• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Contemporary R&B: Slap is Extinct

#41
AlphaMale said:
R&B isn't really a genre.

Fats Domino, Marvin Gaye, Chris Brown and Destiny's Child can't be the same genre of music.
Click to expand...


It isn't?
C'mon...all genres have movements/sub-genres.
Classical can go between Bach & Ives
Rock can between Zappa & ZZ Top
Jazz can go between Armstrong & Ornette

...but R&B can't have both Fats & Destiny's Child?!?
 
#42
DWBass said:
The singers sound the same with the exception of a few! Here today, gone tomorrow. Whatever happened to long term careers like Gladys, Tina, Stevie, Luther, etc???
Click to expand...
The poseurs hav always lacked staying power.

Word!! In fact, it's pretty much destroyed the stereo system in my wifes car! Since most standard car systems are not designed to handle those frequencies!
Click to expand...
This is one of my big issues...evident even on Saadiq's new Classic Soul/R&B album. The low end thump on an iPod is too much, IMO. I'll need to stick with the home stereo in order to enjoy this album.
 
#45
JimK said:
I hope so.
By some accounts (including some in this thread), Jamerson woulda been considered "too busy" & not 'in the pocket'. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

This reminds me of a story- I saw in a bass documentary the Allman Bros were having a discussion driving from a gig shortly after hooking up with thier new bass player. (Can't remember his name) Everyone was wasted and they were listening to a tune on the radio. A drunk Betts exclaimed, something along the lines of, "This bass player is crap, he plays too much, and isn't playing with the band." to which someone else replied.., "Dude, thats Paul McCartney."

The story was making the point that this bass player, (and all bass players) are constantly walking the line of too much/not enough, playing with the band/not playing "too boring." And everyone has there own opinion on where everyone else should be.
 
#46
Bochafish said:
This reminds me of a story- I saw in a bass documentary the Allman Bros were having a discussion driving from a gig shortly after hooking up with thier new bass player. (Can't remember his name) Everyone was wasted and they were listening to a tune on the radio. A drunk Betts exclaimed, something along the lines of, "This bass player is crap, he plays too much, and isn't playing with the band." to which someone else replied.., "Dude, thats Paul McCartney."

The story was making the point that this bass player, (and all bass players) are constantly walking the line of too much/not enough, playing with the band/not playing "too boring." And everyone has there own opinion on where everyone else should be.
Click to expand...

What can you expect from Dickie Betts? He had the nerve to force Oteil Burbridge to use only a Jazz as if he could hold it down on a six string.:scowl:
 
#47
Doc-
...was Betts in the band when Oteil joined? I'm not sure but I kinda recall Oteil wanting to use a Jazz + a pick 'cause he wanted to honor Berry Oakley.

BTW, I still prefer Oteil on his '80s blonde Jazz.
 
#49
Dr. Cheese said:
What can you expect from Dickie Betts? He had the nerve to force Oteil Burbridge to use only a Jazz as if he could hold it down on a six string.:scowl:
Click to expand...

I think that was actually Johnny Neel who grumbled about McCartney, not Dickie. If I recall, Dickie was the guy who insisted that Woody double the guitar, when Warren was telling the story of how everyone in the band wanted Woody to play a different way.
 
#50
burk48237 said:
This got me thinking Dr, Is their ANY form of current pop music where the Electric Bass is important in the mix?

It sure isn't like Motown, or the early Jazz rock of the Steely Dan, Chicago, and the Michael McDonald Doobies, or Disco, or even Classic rock like Zeppelin or the Allman Brothers. The electric bass is almost a non instrument in most current pop records (outside of some country) and the way they do mix it when they have a bass player it might as well not even be there.
Click to expand...
:bawl::crying::bawl::scowl::crying::bawl:

i agree, and it makes me very sad.
when i get passed up on a job because the singers cousin, who's a guitard, doesn't have an active project, so he can just go buy a bass and jump right in... something's not right with the world.
 
#53
Betts was in the band another two years or so after Oteil joined the band, Betts is also the one who insisted on all their bass players play with a pick. Lurker was right, it was Johnny Neel who made the McCartney remark.
 
#55
Could it be in any way possible that Betts just wanted to be able to hear the bass, in a mix that included two drummers, two guitarists and a guy playing a B3?
Berry Oakley and Lamar Williams both had it figured out (although Oakley started on guitar and might not have ever learned to play with his fingers, anyway).
 
#56
Not sure about that...I would think it's preference on Betts' part.

IMO, fingers can be heard easily in a mix with that instrumentation (add a percussionist in there, too).
Want proof? Check out the 'modern' ABB w/ Oteil...there's some live recordings & DVDs. The bass is hot & upfront.
 
#58
I disagree a bit with those who see an overall decline in the quality of r&b. I actually think r&b has gotten better over the last ten years. The period of total drum machine and sequencer dominance from the mid Eighties to the mid Nineties was when it was at its worst. I think younger r&b acts have managed to mix their hip hop sensibility well with a respect for the older r&b traditions. I just think that the funk feel that I grew up with is passe for the moment. I think people like Angie Stone, Raphael Saadiq, Robin Thicke, Lalah Hathaway, Ledisi, John Legend, and plenty of others, are making great music. Alot of it has some nice bass work too. It's just not slap.:)
 
#59
Dr. Cheese said:
Since you want to argue, we can. I did not ignore Marvin Gaye to make my argument stronger. Marvin Gaye died well before Chris Brown was born and Beyonce and Usher were toddlers, so the idea that the music bridges a long period of time still applies. Furthermore, Marvin Gaye was a pop artist. Think about all of the singles he released for Tamla prior to gaining artistic freedom in the early 1970's. Even after he gained freedom and started multi-tracking his voice, he still turned out a bunch of great pop like After the Dance, Got to Give It Up, and Sexual Healing. As for Fats Waller, you are the first person I have ever known of who called his music r&b. Most critics I know of considered him part of the jazz or the swing era since his peak was in the 1930's, well before early versions of r&b like jump blues were created.

As for Lawrence Cohn's opinion, I respect it, as I respect yours. I don't, however, agree with it. I think that r&b is a very broad category like rock or country, and over the years, there have been very distinct movements within the genre like Soul, Funk, and Neo-Soul. I will agree with Cohn to a degree that r&b is a bit of a catch-all term, but I feel that popular Black music is distinctive enough that it deserves its own category.
Click to expand...

Actually, I think I kind of agree. I think I shouldn't have said it's not a genre, I don't think that I should have said R&B is not a genre, but that the genre is defined more as black popular music more than it's music elements. My bad.
 
#60
JimK said:
Not sure about that...I would think it's preference on Betts' part.

IMO, fingers can be heard easily in a mix with that instrumentation (add a percussionist in there, too).
Want proof? Check out the 'modern' ABB w/ Oteil...there's some live recordings & DVDs. The bass is hot & upfront.
Click to expand...

True, I've seen clips of Oteil with them, and you can hear the bass. But it might be that Betts preferred the pick because HE could hear the bass better, ONSTAGE. :)
Just going with the traditional wisdom that a pick cuts through better. I can't think of another possible reason why Dickey would care about it.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back