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"Don't ever let that guy sing ever again!!!"

smgleitch

smgleitch

May 19, 2009
422
7
Nashville, TN
#1
So this is what I am hearing after our first show, and it is across the board from everyone myself and our lead singer talked to. We have a lead guitar player who sings some songs and our drummer sang one. Everyone says we should pull the mics from them and never give them back, but really how do you take the mic away from a band member and not offend them.

I am thinking of telling them we need to get our lead singer more involved and have her sing all the songs. Not sure how transparent that is, but just cant imagine telling them that they suck. Good guitar player and drummer just not talented vocalist.

Ever had to take a mic away? How did it work out?
 
#2
Record your next rehearsal then play it back with everyone listening.
After listening to it, say that the lead singer should handle all of the vocals because she's clearly the strongest singer in the band. They may see the light and agree. If not, tell them politely that their singing isn't very good, certainly not up to the standard of their playing.

Tough situation, but as long as you're polite and professional you're not responsible for their reactions.
 
#3
Record your next performance or rehearsal (preferably a gig). Play the recording at the next rehearsal, after enough time has passed that everyone can objectively listen to the recording rather than hear what they remember. Then ask the question for each song you play back - do we keep this one or do we take it off the set list for next time? Don't single out the weaker singers, do this for all the songs you record.

The waiting time is important. I generally remember things sounding worse, even much worse, than they actually did. Some people remember things sounding much better than they actually did. It a glass half full/half empty kind of thing. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised by things being better than I recall, plus I'm a little too critical in the moment.

I'm in a band where one member does not sing so good, but he does a very emotional performance on one song which is pretty decent, and he does some backing on a couple of others that is OK. I was the guy recording gigs and handing out CD's. He made some very dedicated efforts to improve after hearing his performances.

Now the reality check - We as musicians tend to be over-critical of our playing and singing. If the band is together and having a great time performing, then the crowd is going to respond to the energy level and have a great time too. That translates into people staying longer, spending more money, making a happy bar owner, and you getting more gigs.

That said, I'd put the "developing" vocals someplace past the half way point in the evening. By then the crowd has seen what you are all about and one song is not going to send them toward the doors in droves.

Good luck from an admittedly weaker vocal talent,

- Paul
 
#4
Very good advice. I was told the show was to be recorded so I will have to see if we did get it recorded and if not will have to make a recording of one of the next practices. Sounds like a good way to handle it and it is something we should be doing anyways. Thanks
 
#5
In addition to what pbagly said, it’s also nice to have different singers. Personally, no matter how good the lead singer is, I get tired of hearing the same person sing all night.


If the song is one that you can incorporate a lot of back up vocals/harmonies, that makes singers sound a lot better.
 
#6
I've never known anybody to become a better singer by not singing. So, if the 2 "lesser" singers are ever going to get better, they'll have to keep after it. A couple of questions you should all ask yourselves:

1. Do you (all) want the other guys to sing?
2. If "Yes" to #1, how far are you willing to go to improve their singing?

I hope they're singing backup. If nothing else, it's just that much more practice. The songs that they sing might just have to go no farther than rehearsals until they're up to snuff. Rehearse the heck out of them, even if they don't make it into the set. At some point, you'll have to decide whether or not to keep the songs/singers. I think it's usually best to put some time limit on it. In other words, all agree to give it some amount of time & see if there's at least some improvement. If it's not getting better in a few weeks, it probably never will. If it's improving, but not quite ready for prime time, decide whether it's worth giving it some more time.
 
#7
smgleitch said:
I am thinking of telling them we need to get our lead singer more involved and have her sing all the songs. Not sure how transparent that is, but just cant imagine telling them that they suck. Good guitar player and drummer just not talented vocalist.
Click to expand...

A professional is someone who is capable of putting his/her personal feelings aside in the service of the greater good - and/or for the sake of a client, customer or colleague - in this case his fellow band members.

Can you see that professionalism, as defined this way, is absolutely essential to the peak performance of any musical ensemble? If the pursuit of excellence gets routinely bogged down in ego, insecurity - or a hundred and one other types of personal baggage - it's all but doomed before it ever gets started.

If these guys have a professional mindset and have made a firm commitment to excellence of musicianship, then it really shouldn't be necessary for you or anyone else to tiptoe on eggshells around them. In fact, they should welcome the constructive feedback - in which case you should take JohnMCA72's advice, and persuade them to do some serious vocal remedial work.

But if they haven't, then that opens up a whole other set of interpersonal issues that has little, if anything, to do with actual music... :hmm:

MM
 
#8
Like anything, vocals take some work to master. The thing is that everyone can sing, but not everyone can sing well. Sort of like how anyone can play the guitar, but only people who have learned something can make music with it. Like any instrument, it takes practice.

If you're committed to having mulitple vocalists, then let them work on their vocals. Start with easy pieces that fit their range, and limit them to one song per night until they get better. Endurance is a part of singing that people forget about. Singers, especially beginning singers, have a harder time keeping pitch and timbre as the night goes on.

I would recommend them doing different songs. You can tell them in an honest way that the songs don't work for their vocal style and range, and suggest ones that may work. That way you can tell them where they fall short, without destroying all hope that they can sing. And if they insist on that song, you can tell them where it's not working so they can work on it on their own.

Even though you can learn the lyrics quickly as a non-singer, it takes a little more practice to hit the notes. The harder thing with musicians, especially good ones, is that they perceive the song as easy because they can pick it up on the instrument in a few plays. But that's usually because they are good at their instrument. Unfortunately, lots of them translate their proficiency with their instrument with proficiency in vocals. But the reality is, no matter how strong they are at their instrument, if they are weak on vocals it will take more time and effort for them to master. I can learn most pop tunes in a short time, and sometimes on the fly. However with vocals, if I want to hit the right notes, I need much more practice time. And sometimes in the end, I conclude that the song doesn't fit my style and range, and have to can it.
 
#9
smgleitch said:
Everyone says we should pull the mics from them and never give them back, but really how do you take the mic away from a band member and not offend them.
Click to expand...

There were times I was very glad that I did not have to sing. Are you certain these guys really want to sing or think that their vocals are good?

It is one thing to chime in during the chorus with a few words or phrases. It is another to carry an entire tune.

On the other hand, your lead singer could offer to be a vocal coach for the rest of the group or you might find a vocal teacher who would give you a group discount. Your cover story could be that based on feedback the rest of us need to improve our vocals closer the lead singer's level.
 
#10
Well it's happened to me, I can sing and play anything - but not bass. I always sang in bands, leads and backgrounds, was even a front man for a while. When I switched to bass, my singing days were over no matter how hard i work it just does not happen. One band i was in I sang all the time but my mic was muted for most of the time. As punishment the sound guy would feed my mic into folks monitor mixes, he always got fast and ardent apologies.
 
#11
Defintely record a show or rehersal and listen back and critique.
Have a little meeting on the importance of the focus of vocals and the response the band is receiving from shows. Suggest lessons may be in order.
The best thing me and my singer ever did was go get singing lessons. Lessons pointed out what I was doing wrong.

Another thing to try, maybe hire an outside local producer or instructor to come listen to a rehersal or maybe even a show (we like doing that before we do any recording work).
Our result was a guitar sound that didn't work for what we were doing and got us to focus and change what was needed.
 
#12
Its a tough call. They can't get better if they don't sing. If you go by "the lead singer can sing it better, they should do it" the lead singer will sing all the songs, and they'll never get better cause they'll never sing any songs.

Got to bite the bullet and throw them a bone or two. Unless they absolutely suck and are hopeless.

Randy
 
#13
Well we had a meeting on Thursday. Decided to record a practice and limited the songs they were singing lead on. It is a start and I thing that the folks in our band are mature enough to see that the big picture of being stressful is more important than their personal egos. We will see. Thanks for the advice, I am hoping that the recorder rehearsal will do us a lot of good.
 
#14
I'm the 1st to admit I can't sing very well. In some of the earlier bands I was in the main vocalist would need break from singing (he also played guitar) so everyone in the 4 piece band would sing a couple songs a night. I usually sang one or two a night during the last set when the crowd was blasted and thinking more about booty. As long as the music is strong & loud and the vocals were somewhat in your range it would go over great. I was given songs like Dire Straits, George Thurogood, Talking Heads, ZZ Top, you know, real vocal legends. I did work hard and did improve over time but still always sang last set. Can't say I blame the band for that. So maybe try that method with your bands weaker vocalist.
 

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