Deadbeats in bands..............

[Slevage]

If you want to soar with the eagles---- stop grazing with the turkeys.

Find a band without deadbeats.

 

[mellowinman]

I'm in a currently 3 piece, and while not exactly deadbeats, the guitarists bring skill / talent, manpower for load in / out, and little else. One of my guitarists I provide guitar, and amp for even. I understand the financial issues, he is also the one pushing for more frequent gigs. We learn our parts, practice together, and get it as tight as we can before we go out and gig. We are a party band, that's what we want to be, and are happy as a clam that way, again, except one guitarist that wants to do more... This could end up being a problem soon.

You are playing bass in a three piece that has two guitar players?

 

[Kragnorak]

this drummer looked at us and just said flat out "I didn't even listen to these songs. I didn't pick them, so why should I care". I've never seen the guitar player get so mad in my life.

Now normally I would just fire someone like that, but he not only drums but does all the sequencing for the band as well (Keyboard and Synth parts are pre-recorded). Its tough to find someone in the area that can do that.

This is the worst story in the thread in my opinion! I'd get rid of that guy and do without the sequencing for a little bit because his attitude is poison.

I had a drummer sabotage an album and band before. One guy in the band wrote the bulk of the material. He and one other fronted the money to record a full-length album, and the plan was to shop it around. One day we were discussing where and how to get the album mixed, mastered and pressed when the drummer chimes in:

Drummer: Maybe we should record some different songs.

Us: .... What?

Drummer: The songs.

Us: What are you talking about?

Drummer: I feel like we should just record different songs. Like instead of this batch.

Us: ?! You realize that we have already dropped a grand in recording and mixing, right? We're discussing the next steps!

Drummer: I'm just not really crazy about these songs I guess.

This simple but stupid exchange was enough to deflate enthusiasm for the investment and not only was the album not released but the band broke up soon after. We were astounded that a member that had not invested financially could be so dumb as to expect us to go back to the drawing board after never voicing objections in the previous months. Meanwhile I own an album that I enjoy that nobody will ever hear.

 

[delta7fred]

My previous band had it's share of dead weight. Guitarist (1) and I put in all the work in learning new material and getting gigs and guitarist (2) and drummer showed up to rehearsals (occasionally) and gigs and took their cut of the money. They never learned new songs properly and the only suggestions they ever brought were songs that they already knew.

That band went on hiatus when guitar (1) and I got sick of dragging the other 2 along. I pulled the plug on it when our new band (below) started to take off.

Guitarist (1) and I are now in a 3 piece with another drummer, who is at least as keen as we are, and are doing remarkably well in this difficult climate for gigs.

 

[Big Hoss]

You are playing bass in a three piece that has two guitar players?

Yep. No drummer, just drum synth. We haven't found a drummer that has worked out yet. The ones that we have auditioned either A. Think they are freaking rock stars already and want to gig 3 - 4 nights a week which we aren't aimed for, OR B. Can't figure out how to hold time, at all. Period, end of story... So a Beat Buddy takes the place of the drummer...

There is a particular drummer I want to bring in, but he gave up drumming a while ago in favor of guitars... Trying to talk him into going back...

 

[Bassmann79]

Now you know why it is so special when those select few come together and make it. Its rare and now you know why, that and the area you live in might not have a good scene?

 

[DWBass]

If you want to soar with the eagles---- stop grazing with the turkeys.

Find a band without deadbeats.

Easier said than done. No bass vacancies at all.

 

[logicman69]

This is the worst story in the thread in my opinion! I'd get rid of that guy and do without the sequencing for a little bit because his attitude is poison.

We have been looking for a replacement... quietly. We are getting a bit fed up with him. When he is on, he is on point and an amazing drummer. But more often than not he is just phoning it in. Funny thing is he is the first one to complain and bitch when we dont have gigs because he needs the money (We gig 4-6x a month and make about $150/person for a gig, but the rest of us have established careers). You think someone who needs the $$ that bad would put int he work.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

this malady is not limited to bands. I have seen them every where I've worked.
I even quit music for a while because of them. From experience, I can tell you quitting will not cure the problem.

 

[DWBass]

Now you know why it is so special when those select few come together and make it. Its rare and now you know why, that and the area you live in might not have a good scene?

It's a great scene if I want to be in a rock or country band. Not so good for Funk, R&B, Soul bands.

 

[DWBass]

this malady is not limited to bands. I have seen them every where I've worked.
I even quit music for a while because of them. From experience, I can tell you quitting will not cure the problem.

Won't cure the problem at all but it'll save me the stress of having to deal with it. I'm gonna give it a few more years (I'll be 60 in 3 years) and then call it a day. If I had stayed in NY, I wouldn't have this issue. I visited home last summer and hit a few jam sessions and got no less than 10 'are you available' requests and exchanged business cards. I could be playing 5 night a week if I wanted playing the music I like with good musos. Not happening here.

 

[waveman]

He was using TABS and for the WRONG ARTIST.
We were covering a cover.
His solution was even more ridiculous, rather than relearn it, he brought a guitar RETUNED 1/2 step UP???? (i guess he has never heard of a CAPO.)

Tell him to tune a guitar a half a step down and re-learn it, lol

Some songs I can switch key easily, others not really- too much muscle memory going on or something. I have to use four different base tunings to practice our songs at home - Eb, E, F, Gb and then there is at least one drop "D" for each of those.

 

[Bullitt5135]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...

The Three Rules for Being in a Band:
1) Be on time.
2) Be prepared.
3) Don't be a jerk.

After my last band went sideways, I have added:

4) Do not waste time on people who fail to live up to #1, 2 or 3.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

Won't cure the problem at all but it'll save me the stress of having to deal with it. I'm gonna give it a few more years (I'll be 60 in 3 years) and then call it a day. If I had stayed in NY, I wouldn't have this issue. I visited home last summer and hit a few jam sessions and got no less than 10 'are you available' requests and exchanged business cards. I could be playing 5 night a week if I wanted playing the music I like with good musos. Not happening here.

Don't try to tell me there are no deadbeats in NY. Come on, to misquote a movie line: Deadbeats are everywhere, I can see them, they don't know they are deadbeats.

 

[40Hz]

How does one learn a song in the wrong key? On purpose?

Why should it matter? Worked it out in the "wrong" key? Just play it in the "right" one. If you can play something in one key, you should be able to switch it to any other key on the fly - assuming you actually know how to play your instrument.

What do you do if you have a guest singer join you for a number, or your regular one needs it a half step down some night because they're not hitting their highs for some reason?

Handling key changes is a basic skill. Aprentice level stuff. I don't get it.

I'll cut a vocalist or horn player some slack on that due to physiology and physics. But not a string or keyboard player.

 

[Burwabit]

... why do the BL's tolerate it??? ...

Because it's usually the singer

 

[Eric Swaim]

"If they don't bring anything to the table, then there is no chair for them."

 

[Lobster11]

This is an interesting thread for me, because it makes me wonder if I am the deadbeat. Or the other 3 guys.

I play in a band consisting of two guitarists who have played together 20+ years. They are both very, very good. (IMHO) The current drummer has been playing with them for 6+ years, and they have had a revolving door of bassists over the years. We are around the same age (I am youngest at 37, guitarists are 38 and 39, drummer is 46). I myself have only been playing a little over two years (although I have owned bass guitars most of my life). I joined this band a little over a year ago, via reaching out to an acquaintance who I knew lived in the area and was a guitar player. The band has never 'played out' or gigged, it's more of a hobby thing I guess, I just love having the chance to play with other musicians for the first time in my life. Although I can not say that the thought of one day making money doing this [even $20] does not excite me.
The three of them drink, I do not. But we all get along very well, and have very similar tastes in music, although I myself tend to be a bit more eclectic. We have no dedicated singer, for a couple of the songs we play, one or the other of the guitarists will attempt to sing. We play mainly 90s metal/hard rock with some classic rock thrown in. They have 1 and a half original songs.

I do practice at home, everyday. Sometimes I can only get in 30 minutes, sometimes 3+ hours. Problem is, I never know what they want to play. We have a kind of set list (a book filled with songs they have learned over the years), and I have lyrics and music (tab), and always come prepared (have even received compliments on that, and the fact that I always show up). When I show up on band night, I am ready for anything, because I never know what will be thrown at me. Invariably, if I spend the week focusing on 'Wasted Years", "Comfortably Numb", and "Man in the Box"; they will want to play "Clean my Wounds", "Heading out to the Highway" and "Whole lotta Rosie". I guess, after a while of doing this, I will eventually get better (I can already tell I have improved marginally). We usually have about 3.5 hours once a week to practice/jam/whatever. On some of those occasions, we have all been focused, and get through 17-18 songs. The normal night for us (especially lately), in the same time-frame, we play about 8-12 songs. And is it normal to never, ever play the same song more than once (in one night)? Seems to me attacking 3 or 4 songs a night until we 'nail it' would be the way to go. But I digress.

Thanks for reading!
//rant

I'm in a couple of hobby bands and know what you're talking about.

Here are a couple of reasons why you shouldn't be too hard on yourself. First, it's likely that no one cares. One of the great things about a hobby band is that you can screw up and it doesn't matter (although, of course, it's more fun to play well than to play poorly). Second, notice that it would be a little unfair if they call all the songs and expect you to be fully prepared for anything. They can always pick the songs that they are prepared to play, so they're not in the same boat as you.

If you're concerned about it, though, there are a few things you could do. One is to participate in the song selection, so they know what it's like for a tune to be called that they aren't prepared for. When someone suggests a song you're not feeling up for, chime in and suggest an alternative. In my bands everyone contributes song suggests throughout the evening. Another is to suggest that someone work up a set list and distribute it a few days in advance, so you know what's coming. Another advantage of doing this is that it keeps things moving, and you spend less time standing around trying to decide what to do next.

 

[jive1]

I have no dead weight in my band. Neither I, nor the guys in the band will tolerate it. Nobody in the band wants to rehearse all the time, nobody wants to sound bad, and everyone likes good paying gigs. Dead weight in the band would compromise that, so we don't tolerate it. We've had guys who didn't listen to the songs and/or prepare adequately, and they were replaced immediately. Our clients pay too much money for a special time for us to produce a half-@$$ed product, and I expect my musicians to take pride in their work. We all don't do an equal amount of work by any means, but everyone in the band is expected to learn the material on their own, tighten it up in 1-2 rehearsals, and perform at a high level at the gig. Anything less than that, and they become dead weight. I find that having this standard also helps to keep the good players. Seriously, what competent and diligent worker wants to get paid the same as those that slack? None.

I used to have a hard time finding folks, but realized that if I had paying gigs, the players would come crawling out of the woodwork. And once I had some good paying gigs, the great players who were 'too busy' all of a sudden had more time on their hands. I don't hesitate replacing folks because because once you have a gig paying $300+ per player, there's usually someone competent who would love that gig.

 

[DWBass]

Don't try to tell me there are no deadbeats in NY. Come on, to misquote a movie line: Deadbeats are everywhere, I can see them, they don't know they are deadbeats.

Oh I'm sure there are. They just don't gig! The jam sessions I go to, there are nothing but amazing musicians and singers in attendance. The NYC scene is less tolerant to sub-par musicians. At least in my experience it has. Growing up in the 70's there was typically a band on every block competing for the top spot in the neighborhood. They all were good. If you sucked, you didn't get to play until you got better. Not so here, unfortunately.

And the plan is to gig and make some money. Can't do that with sub-par musicians. I agree with Jive1, paying gigs attract good musicians. I have some ideas in the tank but it won't involve either of these bands unfortunately. So don't worry, I'm not quitting just yet. Just letting off some steam.