Ok don’t laugh. I had a darkglass alpha omega 900 and a DG 212 a few months ago. I play at random get togethers, family reunions, and church. When we were all practicing, I was told I was way too loud. I was told the same thing at church that night. I turned myself down so low I could barely here myself. I know you guys will say 900 watts was way overkill for church use. I get it. I have used a fender rumble 800 head and the rumble 410 with compliments. I have used a fender bassman 500 with the 410 with the overdrive channel on and the guitarist told me it sounded awesome. I have played through an ampeg SVT vr and SVT HLF 410 cab and he really loved that. I actually traded in the darkglass head and cab for the SVT vr, and that’s my best sounding rig in my opinion. So what gives with the darkglass amp? You would think the guitarist would have criticized that as well. I have a stingray and a bongo, and he favored the stingray. He even said the bongo sounded better through the SVT than the stingray did. And still admitted the stingray sounded good through it. To me it’s all like a journey to get to where your going and get the gear your happy with. I’ll admit I’m now satisfied. I’m just a little confused about the reaction of the guitarist to the darkglass stuff. I had my SVT at a reasonable level and he wanted me to turn it up louder, yet the darkglass was too loud
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Disappointed in darkglass
- Thread starter Cory rich40
- Start date
Sometimes peoples perception of an excess volume problem is actually an EQ problem.
Why be disappointed in the Darkglass? It sounds like the amp is fine for you but may not be offering the right tone for this context just yet.
You could ask your fellow musicians to articulate more clearly what they are hearing different between the two rigs.
You could ask your fellow musicians to articulate more clearly what they are hearing different between the two rigs.
DG sounds very different from an SVT. I suspect your guitarist just prefers the tone and EQ of the SVT (as do I) rather than the DG.
The "standard" DG tone is very cutting and tight sounding. A typical SVT tone has much more low end and a greater low mid hump.
Just curious, why do you care what this guitarist thinks? Do you like the sound and does it work in the mix?
The "standard" DG tone is very cutting and tight sounding. A typical SVT tone has much more low end and a greater low mid hump.
Just curious, why do you care what this guitarist thinks? Do you like the sound and does it work in the mix?
Other band members. They said I was way too loud. So loud they couldn’t hear the vocalist. And that was at practice. During the performance I had to turn down so low my tone suffered. They didn’t seem to have an issue with my ampeg stuff. No complaints about my 1000 watt ampeg head either. My opinion was maybe I sounded too good. The darkglass stuff pairs good with music man basses and that’s what I used with the darkglass head.
is it in a different location than other speakers were? Could be reflections in the room creating loud and soft spots. ? Can you stand where they were standing and see if it sounds different than where you were?
I've never, ever, ever been attracted to Darkglass stuff. Any of their products sound hypermodern, clean even when distorted, sort of very controlled and tight to the point of sterile. I can imagine it being "too loud" as in too up front in the higher mids (especially if the vocals suffered).
Classic Ampeg stuff tends to be (or rather, since it can be set very close to flat, it encourages you to produce a tone that is) strong in the bass and low mids and scooped in the "mid" mids (between 250Hz and 2kHz or so), with some flexibility in the high mids and treble. I don't like the Ampeg sound much either, it sounds a bit, erm, dull to me (for lack of a better word: it's very thick but a bit "hollow", so to speak), I like some more energy in the mids, but it does tend to sit nicely in the mix (except when it's overbearing due to the strong low mids). Of course it's also a classic tone, it can be round or it can growl, which is why it's been used by lots of different players across genres, and it makes life easier for guitarists and vocalists because it sort of focuses the bass where guitars and vocals don't need to be.
Ampeg cabinets vary a lot, the HLF stuff is (to me) overbearing in the bass, the more classic stuff has good high mid presence and rolled-off bass but, again, I prefer something in between. I must say that I've found my peace of mind with an GK 800RB (which sounds a bit more focused on the mids compared to the newer heads, for some reason) and a GK Neo212, the first series. If you found yourself attracted to Darkglass, you might want to try GK stuff, since it sits in between the two.
Classic Ampeg stuff tends to be (or rather, since it can be set very close to flat, it encourages you to produce a tone that is) strong in the bass and low mids and scooped in the "mid" mids (between 250Hz and 2kHz or so), with some flexibility in the high mids and treble. I don't like the Ampeg sound much either, it sounds a bit, erm, dull to me (for lack of a better word: it's very thick but a bit "hollow", so to speak), I like some more energy in the mids, but it does tend to sit nicely in the mix (except when it's overbearing due to the strong low mids). Of course it's also a classic tone, it can be round or it can growl, which is why it's been used by lots of different players across genres, and it makes life easier for guitarists and vocalists because it sort of focuses the bass where guitars and vocals don't need to be.
Ampeg cabinets vary a lot, the HLF stuff is (to me) overbearing in the bass, the more classic stuff has good high mid presence and rolled-off bass but, again, I prefer something in between. I must say that I've found my peace of mind with an GK 800RB (which sounds a bit more focused on the mids compared to the newer heads, for some reason) and a GK Neo212, the first series. If you found yourself attracted to Darkglass, you might want to try GK stuff, since it sits in between the two.
They were impressed with the fender and ampeg stuff. I am too. The cab was a heritage HLF cab. I had considered Mesa boogie subway stuff recently but now I’m happy with my sound. I’m just saying that I don’t think darkglass is the best choice for country influenced stuff and oldies and classic rock
I got you.
This is an axiom, None of the people you referred to in your OP know or care about your bass tone. None of the people in your sphere care the least little bit about your bass gear or tone. The compliments mean “your volume wasn’t cutting in on my volume”.
If you have a great rig and it sounds great to you (bass player) don’t move from that rig if a non-bassist tries to too-politely ask you to be quieter. Turn down to fit your environment but don’t sacrifice the tone that makes you happy because it sounds like “tone” means “I don’t want to hear bass guitar”.
This is an axiom, None of the people you referred to in your OP know or care about your bass tone. None of the people in your sphere care the least little bit about your bass gear or tone. The compliments mean “your volume wasn’t cutting in on my volume”.
If you have a great rig and it sounds great to you (bass player) don’t move from that rig if a non-bassist tries to too-politely ask you to be quieter. Turn down to fit your environment but don’t sacrifice the tone that makes you happy because it sounds like “tone” means “I don’t want to hear bass guitar”.
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They went a year without complaining about me being loud. Maybe the high mids on the darkglass stuff was a problem. I don’t know. I thought it sounded good. The guitarist used to complain when I used a peavey 115 combo and I would have to turn down and the drummer would tell me to turn up because he couldn’t hear me, so I don’t really know who is right and who is wrong
I remember playing a gig where the bassist from the opener had agreed to keep his cab up there for me to use and we would just swap heads, for simplicity of loadout.
I don't even know what the cab was but I was like "huh, that sounds pretty good"
My bandmates were like "really? I mean you sounded fine but I don't know"
I think they might have been hearing with their eyes, it was a beat up no name cab.
I don't even know what the cab was but I was like "huh, that sounds pretty good"
My bandmates were like "really? I mean you sounded fine but I don't know"
I think they might have been hearing with their eyes, it was a beat up no name cab.
But the guitarist is constantly getting on to the singer for not getting as close to the microphone as he should. The guitarist is the band leader as you can tell. The singer will get mad and do it by himself for a little while and then rejoin months later. Been going on for almost 20 years now. But back to the topic, and there were things I was doing that sounded harsh with the darkglass amp, but sounded better with the ampeg and fender amp. It’s just strange because I have been loud with those amps and it was never a problem. But my loudest amp was 450 watts wide open at 8 ohms with the one cab I was using. And I never had it turned up all the way, so I wasn’t using 450 watts. At 4 ohms it can do 800 watt’s. The darkglass is 900 watts at 4 ohms with a 4 ohm 1000 watt 212 cab, which is what generated the complaints from band members.
gregbackstrom
These aren't stock curves--things move around!
JeezyMcNuggles
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Different bro.
Plus, guitarists have no idea what good bass tone sounds like. They all love stingrays, saying that that's how a bass should sound, but they can't stand any mids on bass. Which is what a stingray sounds like. Clank and honk. Nothing much else. They want it deep, they want it clanky, but they don't like mud, and can't hear themselves over you.
drumvsbass
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I've noticed this too, many just like a really, really scooped sound....no nasty mids to get in their way.
When I suggested to a guitarist colleague (who also played ok bass, but with an insanely scooped sound), that the money was in the mids for bass, he looked at me like I was nuts. 6 months later he came up to me and said 'you know that thing you said about mids and bass sound...you were right'
Ok, sorry, but I did laugh. Taking all this Dark power to church is asking for trouble?
If it were me I would have been disappointed in my band members. But maybe just put a SansAmp BBDI in front of the Darkglass, see if the complaining persists?
Get or borrow a wireless and walk around during rehearsal. The room matters. Try to get the speaker as close to a wall/corner as possible and see if that helps.
can also trim highs In EQ.
you could also swap nameplates on the equipment and they might like it better ;-)
Many musicians (particularly vocalists who don’t play an instrument) don’t understand sound and mixing. Also generally they only want to hear their own sound and don’t listen to anything else. This leads to volume wars.
If you can walk out front with a wireless and check the mix maybe you will find where the frequencies overlap and modify the overall EQ plan.
when you have a group that really listens to each other and considers the overall sound its so much better, not to mention that the group as a whole is tighter etc. The more experienced people are and the better they know the material, the more they can pick up their heads and listen to each other.
can also trim highs In EQ.
you could also swap nameplates on the equipment and they might like it better ;-)
Many musicians (particularly vocalists who don’t play an instrument) don’t understand sound and mixing. Also generally they only want to hear their own sound and don’t listen to anything else. This leads to volume wars.
If you can walk out front with a wireless and check the mix maybe you will find where the frequencies overlap and modify the overall EQ plan.
when you have a group that really listens to each other and considers the overall sound its so much better, not to mention that the group as a whole is tighter etc. The more experienced people are and the better they know the material, the more they can pick up their heads and listen to each other.
