own many Amps & Cabs. ( I’ve had lots of repair on those two Ply Basses due to sinking tops)
Forgot to mention that I play German Bow-have several-prefer Black Hair.
Your ‘logy’ bowing with EPs (sometimes Pizz) description seems accurate especially after standing next to Bassists in Orchestra Sections with different strings more suited for Arco-including various Flexocors, Perpetual and even Spiro Weichs. Only know of a couple other Orchestra Bassists that use EP Med & Weichs-they also play shows & Jazz. Many of the Basses were older Italian, French and German which obviously is a factor that is making me curious and considering a string change.
I’ve been practicing more and resisting an immediate change or trip to a Bass Shop, but will go soon…
Alex Hanna uses EPs, I think. Granted, he's probably playing on the best bass available to him. My teacher converted me to them about 4-5 months ago too. He was a pretty dedicated BC user but switched looking for more power. On my bass and his, the EPs are a couple of clicks louder than BCs.
I'm not sure I have a strong feeling about their bowability. I think I can dig in more with them than with BCs, but I also feel like they're rewarding some more horizontal motion - you can choke the starts if you press too hard. Instead, they want you to grab the string with the hair and get some real lateral displacement before you release, but then they start right away with plenty of subwoofer.
Thanks Mark_T: Thanks.Glad to hear.
I do like the dark/warm EP Mediums tone and am quite used to playing them both Arco and Pizz.
Actually find my bowing technique improving on the EPs with the daily and consistent practice, but may still have to try other options.
This is all good and helpful information.
Thanks again.
Hello Lee:Thanks for your reply.
Just watched some amazing playing Videos by Alex Hanna (even piano)and read a couple of interviews.
He’s such a fantastic Bassist-interesting story-no wonder he plays so great!
I’m used to playing/ practicing a couple to few hours daily, but 5-6+!
Also, I’m lucky to have a career as a professional Bassist and a retired music educator, but that’s way up on another level! Humbling and another reminder to me that I know very little…but also inspiring to know even at this stage of my career that I’m working on the right music.
Here’s a paragraph from an interview on the Pirastro Strings he uses.
You can see the EP Silk Winding in a couple of Videos(which is encouraging).
2025 update: I use different combinations of strings on different instruments but my favorite combos are all Evah Pirazzi or Flexocor Original G, D & A with a Permanent extended E string
Just watched some amazing playing Videos by Alex Hanna (even piano)and read a couple of interviews.
He’s such a fantastic Bassist-interesting story-no wonder he plays so great!
I’m used to playing/ practicing a couple to few hours daily, but 5-6+!
Also, I’m lucky to have a career as a professional Bassist and a retired music educator, but that’s way up on another level! Humbling and another reminder to me that I know very little…but also inspiring to know even at this stage of my career that I’m working on the right music.
Here’s a paragraph from an interview on the Pirastro Strings he uses.
You can see the EP Silk Winding in a couple of Videos(which is encouraging).
2025 update: I use different combinations of strings on different instruments but my favorite combos are all Evah Pirazzi or Flexocor Original G, D & A with a Permanent extended E string
Spirocore is a popular choice for both Orchestra and Pizz. They will last and come in a variety of gauges.
I only use arco strings, and am very happy with flexicore and passiones. Dark sound and easy to bow.
Your other option is to get another bass, one set up for arco, and one for pizz..
I only use arco strings, and am very happy with flexicore and passiones. Dark sound and easy to bow.
Your other option is to get another bass, one set up for arco, and one for pizz..
Hello Paps-Thanks for your reply. Spiros are great & long lasting strings, and know many Jazz Bassists that use them in W, M & S Gauge.
I stood in Bass sections with a couple of Bass players using the Weichs.
I used Spirocore Mediums decades ago and switched to Heliocore (when they came out) at the suggestion os a Bass repairman-who thought Spiros were to bright for my Bass.
I have (40 yr old!) Flexocore GDA Originals on my Caruthers EUB,(EP Med E) and coincidently, was just reading about the Passiones Strings.
Just finished (for now) practicing along to several Youtube Orchestra Videos and see Bassists playing them in YouTube Orchestra Videos.
Great info! Thanks again.
I stood in Bass sections with a couple of Bass players using the Weichs.
I used Spirocore Mediums decades ago and switched to Heliocore (when they came out) at the suggestion os a Bass repairman-who thought Spiros were to bright for my Bass.
I have (40 yr old!) Flexocore GDA Originals on my Caruthers EUB,(EP Med E) and coincidently, was just reading about the Passiones Strings.
Just finished (for now) practicing along to several Youtube Orchestra Videos and see Bassists playing them in YouTube Orchestra Videos.
Great info! Thanks again.
I don’t think anyone will be surprised,
or particularly happy about me finding
my old 1981-82 Lemur Musical Research Corporation catalog.
It would have paid off to be a string
set hoarder.
They're actually a little more expensive there than I would have thought. In terms of constant dollars, they may be cheaper now.
Well, the Left column is the list price,
the Right column is the Lemur net price. I assume, apples to apples,
the Spirocore MS-42 were $49.
Not to pick on Sweetwater, who has
great customer service, but $365.
Ouch…
Attachments
Ok, so do you guys pay $163 or $365,
or some other amount for Spiro’s?
I haven’t bought strings in a long time.
I think you're going the wrong direction. On any set of strings, you're going to have less tension if the string length gets longer. So for a big orchestral bass with a long mensure, downtuned solos are going to be looser than on a tiny little solo bass, and I can't imagine a lot of circumstances where that would be advantageous - you'll need to keep the high off the fingerboard (or have a lot of relief) to keep from buzzing, and unless the big orchestral bass has a stupidly thin top or a really steep breakover angle, you won't be able to drive sound out of it.
If anything, having a longer string length lets you use heavier strings without needing to have them strung up so tightly.
