Double Bass Die Fledermaus Strauss - speedy passage fingering

[CaseyVancouver]

Bars 353, 354 at about 114 bpm.

This was going to be a two part question, but just now watching a video of fine players, pic below, answered part of it, the bow on string location.

My initial confusion stems from my conductor, an advanced violinist who often applies violin technique to the low strings in our orchestra.

There is an authoritative insistence to play at the bridge for fast passages, which works for violin, but often not bass imho. The photo below shows one of the finest bass sections playing this passage approximately at the end of the fingerboard. So first question answered.

Suggestions for fingering?
My part had previous bassist’s fingering penciled in, which I promptly revised.
I believe one’s natural fingering often will work best, vs something uncomfortable.
The penciled fingering at bars 353, 354 works for me, but my mind is open.

Tempo is about 114 bpm, not the 130 bpm by Maestro Georges Prêtre for the Vienna New Years concert.

 

[AGCurry]

The fingering written in looks like the most obvious approach.

 

[CaseyVancouver]

Yeah, thanks, pretty sure I can get it accurate at speed.
No point fixing something that ain’t broke.

The previous fingering was by a good bassist,
it just was not natural to me.
It was very different to what I wrote in.
Wish I had not erased it, just for discussion.

NY Phil Digital Archives has nothing noted at that passage.

 

[SAlcott]

Violinists should not tell bass players where to play or what bowing to use.

 

[SAlcott]

 

[CaseyVancouver]

Thanks!
That is a wonderful orchestra and impressive conductor.

1970 and almost no ladies. There was a left handed violist.

 

[Brilee]

In 353, I'd do 0114010. Your 354 makes sense to me.

 

[the_Ryan]

In 353, I'd do 0114010. Your 354 makes sense to me.

That's probably what I'd do for 353, closing the first D eliminates a string crossing.

 

[David Potts]

Stick to your guns, Casey. If you have trouble with speed of assimilation practice dotted one way then reverse dotted before returning to straight 16ths.

 

[Leif Dering]

I personally really like your fingering. For speed, I find that less overall motion (in the right hand/arm) than I'd think is the answer.

 

[Paps]

I'd go up the string a bit, the 01-14 as in post 7 and 8.

 

[Brilee]

I forgot to add, that when a violinist tells you where on the string to play, nod and ignore.

 

[elberon]

Agree with all on 353, you might consider doing 1 1 0 1 1 or 1 1 4 1 1 for the last four 16ths of 354 leading to the Bb on the downbeat of 355. I’d have to try different iterations before making a decision on that part.

I don’t know who could make that speak well close to the bridge unless they were going for a super nasty ponticello special effect. I highly doubt that Strauss wanted that kind of sound there.

 

[Paps]

Another subtly you could try when a non-bass player try to lecture you on technique is offer them you bass and ask them to demonstrate. I haven't done it yet, but have been sorely tempted!

 

[Neil Pye]

Another subtly you could try when a non-bass player try to lecture you on technique is offer them you bass and ask them to demonstrate. I haven't done it yet, but have been sorely tempted!

I have done this, with a passage in Berlioz Symphonie Fantastique. The conductor and Leader wanted us to play a forte ascending/descending chromatic scale with a sries of retaken upbows ascending, then downbows descending. After a bit of discussion about why, and how impractical it was for bass, I was getting nowhere, so I offered the Leader (who is a very fine violinist and a great human being, by the way) my bass and suggested she show me. She did have a go, but the point was made!

 

[Stuart.C]

The way you have is probably what I'd do
At tempo

But another way that avoids open d string
Would be get 1 on the f then 2 on c# shift up A string
2 C# on E string 4 D , 1 f and end with the 1 b flat on d string
Avoid open d string and ends on a fatter b flat