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Does it REALLY make a difference?

Aside from scale length and “tone woods”, we’ll just have to agree to disagree. My ear is trained enough now that I can definitely tell the difference between certain amp brands and especially drastically different strings – even at full rock-volume.

Now, if you have sound guys that are just giving you mush, or if you only play through cruddy FOH systems… than yeah, you’re going to sound like :poop: no matter what. These nuances are hardly only noticeable in the bedroom though.

Your preferences our your own preferences. You like what you like,I like what I like. and we'll lean toward whatever brand or attribute that offers that most. we can obsess & argue over what is best, But we'll both end up using what we "Feel" comes closest to our own expectations/preferences.
I'd like to add the saying " If it sounds good, It Is good." and "GOOD" is so subjective we may never agree!
1 mans Flats is another mans Rounds! and the nuances on how we get there are infinite, so how we get there probably doesn't make difference, but it does to the individual(we are human).
 
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"The audience doesn't care". How can anyone be so certain about what the audience doesn't notice or doesn't care about? Granted, I'm pretty sure most audience members' ears aren't that discerning where a lot of things are concerned but I prefer to not cater to the lowest common denominator, and I have a difficult time believing that no one notices details. I also have a feeling that just because an audience member can't articulate - or even identify - why they might like or dislike a performance, they will feel differently depending on the details of that performance (including some of the finer aspects of sound). I like to think of a band and its audience as an eco-system of sorts: all of the details add up to form the whole and you never know what changes in those smaller details might throw something else out of whack, thereby creating a domino effect. Regardless, one of my greatest joys when it comes to performing is producing a sound that is like candy for my ears. It doesn't always work out, but that is invariably one of my goals. I love loving the way my equipment sounds on a given gig, so the idea of just saying, "Whatever - it's all the same and it doesn't really matter" just doesn't compute for me.
 
Well it's heartening to see so many people who actually care about what they do, but disheartening to see so many people who still don't and who use their audiences as a barometer of how much they should care. Here's why that is, as Stuart Smalley says, stinkin' thinkin'...

(lecture mode ON)

1. True, the gear you use is irrelevant to the audience. Nobody ever walked out on my bands because I didn't have an SVT and 810. And as long as it works and is enough to satisfy the volume requirements of the band, it's usually fine. But if gear doesn't matter at all, why don't we all just play the cheapest basses we can possibly find with bad fretwork and super high action through $20 guitar amps? Because it's a distraction to the player. Nothing I hate worse than having to fight my gear to do my job. I want my gear to work with me, not against me, so that I can put 100% of my energy toward playing well and doing a good job and 0% of my energy trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

2. Audiences are a lot more sophisticated than you think they are. Lots of musicians love to think of the audience as drunken idiots and they're the big smart superstar musicians landing from heaven to enlighten the rubes with their superior intellect, but the truth is you're not. In any given audience, there will be drunken idiots, sure, but there will also be people who have experience with playing and singing music, and some might even actually play bass better than you. And just because they don't fawn over you and your gear and ask you questions about it doesn't mean they're know-nothings. But what it does mean is that your superiority complex is deeply rooted in feelings of insecurity, so you take it out on your audiences to feel better about yourselves, especially if you're not going over.

3. Audience members aren't the ones signing your paycheck or calling you to offer you a gig. Other musicians are. Agents are. In passing out business cards to non-connected audience members who say they have gigs to offer, maybe one in 50 will actually call you and ask about booking your band. Then maybe one in 10 won't balk at your price and try to lowball you so badly you blow them off completely. So if you're using drunken audience members as your barometer, just remember that they're not usually going to be the ones who will hire you...but that one pro guitarist or singer or agent in the crowd who you don't notice might. Do you want to make a good impression from the getgo or do you want to spend the next 5 years convincing them that they caught you on a "bad night" when in truth you just didn't care enough to put forth a real effort for the drunken idiots because you're so superior in every way?

4. This is Talkbass. We come here in part to nitpick about gear and why our gear isn't doing what we want and look for solutions. Nothing I love better than turning 90% there into 100% there. 90% there isn't good enough for me. Even 99% there isn't good enough. And I may not always use the most expensive gear in the world but I want it to be 100%. All of it, even the cheapest of the cheap. I've helped people do it on here and they've helped me. And still, at least once a week, someone makes a snide comment like, "While you're all on here talking bass, I'm in the real world PLAYING bass." Well Mr. Smart Guy, I'm out there playing bass, too, and so are a hell of a lot of people who are on here, and you're on here, too, so shut up. The hunt for 100% is a very noble pursuit because when you're 100% there, you can go to your gig and not think about anything but playing well and putting on a good show. And there is nothing in the world wrong with that.

(lecture mode OFF)
 
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Well it's heartening to see so many people who actually care about what they do, but disheartening to see so many people who still don't and who use their audiences as a barometer of how much they should care. Here's why that is, as Stuart Smalley says, stinkin' thinkin'...

(lecture mode ON)

1. True, the gear you use is irrelevant to the audience. Nobody ever walked out on my bands because I didn't have an SVT and 810. And as long as it works and is enough to satisfy the volume requirements of the band, it's usually fine. But if gear doesn't matter at all, why don't we all just play the cheapest basses we can possibly find with bad fretwork and super high action through $20 guitar amps? Because it's a distraction to the player. Nothing I hate worse than having to fight my gear to do my job. I want my gear to work with me, not against me, so that I can put 100% of my energy toward playing well and doing a good job and 0% of my energy trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

2. Audiences are a lot more sophisticated than you think they are. Lots of musicians love to think of the audience as drunken idiots and they're the big smart superstar musicians landing from heaven to enlighten the rubes with their superior intellect, but the truth is you're not. In any given audience, there will be drunken idiots, sure, but there will also be people who have experience with playing and singing music, and some might even actually play bass better than you. And just because they don't fawn over you and your gear and ask you questions about it doesn't mean they're know-nothings. But what it does mean is that your superiority complex is deeply rooted in feelings of insecurity, so you take it out on your audiences to feel better about yourselves, especially if you're not going over.

3. Audience members aren't the ones signing your paycheck or calling you to offer you a gig. Other musicians are. Agents are. In passing out business cards to non-connected audience members who say they have gigs to offer, maybe one in 50 will actually call you and ask about booking your band. Then maybe one in 10 won't balk at your price and try to lowball you so badly you blow them off completely. So if you're using drunken audience members as your barometer, just remember that they're not usually going to be the ones who will hire you...but that one pro guitarist or singer or agent in the crowd who you don't notice might. Do you want to make a good impression from the getgo or do you want to spend the next 5 years convincing them that they caught you on a "bad night" when in truth you just didn't care enough to put forth a real effort for the drunken idiots because you're so superior in every way?

4. This is Talkbass. We come here in part to nitpick about gear and why our gear isn't doing what we want and look for solutions. Nothing I love better than turning 90% there into 100% there. 90% there isn't good enough for me. Even 99% there isn't good enough. And I may not always use the most expensive gear in the world but I want it to be 100%. All of it, even the cheapest of the cheap. I've helped people do it on here and they've helped me. And still, at least once a week, someone makes a snide comment like, "While you're all on here talking bass, I'm in the real world PLAYING bass." Well Mr. Smart Guy, I'm out there playing bass, too, and so are a hell of a lot of people who are on here, so shut up. The hunt for 100% is a very noble pursuit because when you're 100% there, you can go to your gig and not think about anything but playing well and putting on a good show. And there is nothing in the world wrong with that.

(lecture mode OFF)
One of my mantras is that we as musicians need to give people as many reasons as we can to want to go out and see/hear a live band. Competition against other forms of entertainment is stiff these days and musicians who don't care about "the details" are not helping the situation any.
 
One of my mantras is that we as musicians need to give people as many reasons as we can to want to go out and see/hear a live band. Competition against other forms of entertainment is stiff these days and musicians who don't care about "the details" are not helping the situation any.

‘Not caring’ does not mean for a moment that I ever trot out a bass and rig I don’t like. It should go without saying that my stuff sounds good. That having been said, let me reiterate that I focus on the music. If I like the bass or amp, it doesn’t matter what it’s made of—the same as if I don’t like the bass or amp. My days of chasing after angels on the heads of pins are largely over. There’s no grail for me besides playing good shows. That doesn’t take a particular bass or amp to do.
 
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‘Not caring’ does not mean for a moment that I ever trot out a bass and rig I don’t like. It should go without saying that my stuff sounds good. That having been said, let me reiterate that I focus on the music. If I like the bass or amp, it doesn’t matter what it’s made of—the same as if I don’t like the bass or amp. My days of chasing after angels on the heads of pins are largely over. There’s no grail for me besides playing good shows. That doesn’t take a particular bass or amp to do.
You aren't the problem, Edward. The problem is the people who see the audience as a bunch of ill-informed idiots who don't have a clue what we do and bring an attitude to match on gigs.
 
I didn’t say the audiences were uncaring. They certainly care about having fun, enjoying the music and being entertained, but I’ve never had anyone ask about palm muting, pickup selection etc. as you have. Like I said, that’s nice.

I didn't say you did. Did you notice anyone else in this thread saying that? I did... and that's what I was referring to.
 
Maybe. I saw a band this weekend at a local beach bar playing popular covers and they were TERRIBLE! The bass players tone was really harsh, and he didn't even bother to learn the bass lines on a lot of the songs. In this case it wasn't a matter of equipment. His gear was top of the line. But the point is that the audience didn't care. They were singing and dancing and having a great time because they knew the songs. As long as the band and the singer were in tune, it almost didn't matter...except to the one bass player in the crowd, me, who couldn't believe they were getting away with it.

I know what you mean, but I think there are also varying types of audiences. The audience at a bar listening to a cover band isn't going to care as much about the sound of individual instruments compared to an audience that is paying a ticket to see a band playing original music. You could probably then also look at specific genres and probably find that there are varying levels of how knowledgeable the audience is in regards to the sound of the live mix. For instance, I would guess that fans of prog rock are more likely to appreciate a good mix compared to the audience at a doom metal concert.
 
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One conclusion I've come to about this thread is that the folks implying that they can't really hear a difference and/or it doesn't really matter, sho' ain't the same folks selling stuff in the TB classifieds, cause there's a bunch of serious azz expensive gear for sale here at all times. So, somebody cares cause that stuff sells well here.

(Guess those players do their talkin' on stage. With their fingers.)
 
One rehearsal the multibox was missing so I just used my amp. Sounded fine to me, nobody commented., almost most made me question my preamp chain. Next week I brought my own multi box and faith in gear was fully restored when drummer did a head spin at the P bass with a bit of extra distortion in place of the EUB.
 
Of course I can tell the different in tone ... even live ... but part of me think that you won't break a performance or a mix just because you played a jazz bass instead of a P bass with flat this time ... as long as you groove and provide the bass.

I play Warwick basses and I can alter the tone of it, but it will always sounds like a Warwick and will it break a performance or a mix or whatever in a cover band ? No I don't think so. Will the people in the audiance be like hum something is not right ... again I don't think a P bass with flats into a SVT would be that much better sound wise.

especially since live sound will never be like a CD ... no band sounds like they do on album because of plenty of reason like EQ, compression the room they are in, the humidity, number of people there ... the sound guy, the PA system etc ...

So I just find a sound that work in my opinion this night and go with it.
 
I know what you mean, but I think there are also varying types of audiences. The audience at a bar listening to a cover band isn't going to care as much about the sound of individual instruments compared to an audience that is paying a ticket to see a band playing original music. You could probably then also look at specific genres and probably find that there are varying levels of how knowledgeable the audience is in regards to the sound of the live mix. For instance, I would guess that fans of prog rock are more likely to appreciate a good mix compared to the audience at a doom metal concert.

No doubt. I'm specifically talking about working cover bands playing at bars that cater to that kind of audience. I would add that the place where this band was playing was packed to the point that you couldn't get to the bar or the bathroom without having to wade through a sea of humanity. And this band was getting paid good money. Not only that, but this band plays to crowds like this every weekend, especially during the summer. I would LOVE to have another gig like this. You know, sometimes people tell me that I don't respect my audience because I don't think their music appreciation is sophisticated enough to notice some of the things we've been talking about in this thread. It isn't a matter of respect as much as it is one of observation and years and years of experience. I respect my audience for showing up, enjoying themselves and appreciating the music that has been selected for them, not to mention helping out my wallet at the end the night. But the fact is the vast majority of them don't notice things that we as musicians care about. They don't care about the subtle difference in our pickup choices, or the exotic woods our basses are handcrafted from, or how often we change strings. They care about dancing, having a few drinks and listening to music they're familiar with. That's it. If a band can get those three things happening, little else matters.
 
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No doubt. I'm specifically talking about working cover bands playing at bars that cater to that kind of audience. I would add that the place where this band was playing was packed to the point that you couldn't get to the bar or the bathroom without having to wade through a sea of humanity. And this band was getting paid good money. Not only that, but this band plays to crowds like this every weekend, especially during the summer. I would LOVE to have another gig like this. You know, sometimes people tell me that I don't respect my audience because I don't think their music appreciation is sophisticated enough to notice some of the things we've been talking about in this thread. It isn't a matter of respect as much as it is one of observation and years and years of experience. I respect my audience for showing up, enjoying themselves and appreciating the music that has been selected for them, not to mention helping out my wallet at the end the night. But the fact is the vast majority of them don't notice things that we as musicians care about. They don't care about the subtle difference in our pickup choices, or the exotic woods our basses are handcrafted from, or how often we change strings. They care about dancing, having a few drinks and listening to music they're familiar with. That's it. If a band can get those three things happening, little else matters.
Nor should they care about anything else. But your bandmates certainly would, and so would people in the audience that might potentially want to work with you.