Dirt Pedals For Tube Snobs

[bassmandudeguy]

+1 on the Markbass Compressore. Lately I've been using it as a dirt pedal and sounds awesome alone or layered. It's nice and warm (like Laurent said) and I really dig the way it breaks up.

 

[knumbskull]

would i right in thinking that that majority of pedals with tubes in them are "starved plate" designs?

 

[bongomania]

Yes.

People like to think they can tell by looking at the voltage of the power supply, but often they are mistaken. For example a 12V wall wart might be capable of 200 mA, 2000 mA, any current draw; and the power circuit inside the pedal may be designed to take a ton of extra current and convert it into a very high voltage--or it may not. So e.g. there are NON starved-plate tube pedals that take a 12V supply, and there are starved-plated ones that also take a 12V supply but don't do anything useful with the current.

 

[JimmyM]

Bongo, what are some tell-tale signs that would let you know if a tube OD is starved plate or not? From what I'm seeing, it happens less with distortion pedals than in cheaper preamps and DI's. Would I be correct?

 

[bongomania]

Nah, it's all over the map in terms of what kinds of pedals are/aren't. And there's a range, too, like a pedal builder may use a 48V supply and say that it's not starved plate... are they wrong? I don't know. How about 100V? Some people use 200V, even 300V... is it necessary? I don't know.

Then we have something like the Vox Cooltron series where they claim to have created a new circuit that gets optimal performance from the tubes at low voltage... are they just puffing hype, or are they on to something?

I guess the guideline I would use is "does the maker explicitly state what voltage is powering the tubes". That is, if they don't specify, then don't assume. If they are on the ball they may say something like "we use a charge pump to increase the 12V to over 200V internally for powering the tube".

 

[caeman]

This way lies madness, Jimmy. Just come to the solid-state side. We have cookies.

 

[JimmyM]

Well that makes things easier Thx Bongo!

And Caeman...I have cookies, too. Nope, I'm condemned to the tube amp schlep.

 

[knumbskull]

thanks, bongomania

 

[scotch]

...add to the discussion that low or high plate voltages can both do clean or crunchy! Depending on the utilization, high voltages can yield more headroom and less crunch. Starved plate designs can sound rockin' on their own too.

Whether a pedal has tubes or not & whether the voltages are high or low shouldn't really be primary considerations. Tone should! Of course many of us find that we gravitate towards one technology or the other, which is fine, but at the end of the day your hands and ears should be the judge - not the dang spec sheet!

 

[JimmyM]

...add to the discussion that low or high plate voltages can both do clean or crunchy! Depending on the utilization, high voltages can yield more headroom and less crunch. Starved plate designs can sound rockin' on their own too.

Whether a pedal has tubes or not & whether the voltages are high or low shouldn't really be primary considerations. Tone should! Of course many of us find that we gravitate towards one technology or the other, which is fine, but at the end of the day your hands and ears should be the judge - not the dang spec sheet!

Sir, you have violated the spirit of Talkbass, where gear nerds rule and specs and topology must be argued for years on end.

 

[Hauge]

+1 on the Markbass Compressore. Lately I've been using it as a dirt pedal and sounds awesome alone or layered. It's nice and warm (like Laurent said) and I really dig the way it breaks up.

Sorry to go off-topic, but can you suggest any settings for this purpose? My Compressore stays pretty clean unless I really dig in at extreme settings.

 

[Charley Umbria]

Maybe I ought not to rush into this. Not like it'll kill me to use solid state for dirt. Even Stevie Ray Vaughan did it.

Yes, that's it, Jimmy...come to the dark (green) side.

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SRV's Board


Actually, I've got an AnalogMan silver-modded TS9-DX Turbo Tube Screamer that sounds really nice through a Fender tube amp. You can add just a little grit, and the amp takes care of the tubey tone. Probably not the thing for your REDDI setup, though...

 

[caeman]

All this chatter about tubes got me curious. I had seen an article many eons ago about nano tubes, vacuum tubes on at the computer chip scale.

The voltages for the subminiature tubes seems to be significantly less than of the 12A-7 variety. There appears to be a raft of pedals using these tiny tubes.

 

[caeman]

 

[bigbottomend]

Not sure what these are like but they look good

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Biffbox | Facebook

 

[father of fires]

Not sure what these are like but they look good

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Biffbox | Facebook

LOL. They said its high voltage then say it runs at 24 volts. I guess its high compared to a stock valvecaster.

 

[caeman]

Maybe it is 24 input volts, but multiplied internally.

 

[Hobobob]

Maybe it is 24 input volts, but multiplied internally.

'The 12v power is increased to 24 volts for the valve anodes or 'plates' which means the 12AX7 valve will work properly and not in the 'starved plate' mode.'

From the linked website.

 

[father of fires]

'The 12v power is increased to 24 volts for the valve anodes or 'plates' which means the 12AX7 valve will work properly and not in the 'starved plate' mode.'

From the linked website.

There is so much wrong with that statement. They could have a great product but being flat out misleading like that loses major points in my book. Full disclosure: I love starved plate topologies.

 

[JimmyM]

Well, after careful consideration, I think I'm going to stick with the VTD. The main reason is the 4.5k rolloff. None of my current dirt pedals sound good without it and their own treble controls cut the useful treble along with the useless. I guess I could add an outboard EQ, but that's getting silly.

Thank you all for the suggestions.