Dead Spots?????

[Remus_Redbone]

My understanding of the physics of the "dead spot" is that every instrument has certain resonant frequencies which can cause certain notes to be lacking in harmonic overtones that would otherwise give the note sustain and fullness. The resonant frequencies vary in location and intensity from instrument to instrument. I own 9 basses, and they all (even my Sadowsky 4) have this phenomenon to a greater or lesser degree. Even my new Lakland 5, which has graphite rods in the neck, has this, although to a much lesser degree than an all-wood neck. After talking to several luthiers about this (including Roger Sadowsky) it seems clear to me that this is just part of the nature of wooden instruments. I think that one of the biggest challenges in trying out a new instrument is identifying these spots, and determining whether that instrument's idiosyncrasies will be a problem for you, given your style of playing.

I'm in 100% agreement here. I've been playing abojt 30 years and with the exception of graphite neck basses, I've never played a bass that didn't have a resonant frequency that couldn't be reproduced somewhere in the range of the instrument. I've had dozens of players tell me their bass had no dead spots and I subsequently showed them the spot (or two, or three). It can be very subtle and that's what you want. The reason graphite usually won't have a dead spot is because its resonant frequency is out of the freq range a bass can reproduce, but they have very different overtones that some don't like. The resonant frequency of wood is also what makes it produce the overtones that helps make a bass sound like a bass so it's not all a bad thing. It's just one of those laws of physics you can't change, but you can move the resonant freq to a less noticeable note/location on the neck.

 

[southpaw219]

My Hagstrom HB-4 has a dead-ish spot on the G-string, around the 7th fret. Otherwise, I'm pretty happy about the instrument ... the less sustain of that D-note does bug me but, hey, I got the bass for dirt cheap, it's my first, I'm learning on it. C'est la vie.

 

[thedemiurge]

Even a Stradivarius has a wolfnote.

 

[bassbenj]

I'm in 100% agreement here. I've been playing abojt 30 years and with the exception of graphite neck basses, I've never played a bass that didn't have a resonant frequency that couldn't be reproduced somewhere in the range of the instrument. I've had dozens of players tell me their bass had no dead spots and I subsequently showed them the spot (or two, or three). It can be very subtle and that's what you want. The reason graphite usually won't have a dead spot is because its resonant frequency is out of the freq range a bass can reproduce, but they have very different overtones that some don't like. The resonant frequency of wood is also what makes it produce the overtones that helps make a bass sound like a bass so it's not all a bad thing. It's just one of those laws of physics you can't change, but you can move the resonant freq to a less noticeable note/location on the neck.

Come on all you guys who think "dead spots are Imaginary" and "High end basses don't have 'em" need to give it up. The ABOVE is the definitive dead spot post. It's all true. If you'd like to test for dead spots you CAN make them go away by pressing your headstock into the wall while playing notes. So if you hear/feel a difference (you can actually FEEL the resonance of the dead spot in the neck!) on a given note with the headstock pressed or not, chances are there is SOME kind of dead spot there! You can move them to a different note with weight on the headstock, but "fixing" them always seems to require a neck from a different tree.

 

[tstone]

The phenomenon of dead spots is perfectly well understood by acoustical engineers. Here's a lay language paper which summarizes what causes them:

Invalid Link Removed

 

[maturanesa]

dead spot is caused by the bass itself vibrating in simpathy with that note. The result is a "cancelled" vibration. Different designs and weights would change that note, and adding mass to the headstock or body would change too... But always you got a note that vibrates less than the others, in any instrument... Neck Through basses have less deadspots generally, but its because the bass have more sustain overall and that deadspot is not so noticiable or annoying like in a bolt on

 

[polyrhythmia]

And you can't just adjust the resonant frequency so that it lies halfway between 2 notes? Just wondering...

 

[50hz]

My understanding of the physics of the "dead spot" is that every instrument has certain resonant frequencies which can cause certain notes to be lacking in harmonic overtones that would otherwise give the note sustain and fullness. The resonant frequencies vary in location and intensity from instrument to instrument. I own 9 basses, and they all (even my Sadowsky 4) have this phenomenon to a greater or lesser degree. Even my new Lakland 5, which has graphite rods in the neck, has this, although to a much lesser degree than an all-wood neck. After talking to several luthiers about this (including Roger Sadowsky) it seems clear to me that this is just part of the nature of wooden instruments. I think that one of the biggest challenges in trying out a new instrument is identifying these spots, and determining whether that instrument's idiosyncrasies will be a problem for you, given your style of playing.

+1
my understanding as well. it's a harmonic frequency thing and not price range. graphite necks are supposedly immune from this because the graphite resonates differently.

 

[njbluesbassist]

Try differnt strings before taking more costly steps. It won't always be the cure but I had an old P-bass that came with Labella flats. There was a dead spot on the G string at the D note. For years I replaced the strings with other Labella flatwounds and the dead spot stayed. I had learned to play around it when I used that old bass. When I switched to GHS bass boomer flatwounds the dead spot went away. Most dead spots are as described above, but just something to try as a first attempt to fix.

 

[bassbenj]

Try differnt strings before taking more costly steps. It won't always be the cure but I had an old P-bass that came with Labella flats. There was a dead spot on the G string at the D note. For years I replaced the strings with other Labella flatwounds and the dead spot stayed. I had learned to play around it when I used that old bass. When I switched to GHS bass boomer flatwounds the dead spot went away. Most dead spots are as described above, but just something to try as a first attempt to fix.

Lots of things can affect dead spots. I had a weird experience this winter. I've got a MIM Fender Deluxe V that has no serious dead spots and only one sort of a minor tonal change on one note on the G string. Well, somehow the bass was stored where it was cold and when I started to play it there was this HUGE dead spot on the G string. It felt like someone had switched my bass for another one when I wasn't looking! It really had me going for a while!

But happily, as the bass warmed up to room temperature, the dead spot disappeared and the bass became it's old normal self.

 

[mongo2]

Out of the many, many longscale basses I've owned and tried I have precisely one neck that controls dead/hot spots well. It's a very stiff Allparts neck.

Out of the many, many shortscale basses I've owned and tried I've only had very few that didn't control dead/hot spots well.

 

[gubs]

I play a MiM road worn 60s jazz bass and i have never had any issues at all with dead spots. In any case I saw this and thought it could help http://www.bestbassgear.com/ebass/gear/hardware/tuner/treating-your-basses-deadspot.html

 

[nrs7six]

Try differnt strings before taking more costly steps. It won't always be the cure but I had an old P-bass that came with Labella flats. There was a dead spot on the G string at the D note. For years I replaced the strings with other Labella flatwounds and the dead spot stayed. I had learned to play around it when I used that old bass. When I switched to GHS bass boomer flatwounds the dead spot went away. Most dead spots are as described above, but just something to try as a first attempt to fix.

Hi, bit of a blast from the past this one! I have a dead spot on the E string of a P bass I have which is driving me nuts! I have been researching a way to cure it without altering the bass and this has come up more than once. Can i ask, was it just the brand of strings you changed or was it guage as well?

 

[DonP]

I've owned quite a number of basses (maybe 15 in my lifetime, and I've been playing for a number of decades). Peavey, Ibanez, Sire, Fender, Gibson, etc. Every single one had at least one fret with poor sustain, comparatively speaking, and exactly as everyone has posted regarding location on the neck. I did own one for quite a few years that had the most perfect sustaining neck and balanced tonal response across all four strings. It was a Kramer, with the aluminum/wood neck. Quite heavy,...I really only wanted to use it when playing seated. Not only was it heavy, but the neck weight caused the balance of the bass to be pitiful. But that neck used to make notes sing for a long time if you wished it to.

 

[96tbird]

Zombie thread but I’ll bite!

How often do you need a C, C#, or D on the G string to sustain for more than a quarter when actually playing music instead of obsessing over your badd? Need a C to sustain for an entire bar? Others are available on the neck; and they have more balls than a C on the G. Higher string notes seldom allowed to ring for days and are instead best for articulate punchy multi note passages as we all know.

That C on the G lives in the six string world, leave it for the guitarist to sustain that one and use it only for short counts. If you absolutely need that octave, it’s available on the D string. Problem solved.

 

[Tedward]

Of the basses I own all of them have dead spots to a certain degree and that includes the ones I have built. I have used carbon fiber rods, multi laminated necks and dual action truss rods with no luck. I heard one p bass the note disappeared when played like he skipped the note, that was an extreme dead spot.

A question I have been asking my self is. If the resonance frequency is the cause which is 139 HZ (C# on the G string the most common spot), why does it not happen with the C# on the D string? Both C#'s are 139 HZ.

I have been looking at this problem from a different angle. When the head stock is pressed into the wall the dead spot goes away. The wall is keeping the head from vibrating. I'm thinking that the head is vibrating out of phase from the neck, the nut being the separation point. The point where the string, nut and neck meet.

I have been planning to build a multi laminate neck with two pieces of aluminum 1/8" thick the full thickness of the neck and the full length from the heel all the way through the head stock.

Tedward

 

[96tbird]

Probably because on a Fender, the distance from fifth fret to nut is the ALMOST the same as from nut to the tip of the headstock.

Uneducated guess but the measurements are true.

 

[Baysman68]

Hello all. I have recently purchased a new Fender 60th Anniversary Road Worn Jazz bass. Straight out of the box, it plays quite well. However I do have a slight dead spot on the D string (10th fret = C), which none of my other Jazz Basses have (most have one around the 5th-7th fret on the G string). Could this be a fret issue, as I have not had the bass professionally set up and it still has the original strings. Your thoughts ?

 

[vaesto]

Lets keep this thread on and on
I have two basses: MIM Classic 50's Precision and non-name low-cost P-bass thing, which I even re-shaped the neck because of poor quality. And...MIM has a dead spot at 7th fret on G. The root frequencies fade out pretty fast, leaving higher ones only. It becomes more audible with fuzz (Big Muff) when this high freq squeak/harmonics stays as long as you hold the note. None of this happens to neighbor positions on the same G string. I've swapped 3 different string sets: Rotosound 66 (45-105), EB Cobalt Flats (45-105) and Rotosound BS66 (43-110), all of them have the same dead spot. So I assume it is not caused by the string itself. Adding mass to the headstock (e.g. F-clamp) DOES SOLVE the dead spot issue.
Surprisingly, the other bass have no dead spot at all even with the same strings, which came from my Fender.

 

[Yahboy]

Hello all. I have recently purchased a new Fender 60th Anniversary Road Worn Jazz bass. Straight out of the box, it plays quite well. However I do have a slight dead spot on the D string (10th fret = C), which none of my other Jazz Basses have (most have one around the 5th-7th fret on the G string). Could this be a fret issue, as I have not had the bass professionally set up and it still has the original strings. Your thoughts ?

My 2 months old Squier Cv50P has dead spot on E string 5th fret . Problem dint solve even i tighten all mechince head/ bridge /neck joint screws , neck pocket cleaned and major setup did.
The final solution is Joyo headstock clip tuner.

Dead Spot on E string ..... Try this "CHEAP" headstock Clip-on Tuner.

I cant gurrantee this work on your bass, but worth to try.