• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Drummer not playing a rock shuffle to La Grange

lat

lat

Dec 30, 2014
1,071
1,713
Lower Basstonia
#1
OK, my drummer is not playing a shuffle beat to La Grange. I mentioned to him a couple of times that the song is a shuffle, but he's still not doing that. I have ended up compensating by playing the bassline with a shuffle rhythm for the first 2/3 of the song, but it just isn't the same. And, after the second stop, the song kind of calls for the bass line to go to a regular 4/4 alternating between A and C and then up to D, so at that point the lack of a shuffle beat is really apparent. I'm sorely tempted to send him a link to this video that shows how to play the song, but I don't want to offend him, especially since we have a gig coming up this Saturday.


Has anyone else had issues with drummers not being able / willing to play a shuffle, when the song demands it? Seems like drummer 101, but I may be missing something...

And no, fire the drummer is not an option... lol
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: TinIndian, mikewalker, Big Shrek and 6 others
#2
This is not the answer you want to hear but, here's what my experience tells me:
Give up trying to get him to get it. Do the best to cover it yourself.

I can't tell you how many players I have dealt with over the years, with good other skills, who just don't have good time, can't count, or can't be taught a particular kind of groove. None of those cases led to success in change/improvement. The only success for me has been in surrender.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TAZ, getrhythm, Quinn Roberts and 14 others
#4
The shuffle is pretty subtle in that beat, it's just the ghost notes on the snare while the bass drum, right hand on the ride or hi hat, and snare accent on the back beat are all straight. If your drummer keeps those simple straight parts and plays triplet fills it should work OK.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LowActionHero and juggahnaught
#5
Reedt2000 said:
The shuffle is pretty subtle in that beat, it's just the ghost notes on the snare while the bass drum, right hand on the ride or hi hat, and snare accent on the back beat are all straight. If your drummer keeps those simple straight parts and plays triplet fills it should work OK.
Click to expand...
Yeah, but getting him to do that is the tricky part... His day job is a doctor, so he's used to calling the shots, hence my trepidation about mentioning areas that need work. Basically a nice guy though.

Gotta say though, as musicians, we all have egos, and my playing could be part of the problem too, in not locking into a shuffle groove to kind of lead the way.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: dkelley
#7
lat said:
Yeah, but getting him to do that is the tricky part... His day job is a doctor, so he's got a healthy ego and is used to calling the shots, hence my trepidation about calling out his shortcomings. Basically a nice guy though.
Click to expand...
Does he at least get close on the intro drum fill? If he doesn't then the song has to go, that drum fill is iconic and it's not the same without it. You could try and nicely suggest changes but if dynamics are such that it would only cause more problems then probably not worth it. How do the other members feel? If they don't care then your only real choice is to play as best you can and just accept that band's rendition, however lackluster.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BassikBrad and dkelley
#9
Reedt2000 said:
Does he at least get close on the intro drum fill? If he doesn't then the song has to go, that drum fill is iconic and it's not the same without it. You could try and nicely suggest changes but if dynamics are such that it would only cause more problems then probably not worth it. How do the other members feel? If they don't care then your only real choice is to play as best you can and just accept that band's rendition, however lackluster.
Click to expand...
Close, but not close enough, IMO... I get the impression from the guitarist that he may share a similar opinion, so I think after the gig, he may agree with me. Plus, the singer has a hard time reaching the low notes, so there's that.
 
Last edited:
#16
This particular shuffle requires a fair bit of left hand / right hand indpendence. The left/snare is 'fully shuffling' while the right is playing quarters. Independence-wise, it may be a lot to ask for a lot of hobbyist drummers and likely not something they can pull off without a fair bit of wood shedding. With so much of modern music being straight up rock I think a lot of guys just get by being able to show up and play a backbeat so they aren't used to working out their parts.

That said, I think you should totally let him know that the tune isn't feeling like you think it should, rhythmically, and ask if he could play more of a shuffle groove on it. If he's not familiar with shuffles in general then plink out the skippy shuffle groove for him on you bass, and maybe he could just do that with his right hand on the ride/hat and do backbeats on the snare...simplified shuffle feel. If he seems OK with this feedback, I'd then also send him this video, which is a good tutorial!
 
  • Like
Reactions: lokikallas, chuckNC, Blind Lemon Sam and 6 others
#18
This issue has been going on for years.
Back in the 40's the cats would say "the guy can't swing". Some musicians don't grasp the concept between "straight eighth (notes) and dotted eighth(notes)" let alone feeling it.

When a drummer is playing with a dotted eighth feel and the song calls for straight eighths (aka rock beat) someone has to yell to the drummer "ROCK Skippy".
 
  • Like
Reactions: Quantized Harmonic, Jason Hollar, mikewalker and 1 other person

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back