Ebay woes

[redramen]

I bought a bass last week on eBay. I usually don't like buying instruments online since I like to be able to see the instrument before buying, but I was looking for another Mexican Standard Jaguar bass (passive), and no one local has them.

So I ordered this bass on eBay since it was listed as New and the owner said he bought another bass so the jaguar bass just sat in his closet for several years.

I get the bass on Thursday, and surprise surprise, it was stained and there was a scratch, and dings near the neck. The bass was bubble wrapped, and the bubble wrap was secured with duct tape. So I orginially thought the stains were caused by the duct tape. But I couldnt wipe off the stains. It looks almost like it is under the clear coat or the clear coat itself was stained. So I message the seller to tell him I found stains and scratches and dents.

Of course he says he looked over the bass really carefully before shipping and found nothing wrong with it. And he says that the duct tape was not touching the bass at all.

So I would like to believe him, but the box was not damaged so I don't think it was caused by shipping. I am posting to ask what could have caused the stains and damage if the seller is telling the truth that the bass was perfect when he shipped it out.

The markings almost look like a nylon guitar strap or the inside of some gig bags. So I think it was caused by a strap or gig bag. But I don't have enough experience with guitars to know the cause the staining. I know that nylon can damage nitro finishes, but I dont know if it also causes staining or damage to poly finishes. I don't know what would have caused the neck dings. Would shipping have caused that?

P9220473

• redramen
• Sep 25, 2017
• ebay

P9220472

• redramen
• Sep 25, 2017
• ebay

P9220471

• redramen
• Sep 25, 2017
• ebay

P9220470

• redramen
• Sep 25, 2017
• ebay

 

[mikeyjm2]

Those don't look like problems from shipping to me. Since it was listed as new I would look into returning it unless the seller is willing to work with you on some kind of partial refund. Ebay will most likely take your (buyer) side of this if it comes to a dispute.

 

[Mister Boh]

As long as everything else is ok, try to get him to knock off some cash.

The stain is probably from a cable secured in the strap. Definitely not new, even if it was pristine it's not new given his story.

Ebay will back you on this one, for sure.

 

[redramen]

Those don't look like problems from shipping to me. Since it was listed as new I would look into returning it unless the seller is willing to work with you on some kind of partial refund. Ebay will most likely take your (buyer) side of this if it comes to a dispute.

Thanks, I actually did email the seller, and he is hesitantly accepting a return.

The weird thing is, even when he accepted the return, he kept saying that it wasn't like that when he shipped it. And was asking to make sure that they weren't normal Mexican finish flaws. And then he basically said, I expect the bass to come back to me in the same shape that I shipped it out in and that it hasn't been modified, or the damage was caused by use, etc.

So I am now worried that he won't give me a refund when he gets it back, since he insists that he didn't ship it out with stains and damage and he wants it back in the same condition that he says he shipped it out in (i.e. no stains or damage).

So is he able to deny me a refund and say that it didn't have stains and damage when he shipped it out it?

 

[mikeyjm2]

So is he able to deny me a refund and say that it didn't have stains and damage when he shipped it out it?

I don't believe so, no. From everything I've ever heard eBay pretty nearly always takes the buyer's side in any dispute.

 

[Wfrance3]

If the pics you sent are the same pics you looked at in the ad, but without the flaws, you may have a disputed on your hands. I’ve been in one before. And it was ruled in my favor as a seller, but that was a pretty low dollar Item and may have been “accommodated” - I’m suspicious ebay refunded both of us.

 

[bobcruz]

All of those marks look like they would buff out with a little polish. Possibly I'd accept the bass with a discount, then start buffing. Good luck, Bob

 

[redramen]

If the pics you sent are the same pics you looked at in the ad, but without the flaws, you may have a disputed on your hands. I’ve been in one before. And it was ruled in my favor as a seller, but that was a pretty low dollar Item and may have been “accommodated” - I’m suspicious ebay refunded both of us.

The pictures were the ones that I took. The pictures that was on the ad was just zoomed out pics of the body, neck, back, etc. The pictures in the ad didn't show the flaws.

All of those marks look like they would buff out with a little polish. Possibly I'd accept the bass with a discount, then start buffing. Good luck, Bob

I am afraid of trying to buff or clean up the stains since then I am sure he would blame me for modifying or damaging the bass further. Especially if I can't get the stains out, then I have a stained/damaged bass and without being able to return it.

But I am sure you are right, that they can come off with a little bit of work. My only issue is that I wouldn't have minded cleaning up a stained or damaged bass if I knew that the stains or damage was there. But I thought I was buying a NEW bass. And I wouldn't have paid that much for a used bass.

 

[charlie monroe]

Did the OP pay "New" prices?

 

[redramen]

I paid $420 for the jag bass but that was when I thought it was new. I bought my previous jaguar bass for $350ish, so I would have paid closer to that if I knew I was getting a stained or damaged bass.

The seller didn't offer a partial refund. They just wanted me to send it back to them.

 

[Jeff Scott]

Thanks, I actually did email the seller, and he is hesitantly accepting a return.

The weird thing is, even when he accepted the return, he kept saying that it wasn't like that when he shipped it. And was asking to make sure that they weren't normal Mexican finish flaws. And then he basically said, I expect the bass to come back to me in the same shape that I shipped it out in and that it hasn't been modified, or the damage was caused by use, etc.

So I am now worried that he won't give me a refund when he gets it back, since he insists that he didn't ship it out with stains and damage and he wants it back in the same condition that he says he shipped it out in (i.e. no stains or damage).

So is he able to deny me a refund and say that it didn't have stains and damage when he shipped it out it?

Are you communicating through standard ebay communications, or private e-mail?

 

[gln1955]

So I ordered this bass on eBay since it was listed as New and the owner said he bought another bass so the jaguar bass just sat in his closet for several years.

This is, by definition, not a new bass. He tried to pull some BS and is now intimidating you about not accepting the return. Be ready to get eBay involved with this douchnozzle.

 

[tjh]

I paid $420 for the jag bass but that was when I thought it was new. I bought my previous jaguar bass for $350ish, so I would have paid closer to that if I knew I was getting a stained or damaged bass.

The seller didn't offer a partial refund. They just wanted me to send it back to them.

On whose dime will you be shipping it back?

There are a few different ways to look at it ... the price you paid is reasonable, and yes, the pics he posted do not show any of the issues that your pictures show ... but, the issues in your pics are not something that would cause me to send a bass back that I like everything else about ... if you examine the sound/playability/general fit and finish from factory/etc, and you would call the bass a keeper, I would be fairly confident I could get the majority of issues shown in your pics off with either a light buffing, soft gentle pencil eraser, or in worst case scenario, I could live with them ... again based upon its desirability in every other way ... but then, basses to me are no different than any other tool I own, I don't abuse them, but I use them, and over time they will likely show the use ... to me that is a good sign ...

From the sellers text:

"A Fender Deluxe Jaguar P.J. Bass in excellent+ condition. I bought this after getting hooked on Bass after buying my first cheaper Squier Bass. I wanted another PJ Bass, like the Squier I had, but did NOT want Active Electronics. I hated having to change the battery or worry about when it was going to die on the Squier. This one does not have Active Electronics, just great sounding passive pickups. A few weeks after I bought this, Fender went and released the Seafoam Green Deluxe version, and I bought that one too. The green one is all I have played, and this one has set in its box, unused. This one has only had a set-up done and spent its life in the closet for a couple of years. The wood on the fretboard has great color to it, and looks great against the black and white of the guitar. Everything works as it should, and there is no damage or wear. There are some handling swirls on the pickguard, but the great thing about that is, I never took the protective plastic film off the pickguard, so it is pristine too. This one is made in the Mexico factory. It did not come with a case, but will be packed very securely."

Condition is unfortunately subjective ... excellent+ is different from person to person, the nature of the beast, especially Ebay ...this may have been listed incorrectly as New (Other), because he admits that a 'few weeks' after he bought this, he put it away ... his 'few' and your/mine/their 'few' weeks may differ, but I can guarantee that it was played for those 'few' weeks, however long it actually was ... it is not new, in any version of the word, as it was sold (vs sitting in a store being played as a demo) and played ...

With that said, bass is 'not as advertised', they agree, and a willing to take it back .. original question again, who pays for the ride back? .. then you have to decide, after your in hand eval, do you like it enough to overlook the issues you have pointed out, and if YOU pay the shipping, is it worth coughing up the $$ over your disappointment ... you could always open a dispute, and go that course ... or you could also just decide on what you can/will accept and move on .. chalk it up to the cost of education, and attack lifes next hurdle ...

JMHO ...as always

 

[redramen]

This is, by definition, not a new bass. He tried to pull some BS and is now intimidating you about not accepting the return. Be ready to get eBay involved with this douchnozzle.

I am really hoping I don't have to get ebay involved. I am afraid of what the seller might try to pull.

Are you communicating through standard ebay communications, or private e-mail?

I started a return process. But I couldn't send any communication through that. So I was just emailing him through the ebay message thing.

 

[tjh]

This is, by definition, not a new bass. He tried to pull some BS and is now intimidating you about not accepting the return. Be ready to get eBay involved with this douchnozzle.

...
The seller didn't offer a partial refund. They just wanted me to send it back to them.

 

[redramen]

On whose dime will they be shipping it back?

There are a few different ways to look at it ... the price you paid is reasonable, and yes, the pics he posted do not show any of the issues that your pictures show ... but, the issues in your pics are not something that would cause me to send a bass back that I like everything else about ... if you examine the sound/playability/general fit and finish from factory/etc, and you would call the bass a keeper, I would be fairly confident I could get the majority of issues shown in your pics off with either a light buffing, soft gentle pencil eraser, or in worst case scenario, I could live with them ... again based upon its desirability in every other way ... but then, basses to me are no different than any other tool I own, I don't abuse them, but I use them, and over time they will likely show the use ... to me that is a good sign ...

From the sellers text:

A Fender Deluxe Jaguar P.J. Bass in excellent+ condition. I bought this after getting hooked on Bass after buying my first cheaper Squier Bass. I wanted another PJ Bass, like the Squier I had, but did NOT want Active Electronics. I hated having to change the battery or worry about when it was going to die on the Squier. This one does not have Active Electronics, just great sounding passive pickups. A few weeks after I bought this, Fender went and released the Seafoam Green Deluxe version, and I bought that one too. The green one is all I have played, and this one has set in its box, unused. This one has only had a set-up done and spent its life in the closet for a couple of years. The wood on the fretboard has great color to it, and looks great against the black and white of the guitar. Everything works as it should, and there is no damage or wear. There are some handling swirls on the pickguard, but the great thing about that is, I never took the protective plastic film off the pickguard, so it is pristine too. This one is made in the Mexico factory. It did not come with a case, but will be packed very securely.

Condition is unfortunately subjective ... excellent+ is different from person to person, the nature of the beast, especially Ebay ...this may have been listed incorrectly as New (Other), because he admits that a 'few weeks' after he bought this, he put it away ... his 'few' and your/mine/their 'few' weeks may differ, but I can guarantee that it was played for those 'few' weeks, however long it actually was ... it is not new, in any version of the word, as it was sold (vs sitting in a store being played as a demo) and played ...

With that said, bass is 'not as advertised', they agree, and a willing to take it back .. original question again, who pays for the ride back? .. then you have to decide, after your in hand eval, do you like it enough to overlook the issues you have pointed out, and if YOU pay the shipping, is it worth coughing up the $$ over your disappointment ... you could always open a dispute, and go that course ... or you could also just decide on what you can/will accept and move on .. chalk it up to the cost of education, and attack lifes next hurdle ...

JMHO ...as always

Yup that was the ebay ad.

I didn't even try to play or do anything with the bass since I didn't want to be accused of damaging the bass by playing it. So I emailed the seller within 5 minutes of seeing the stain/ damage. And I haven't touched the bass since.

I honestly wouldn't have minded the stain or damage if I knew they were there before buying it. I know that basses will get something on them with use. But I wouldn't have paid $420 for it. I know that it was a decent price, but since I got my other jag bass (same model) for $350, I didn't want to pay much more than that. I really regret having to sell my silver jag bass to pay bills earlier this year.

 

[Wfrance3]

am really hoping I don't have to get ebay involved. I am afraid of what the seller might try to pull.

I think involving ebay is probably the way to go. if you don need them later they'll want to know why you didn't get them involved sooner. Price aside, all the other bs aside, ebay has definitions for new, used etc. I think if you reference that, a bass that shows up in the condition yours did would fail the new product litmus test.

The only thing i can see that you need to watch out for is if the seller lies and says the condition you in which you claim you received it is different that the condition in which he shipped it. I would check his feedback and if it's a long standing string of good transactions you might has worse odds than if this is not his first instance of questionable behavior.

 

[BigBigGuy44]

I am really hoping I don't have to get ebay involved. I am afraid of what the seller might try to pull.

In this situation, you want eBay involved. The key here is you bought a bass listed as "new" with "no damage or wear". Your photos disprove that. Open a dispute, provide photos when requested and keep all you conversations to the eBay messaging system. You should not have an issue with the refund, have to pay return shipping or worry about retaliation.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

Some of those would probably come off with a Magic Eraser. But since the ad said excellent+ rather than New, the seller has some wiggle room. I hope you sent it back with tracking info.

 

[redramen]

In this situation, you want eBay involved. The key here is you bought a bass listed as "new" with "no damage or wear". Your photos disprove that. Open a dispute, provide photos when requested and keep all you conversations to the eBay messaging system. You should not have an issue with the refund, have to pay return shipping or worry about retaliation.

I think involving ebay is probably the way to go. if you don need them later they'll want to know why you didn't get them involved sooner. Price aside, all the other bs aside, ebay has definitions for new, used etc. I think if you reference that, a bass that shows up in the condition yours did would fail the new product litmus test.

The only thing i can see that you need to watch out for is if the seller lies and says the condition you in which you claim you received it is different that the condition in which he shipped it. I would check his feedback and if it's a long standing string of good transactions you might has worse odds than if this is not his first instance of questionable behavior.

Is starting the ebay return process the same as involving ebay? When it asked me the reason, I chose "not described" or something like that. I was able to upload those pictures. Or is there something else I need to do to get ebay involved?

The seller accepted that I can return the bass. And I was able to print out a label. I don't know who pays for that label. I think he did maybe?

He also given me positive feedback already. But can he change that to negative?