Defending Davie504 (OMG)b

[2112]

... as always something good will probably come out of it.

I think you make an important point, here... and I think some good things have already come out of it. Davie504 has exposed a large section of the general public to bass, and more people are picking up the bass because of it. This opens the door to a major expansion of how the instrument is used. Davie504 has also exposed a large number of very talented players to the public eye, who will also influence new players and expose new players of their own. What about Charles Berthoud? An absolute chopsmonster on bass (who also has a strong musical foundation) that I didn't learn about until I watched a couple Davie504 videos... and I've played bass for almost 30 years.

Taken together through their collabs, these players are showing everyone that there is much joy to be found by picking up any musical instrument and getting together with someone, anyone and sharing the experience, regardless of how it comes out. To me, it seems experiencing and sharing joy is the whole point of music (and all art, for that matter).

It's like giving a box of crayons (the 64-pack, of course ) to a bunch of kiddos and turning them loose. They have a ton of fun expressing themselves and sharing those expressions with others and influencing each other. It's not sophisticated and lacks artistic foundation in the conventional sense. Those that are motivated to make a go of it on a more permanent basis will explore it more deeply and gain that foundation as they grow.

 

[Jazz Ad]

I didn't say he wasn't a solid musician. What I said is that musical pieces composed presumably with a goal or intention are quite different from a few bars the intent of which is to illustrate a video the intent of which, in turn, is to have has many viewers as possible.

Let's look at it this way.
At 26 he already released 3 solo albums and is world famous as a bass player, with chops that would humble most people on this board and elsewhere.
Who else accomplished that ?

 

[AudioTaper]

I think you make an important point, here... and I think some good things have already come out of it. Davie504 has exposed a large section of the general public to bass, and more people are picking up the bass because of it. This opens the door to a major expansion of how the instrument is used. Davie504 has also exposed a large number of very talented players to the public eye, who will also influence new players and expose new players of their own. What about Charles Berthoud? An absolute chopsmonster on bass (who also has a strong musical foundation) that I didn't learn about until I watched a couple Davie504 videos... and I've played bass for almost 30 years.

Taken together through their collabs, these players are showing everyone that there is much joy to be found by picking up any musical instrument and getting together with someone, anyone and sharing the experience, regardless of how it comes out. To me, it seems experiencing and sharing joy is the whole point of music (and all art, for that matter).

It's like giving a box of crayons (the 64-pack, of course ) to a bunch of kiddos and turning them loose. They have a ton of fun expressing themselves and sharing those expressions with others and influencing each other. It's not sophisticated and lacks artistic foundation in the conventional sense. Those that are motivated to make a go of it on a more permanent basis will explore it more deeply and gain that foundation as they grow.

I discovered Charles through his collab with Davie as well. Hes gotten my back into tapping again (I used to listen to a LOT of Stu Hamm) and I enjoy his videos for the music, humor, and I've been picking up techniques (or at least trying to)

 

[AudioTaper]

Let's look at it this way.
At 26 he already released 3 solo albums and is world famous as a bass player, with chops that would humble most people on this board and elsewhere.
Who else accomplished that ?

Exactly!
I mentioned the Cooking Spaghetti video a page or two ago. It has 3M views. I poked around online and it looks like people at his level get around a penny per view or more. 3M x $0.01 is $30K.
Sure, it's taken him awhile to get the fan base and he puts a lot of time and effort into the videos. But who here makes $30K for playing bass for 12 seconds?
I call that a win for him.

 

[lokikallas]

He combines Bass and Meme's. How can he lose? Seriously, his videos always make me laugh.

 

[knight of ni]

I think you make an important point, here... and I think some good things have already come out of it. Davie504 has exposed a large section of the general public to bass, and more people are picking up the bass because of it. This opens the door to a major expansion of how the instrument is used. Davie504 has also exposed a large number of very talented players to the public eye, who will also influence new players and expose new players of their own. What about Charles Berthoud? An absolute chopsmonster on bass (who also has a strong musical foundation) that I didn't learn about until I watched a couple Davie504 videos... and I've played bass for almost 30 years.

Taken together through their collabs, these players are showing everyone that there is much joy to be found by picking up any musical instrument and getting together with someone, anyone and sharing the experience, regardless of how it comes out. To me, it seems experiencing and sharing joy is the whole point of music (and all art, for that matter).

It's like giving a box of crayons (the 64-pack, of course ) to a bunch of kiddos and turning them loose. They have a ton of fun expressing themselves and sharing those expressions with others and influencing each other. It's not sophisticated and lacks artistic foundation in the conventional sense. Those that are motivated to make a go of it on a more permanent basis will explore it more deeply and gain that foundation as they grow.

You're putting that in a a much more optimistic way than I would but I admit you may end up right and me wrong. In fact I do hope you're right and I'm wrong.

Let's look at it this way.
At 26 he already released 3 solo albums and is world famous as a bass player, with chops that would humble most people on this board and elsewhere.
Who else accomplished that ?

He sure is successful. And ? We're heading towards the art and success topic, always tough. Call me idealist but I'd rather have kids buying a guitar and work their ass off because of Al Di Meola or Van Halen rather than because of Davie504's videos. Talking of Davie504 I'd rather have him record more albums than making videos. You will object he's making more money this way. So be it.

Apparently because he's not fawning over old records in his videos.

?

 

[Jazz Ad]

I'd rather have kids buying a guitar and work their ass off because of Al Di Meola or Van Halen rather than because of Davie504's videos.

You want kids to get inspiration from people the age of their grandparents? Why?

There are awesome young musicians everywhere these days, there is a new boom going on all in styles. Music is back into kids' interests and they have countless models their age. Davie is one of them.

You talk about Van Halen, please explain how Eruption (today, not when released) is more inspirational or respectable than a YouTube video of the same length.

 

[knight of ni]

You want kids to get inspiration from people the age of their grandparents? Why?.

I'm using universal references but I could have said Thundercat, Louis Cole, Anderson .Paak (the latter being my favorite) ? But it is a strange society in which anything produced by 'old people' is boring and uninteresting. My son is 20 and for quite a while he has been listening both to Jefferson Airplane and Kendrick Lamar (on his own, I don't listen to any of them).

There are awesome young musicians everywhere these days, there is a new boom going on all in styles. Music is back into kids' interests and they have countless models their age. Davie is one of them.

True, eg.

more interesting IMO than any Davie504 video.

You talk about Van Halen, please explain how Eruption (today, not when released) is more inspirational or respectable than a YouTube video of the same length.

You're putting things out of context. Any musical You Tube video can be inspirational. I don't think Davie504 makes musical video. He is using music or rather technical skills to make videos, and that's not quite the same.

This discussion is not getting anywhere. Look, I don't say Davie504 is a bad musician or whatever. I don't dispute the fact that a lot of kids like his videos and that it gives exposure to bass playing. There's no hidden 'it was better before' message. I truly believe some interesting music is being created nowadays, and yes I would be tempted to add 'again'. My point is that Davie504 uses technical skills to make his videos ('the unplayable bass line' etc) and that is IMO very limited. Some may think otherwise, as @2112, and I acknowledge these other point of views.

 

[fourstringdrums]

He is entertaining for his audience but it doesn't do anything for me. "can you play bass with a bass (fish)"

 

[LBS-bass]

?

True. It's just that a friend's son got a bass and began trying to play easy lines in some Davie504 videos. i don't see that getting somewhere as opposed to playing lines from the Beatles, Kiss, RHCP, etc. I also see people doing err, modern ? music, like Thundercat or Louis Cole, having solid musical foundations. Oh well just a thought, as always something good will probably come out of it.

You're talking about the value of learning songs, as in play-along and appreciation videos. Do you know how many people are out there telling us why this song or that one from the "golden era" of music was amazing? Rick Beato kind of has that schtick down already. Play-alongs are a dime a dozen.

I don't see that what Davie is doing is divorced from having a solid musical foundation, he's just presenting things in a different way.

 

[knight of ni]

You're talking about the value of learning songs, as in play-along and appreciation videos. Do you know how many people are out there telling us why this song or that one from the "golden era" of music was amazing? Rick Beato kind of has that schtick down already. Play-alongs are a dime a dozen.

I don't see that what Davie is doing is divorced from having a solid musical foundation, he's just presenting things in a different way.

I've watched a few of Beato's videos because he has access to masters which are interesting. But you can tell from his videos listing/titles that a lot of it is clickbait and it quickly became repetitive. I admit the only videos I watch on YouTube are concerts and stuff you don't find on streaming platforms. Otherwise videos are pretty much a loss of time compared to reading. You can read an article pretty quickly, skimming through it and get back for thorough reading if it's worth it. Videos you've got to listen at normal speed.
As for Davie504, I get your point, I think : you're saying that if the shape/style of the videos is different, the content is the same as a musical video ? I don't know. A moment ago my son told me he had a discussion with his friends over the increasing number of technically impressive but musically poor player videos. He had his friends compare a video of guy skilled in harmonics on bass with Jaco's version of Donna Lee. All agreed Jaco was more musical. I'm not saying kids should be listening to Jaco but maybe they lack musical models and are falling back on technique ?

 

[Dwsmit]

Let's not discart what he does because we don't like it. The phenomenon around him is huge.
Not only on social media where bass=Davie504 for everyone even out of musical contexts but he is THE major inspiration for today's kids to pick up a bass.
Pretty much like Flea in the 90s. His influence is that big.

That analogy is the same as saying I shouldn’t dismiss Pewdiepie as he influences children to play Minecraft? I’m an old curmudgeon and I don’t get, nor like Davie504. To each their own, my own is never to click one of his videos ever again.

 

[OptimalOptimus]

Davie uses bass (well slap bass) to do some entertainment... nothing new under the sun ... Bands used to do the same thing... record music in order to make money. Now they do meme and heavy editing to make money he just chose to use bass.

it takes some practice to be good slapper but he seems to only be able to do that

 

[2112]

No matter what anybody accomplishes, there will always be others that choose to tear them down because the accomplishments were not made in accordance with the others' various ideas of "what should have been done" or "the way it should have been done".

 

[knight of ni]

No matter what anybody accomplishes, there will always be others that choose to tear them down because the accomplishments were not made in accordance with the others' various ideas of "what should have been done" or "the way it should have been done".

True but the argument can be returned : it's not because someone is successful that he/she should be praised as a model.

 

[J_Bass]

No matter what anybody accomplishes, there will always be others that choose to tear them down because the accomplishments were not made in accordance with the others' various ideas of "what should have been done" or "the way it should have been done".

Kenny G..

 

[2112]

True but the argument can be returned : it's not because someone is successful that he/she should be praised as a model.

Fair enough... kinda like TCS/rosewood/tort P's strung with flats. I'm going to think about this point for a bit.

Kenny G..

I don't have any problem with Kenny G. As a sax player myself, and one that prefers soprano, I admire his talent and accomplishments, although his style is not necessarily my favorite. This, on the other hand...

 

[Eli_Kyiv]

Davie uses bass (well slap bass) to do some entertainment... nothing new under the sun ... Bands used to do the same thing... record music in order to make money. Now they do meme and heavy editing to make money he just chose to use bass.

it takes some practice to be good slapper but he seems to only be able to do that

His fingerstyle is quite impressive as well.

 

[Clark Dark]

I think @knight of ni said his son is listening to Kendrick Lamar. If that is the case his son is listening to Thundercat.

 

[OptimalOptimus]

His fingerstyle is quite impressive as well.

I don’t like the way he plays... thumb over neck is awful and his hand banding... anyway