Double Bass to Bass guitar?

[Steelerfan345]

New to Talk Bass and to the Bass Guitar. I've been playing Orchestral style Double bass for about eight and a half years, so I'm very familiar with music and the Bass player mind set, however I'm having significant trouble adjusting to bass guitar. The frets seem to get in the way, I can't find a comfortable way to allocate fingers to notes (On DB 4 fingers would be 3 notes, but on a bass guitar?), and the adjustment in technique has reduced my dexterity in both hands greatly. Even the way people seem to think about these instruments is different.

What I'm wondering is has anyone else made this transition? What did you struggle with, what did you find was easier on bass guitar, and what did you do to adjust?

Thanks

 

[DirkP]

New to Talk Bass and to the Bass Guitar. I've been playing Orchestral style Double bass for about eight and a half years, so I'm very familiar with music and the Bass player mind set, however I'm having significant trouble adjusting to bass guitar. The frets seem to get in the way, I can't find a comfortable way to allocate fingers to notes (On DB 4 fingers would be 3 notes, but on a bass guitar?), and the adjustment in technique has reduced my dexterity in both hands greatly. Even the way people seem to think about these instruments is different.

What I'm wondering is has anyone else made this transition? What did you struggle with, what did you find was easier on bass guitar, and what did you do to adjust?

Thanks

I wish I could play Double Bass. Just tried it once in a shop and felt a bit lost although after about 5 minutes I started to play simple lines. I play bass guitar since about 3 decades.
There are no strict rules, but on bass-guitar, most but not all technical advanced players follow the rule one finger one fret. Doing this, you can play any major or minor scale without changing your fret-hand position.
But I've seen a lot of players just doing what you do: 4 fingers - 3 notes. Never forget: our most stupid talentless finger is the ring-finger. The ringfinger and the little finger are not independant from one another. Just do stretches with every single of your fingers and observe the other fingers...
When our hands and fingers were created, bass and guitar playing wasn't the main focus of evolution.

Today I have watched the Marvin Gaye video on Youtube again, where he plays What's Going On and for a few seconds you see James Jamerson paying bass. He came from the Double Bass and his technique is different from everything bass-guitarists are taught. He just uses his index-finger on the right hand for example. But he still is maybe the greatest and most creative bass-guitar player ever. And many bass-guitarists can't do with two fingers what he did with one...

 

[MalcolmAmos]

Ditto above post - tried to move from 4 string electric to double bass and yes the difference is the fingerboard compared to the fretboard.

First it's up-right and things look different.
Second the double bass is so large it takes some getting used to.

How the notes are played is the main difference. I did purchase a no line fretless electric just to see if I would like the fingerboard. Not enough to change. We electric players normally use a generic pattern and take that pattern up the neck to what ever key we need, i.e. F @ the 4th string 1st fret, E @ the 4th string 12th fret. With G @ the 3rd, A @ the 5th, etc.

I did not have the money to invest in a double bass so thanked my friend for letting me see what it was like -- and I went back to my electric bass. I decided for what I do the electric bass gets me there.

I think most of us have dreamed about playing the double bass. I've given up that dream.

 

[RustyAxe]

New to Talk Bass and to the Bass Guitar. I've been playing Orchestral style Double bass for about eight and a half years, so I'm very familiar with music and the Bass player mind set, however I'm having significant trouble adjusting to bass guitar. The frets seem to get in the way, I can't find a comfortable way to allocate fingers to notes (On DB 4 fingers would be 3 notes, but on a bass guitar?), and the adjustment in technique has reduced my dexterity in both hands greatly. Even the way people seem to think about these instruments is different.

What I'm wondering is has anyone else made this transition? What did you struggle with, what did you find was easier on bass guitar, and what did you do to adjust?

Thanks

Why not take a few lessons and have a bass guitar teacher show you a few things. As a bass guitar player for 40+ years (at that time) I transitioned to upright bass. I took a few lessons so I'd learn things like proper posture, hand position, and such. Was worth the little money I spent.

 

[FretlessMainly]

Hey @Steelerfan345: As a Patriots fan, I offer this advice with the best of intentions. I started on guitar in 1977, moved to fretted electric bass in 1980, transitioned to double bass in 1992 (playing jazz gigs and also four years in a local symphony orchestra), took on fretless electric in 1999, and re-added fretted electric bass in 2003. So I've done these sorts of transitions. In theory, fretted electric should be much easier than double bass, but it's a different animal, so you need to adapt; it's just different, that's all. My first bit of advice would be to buy an unlined fretless electric with side dots where the 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, 12th, 15th...frets would be. This is a fairly standard setup, but not all fretlesses are built this way, so beware of that.

You're almost certainly accustomed to fingering with your index, middle and pinky and using position shifts to move around the fingerboard. There's no reason why you can't use this technique on electric bass, but the position shifts do make the frets somewhat annoying. I stuck with fretless electric for several years not so much because I wanted the fretless sound, but because the frets were a pain in the neck after playing double bass exclusively for so long. I was playing on top of the frets instead of just behind them, which is where you need to be. Also, the most common fingering on electric bass is the "one finger per fret" method. In general, if you are playing a Major pattern, lead with your middle finger on the root and play the Major third with your index finger on the next highest string, the fifth with your pinky, etc. Over a minor pattern, use your pinky or ring finger for the root and your index finger for the minor third on the next highest string. It will feel odd using your ring finger in lower positions, but it can indeed be done.

Message me if you want to discuss more...and best of luck. It's the same instrument, just a different construct.

 

[lz4005]

I'm very familiar with...the Bass player mind set,.....Even the way people seem to think about these instruments is different.

Orchestral double bass and electric bass guitar are almost as different as bass and tuba. They share the same range, but are completely separate instruments.

Four fingers for three notes works perfectly well near the nut on electric bass. Then you transition to one note per finger higher on the neck, wherever it becomes comfortable for you.

The attack envelope and timing are the major differences with your right hand (assuming right handed). Electric bass attack is much faster than pizz on double bass. And you're expected to lock with the drums, rather than follow the conductor. Hugely different mindsets that you just have to get eventually. The timing issue is really what separates good from bad doublers.

 

[Steelerfan345]

Appreciate all the responses. There's some good stuff in here that I'll definitely keep in mind going forward. I've been playing more consistently and the problems I'm having are either starting to disappear or I'm learning how to compensate for them.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Orchestral double bass and electric bass guitar are almost as different as bass and tuba.

On the bass I can pick with 5 fingers- try it on tuba!

 

[Michael Case]

So I started out on bass guitar and moved to double bass and I felt like you do. I'll tell you what my first double bass teacher told me "forget everything you know about the (in your case) double bass and look at the bass guitar as different instrument." You cloud use Simandl 1,2,4 fingering, mostly in the lower region of the neck. Also, many electric bassists (myself included) use a "one finger per fret" fingering which is exactly as it sounds. On the double bass side of this forum, if a double bass newbie were to ask a question similar to yours the answer would be "get a teacher" I will say that to you for this situation. At least for a few lessons to grasp the technique. They are two different instruments and should be approached as such.

 

[Oscar Stern]

The Bass Guitar was historically made as a portable alternative to Double Bass that could play louder due to the fact that the Double Bass's resonance chamber is shrunk down from its ideal size to make it playable.

 

[pklima]

Last year I started playing more BG after kinda owning one but really only playing it live every few years for a couple of decades. I started out on BG, so it wasn't too hard to deal with frets, but I can say a few things... I can confirm what Michael Case said: Simandl fingerings work fine, especially on the lower frets, even if they feel like you could reach more - it's fine to stick with what's familiar. Though one thing that "electric style" involves is, in spite of all the "there's no money above the 5th fret" jokes, playing higher up the neck on the lower strings more often, and you'll probably naturally find yourself switching to one finger per fret (or at least not using the pinky) above the 7th or so, or it just gets cramped to try to stick the pinky and ring fingers on the same fret. And if you're going back and forth between a low F and the Ab above it, of course it makes sense to use your pinky instead of shifting every note. But basically sticking to Simandl for the most part is fine.

The other difference, especially in rock styles, is that you'll spend more time in the bottom octave. So, more of your notes will be on the E and A strings (assuming 4-string in standard tuning) with the higher strings used to add octaves, rock "box patterns" etc. to a root note you're playing on a lower string. Depending on what style(s) you need to play, there might be stock patterns or typical grooves that are worth internalizing.

There are fretless basses, wider-necked basses etc. that might be more comfortable for you. getting used to frets is probably worthwhile. I find fat necks and wide string spacing at the bridge comfier, but if I like how a bass looks, can deal with a Jazz neck or bridge spacing that's narrower than the Fender 19 mm standard.

 

[turf3]

The Bass Guitar was historically made as a portable alternative to Double Bass that could play louder due to the fact that the Double Bass's resonance chamber is shrunk down from its ideal size to make it playable.

Yes, we all know this, but it's not germane to the premise of this thread, which is "how shall a DB player learn to play BG?"

The answer to which seems to range from "play it like a DB, three finger technique, accepting the limitations on technique" through " go three fingers low on the neck, and transition to four higher up", to "fugeddaboutit, it's a whole different instrument, your best policy is to start from scratch and learn how to play the thing properly."

Which of these approaches the DB player seeking to play BG will adopt will probably depend on the potential applications for bass guitar in his life. In my case, for example, I am not going to become a rock and roll bass player. The only times I play electric bass guitar are when the load-in, or transportation, is too ridiculous for the big fiddle. So I don't need full-capability electric bass technique; and being essentially bone-idle, I'm not prepared to take on the task of learning electric bass properly. FOR ME it's satisfactory to remain an upright player dabbling now and then in electric bass by applying upright bass technique. If someone were to call me for a technically demanding electric bass gig (and I have no idea why anyone would), I'd decline.

 

[Oscar Stern]

Yes, we all know this, but it's not germane to the premise of this thread, which is "how shall a DB player learn to play BG?"

The answer to which seems to range from "play it like a DB, three finger technique, accepting the limitations on technique" through " go three fingers low on the neck, and transition to four higher up", to "fugeddaboutit, it's a whole different instrument, your best policy is to start from scratch and learn how to play the thing properly."

Which of these approaches the DB player seeking to play BG will adopt will probably depend on the potential applications for bass guitar in his life. In my case, for example, I am not going to become a rock and roll bass player. The only times I play electric bass guitar are when the load-in, or transportation, is too ridiculous for the big fiddle. So I don't need full-capability electric bass technique; and being essentially bone-idle, I'm not prepared to take on the task of learning electric bass properly. FOR ME it's satisfactory to remain an upright player dabbling now and then in electric bass by applying upright bass technique. If someone were to call me for a technically demanding electric bass gig (and I have no idea why anyone would), I'd decline.

The Electric Bass is something that DB players can double on as it's the same tuning so you have to use a similar technique.

 

[Oscar Stern]

It would be nice if they made a method book on how to play Bass Guitar for Double Bass players.

 

[Oscar Stern]

How would you agree with a method book on how to transition from Double Bass to Bass Guitar?

 

[fdeck]

As mentioned, there are lots of ways to skin this cat. Here's my experience and advice.

I started on cello, and was eventually asked to play the bass in the middle school jazz band. All of the school's upright basses were beyond repair, so I bought myself a used Fender Mustang Bass and taught myself to play it during the summer.

I simply started from the beginning of my cello etude books, and worked my way through them, as best as I could. By the end of the summer, I was able to handle the bass parts in the school band.

You've already got most of the pieces of the puzzle: You know how to listen for good tone, how to read, practice, play by ear, etc. There are lots of online tutorials that will show good hand position, but it's not radically different than what you already know. At first, don't worry if it sounds like you're playing with "legit" tone and style. That will quickly correct itself when you start playing with others and listening to the genres that you're interested in.

I started with 4-finger technique like on the cello. Later when I actually took bass lessons, my teacher insisted that I switch to 3-finger technique. For one thing he knew that I was in the process of restoring an upright, and he wanted to prepare me for that. Today, I play electric with mostly 3-finger technique in the lower registers, and "whatever" in the upper.

I also gave up on frets too quickly, and my advice is to give yourself a fair chance to learn the fretted electric bass if possible. It will make you more versatile.

 

[Oscar Stern]

As mentioned, there are lots of ways to skin this cat. Here's my experience and advice.

I started on cello, and was eventually asked to play the bass in the middle school jazz band. All of the school's upright basses were beyond repair, so I bought myself a used Fender Mustang Bass and taught myself to play it during the summer.

I simply started from the beginning of my cello etude books, and worked my way through them, as best as I could. By the end of the summer, I was able to handle the bass parts in the school band.

You've already got most of the pieces of the puzzle: You know how to listen for good tone, how to read, practice, play by ear, etc. There are lots of online tutorials that will show good hand position, but it's not radically different than what you already know. At first, don't worry if it sounds like you're playing with "legit" tone and style. That will quickly correct itself when you start playing with others and listening to the genres that you're interested in.

I started with 4-finger technique like on the cello. Later when I actually took bass lessons, my teacher insisted that I switch to 3-finger technique. For one thing he knew that I was in the process of restoring an upright, and he wanted to prepare me for that. Today, I play electric with mostly 3-finger technique in the lower registers, and "whatever" in the upper.

I also gave up on frets too quickly, and my advice is to give yourself a fair chance to learn the fretted electric bass if possible. It will make you more versatile.

Interesting you got yourself a Bass Guitar as all the School's Upright Basses were beyond repair.