Effects loop (I understand literally no ones explanation)

[Jake555]

Hahaha, okay darn man, I've sought out several explanations and I still don't get it.

I have..

tuner, compressor, envelope, chorus pedals. And an amp head with a distortion circuit.
It's all subjective I guess, but there is a generally accepted way of doing things as I understand...

My final conclusion is that...
||Send --> Chorus(and envelope?) input jack --> Chorus (env) output jack --> Return||

and as a different chain entirely:

||Bass --> Tuner --> Comp --> Amp input jack (and obviously the amps distortion is here, before the first chain)


Or like... I plug the SEND into the tuner!?!???! then the next pedals one to another, and from the last pedal in my chain to the RETURN!??!?!?! Where does the bass plug in?

Okay lemme try again

I plug BASS into tuner, tuner into next pedal (comp), etc... and then last pedal in chain.. to send? Wot?


Im a wee bit too old not to know this already

 

[Jake555]

no you don't plug an output to send smh what the heck am I thinking

 

[Derek Williams]

My final conclusion is that...
||Send --> Chorus(and envelope?) input jack --> Chorus (env) output jack --> Return||

and as a different chain entirely:

||Bass --> Tuner --> Comp --> Amp input jack (and obviously the amps distortion is here, before the first chain)

Yes, this is correct

 

[frankzap]

The Send/Return section in an amplifier is located between the Preamp and PowerAmp sections. For optimal results, it's generally recommended to position time-based effects such as Chorus, Delay, and Reverb after the Preamp using the Send/Return connections. On the other hand, gain-based effects, envelopes, octavers, etc., are typically placed in front of the Preamp. While there's flexibility, arranging effects in this manner often yields better outcomes. The placement of the Compressor is a choice, but placing it in front of the Preamp may produce improved results. To set up your effects chain, I suggest you this layout as a starting point: Instrument > Tuner > Compressor > Amplifier Input (preamp) > SEND to Chorus Input, and connect Chorus’ Output to the amp's RETURN.

 

[Phe]

I'd recommend forgetting about the whole loop and placing stuff between the bass and amp input.

 

[Mayo Fan]

Bass -> pedals -> amp. Don't overthink it, enjoy it.

 

[Solude]

Which amp? Going to be a very short list that need a loop for anything other than running a modeler into the power amp

 

[Derek Williams]

I'd recommend forgetting about the whole loop and placing stuff between the bass and amp input.

It could depend on what kind of distortion from the amp. If it's a Darkglass amp with a fairly heavy distortion then it could make a big difference to the sound if the chorus is before or after the preamp.

Can of course try without the loop, which I would guess @Jake555 has already tried.

 

[kesslari]

I'd recommend forgetting about the whole loop and placing stuff between the bass and amp input.

Bass -> pedals -> amp. Don't overthink it, enjoy it.

What these guys said.

 

[Egg250]

I'm not 100% following what the issue is.

The effects loop allows your amplifier preamp circuit to process the signal before it goes to the effects pedals. The signal chain would be: bass-preamp-effects-power amp. I'm not sure if you knew that, no offense intended.

Some people like to have the option for their unaltered signal to go the preamp first. I'm not one of those.

 

[baxter_x]

The effect loop is simply between the preamp and the power section.
You take the output of the preamp and send it into the input of the power section.
This allows multiple choices. Like using another preamp and sending it into the power section of your amp.
Or adding some effect like described above.
You can take also the preamp output to send it to another power section.

 

[rogerb]

Ya so either bass into tuner, then other pedals in/out in/out, then the last pedal out into where you would usually plug your bass in the amp… most would do that.

Or … same chain of effects loop using send/return and your bass just goes straight into where it would usually go on the front of the amp.

 

[paskisti]

It could depend on what kind of distortion from the amp. If it's a Darkglass amp with a fairly heavy distortion then it could make a big difference to the sound if the chorus is before or after the preamp.

Can of course try without the loop, which I would guess @Jake555 has already tried.

Exactly this. Guitarists use often 4-cable method in their pedalboard if they run amp's distortion or overdrive, because clean boost is in front of the amp but chorus etc. must be after the distortion. Signal chain is then: guitar -> clean boost pedal -> amp's preamp with distortion -> effect send -> chorus pedal -> effect return -> amp's power amp -> speaker cab. Earlier replies reveal all effects being in effects loop and others before preamp.

 

[CalBuzz51]

It was helpful to me to learn that the effects loop typically runs at line level, and the instrument input is at “instrument level.” Line level is a hotter signal, and rack effects are built to run at line level, but foot pedals mileage may vary when connected through the effects loop.

 

[HolmeBass]

Hahaha, okay darn man, I've sought out several explanations and I still don't get it.

I have..

tuner, compressor, envelope, chorus pedals. And an amp head with a distortion circuit.
It's all subjective I guess, but there is a generally accepted way of doing things as I understand...

My final conclusion is that...
||Send --> Chorus(and envelope?) input jack --> Chorus (env) output jack --> Return||

and as a different chain entirely:

||Bass --> Tuner --> Comp --> Amp input jack (and obviously the amps distortion is here, before the first chain)


Or like... I plug the SEND into the tuner!?!???! then the next pedals one to another, and from the last pedal in my chain to the RETURN!??!?!?! Where does the bass plug in?

Okay lemme try again

I plug BASS into tuner, tuner into next pedal (comp), etc... and then last pedal in chain.. to send? Wot?


Im a wee bit too old not to know this already

Dude! Your initial post showing the two chains was right - how did you get lost from there? Where in those first two diagrams does it show the Send signal going to the tuner???

Let’s set some definitions to iron out input jack vs output jack.

Follow this rule throughout: an output jack is ALWAYS connected by an input jack by an instrument cable.

Your pedals should have clearly defined input and output jacks. Let’s ignore stereo operation. In almost all cases inputs are on the right, outputs on the left side of the pedal, but they should be clearly labeled.

The instrument input jack on your amp is, quite sensibly, an input jack. The jack on your bass is an OUTPUT jack. (For some reason people have trouble with this.) Your amp has an effects loop, I take it. The Send jack on the effects loop is an output jack, the Return is an input jack.

So taking the wiring rule into account always, here is how you connect everything:

Bass > tuner > comp > amp instrument input jack

Follow the rule here. (Rule is: Each output jack MUST be connected to an input jack by an instrument cable.) This gets your bass signal into your amp. Now the effects loop - also follows the same wiring rule:

SEND > chorus > envelope filter > RETURN

This takes your signal from somewhere after your preamp, sends it out to the chorus and EF, and after the RETURN jack sends it to the power section of your integrated amplifier. From there is goes to your speaker cabinet(s) to be turned into sound.

 

[Killing Floor]

Don’t panic, there is no right or wrong way. But in general many pedals are not designed for line level. Won’t hurt anything but you may like the result better in a bass-pedal-amp signal chain. But experiment. You can’t mess it up. Whatever you like best is the best.

 

[J.Wolf]

these days, the only reason I want an FX loop is if I want to use a different preamp section and go into the FX return, thus making the head basically a power amp. For all pedals, I run them in front of the amp.

 

[bigjames]

What these guys said.

This is how I do it too. BASS > TUNER > FX > AMP. I do not think I have ever used the send / return feature on any of my amps.

 

[Stubb]

Bass -> pedals -> amp. Don't overthink it, enjoy it.

I think it matters a whole lot more with guitar amps where you want the overdriven sound from the preamp being sent to chorus/delay/verb/trem, rather than sending an effected signal into distortion.

But when guitarists talk about pedal platform amps, they're usually talking about something clean with lots of headroom to put all their effects into. I don't know about you, but to me, that sounds like my use-case on bass — I'm looking for a mostly clean, edge of breakup sound from my preamp, and don't mind my effects driving that, rather than the other way around. I could possibly see using an effects loop if you were getting your primary dirty tone from the preamp, but even then, nothing I currently own — various ODs, envelope filter, comp, phaser — would benefit from the loop. Maybe if I was using delay, but it's probably not worth the hassle. I wonder if it would be for you.

 

[Mayo Fan]

I think it matters a whole lot more with guitar amps where you want the overdriven sound from the preamp being sent to chorus/delay/verb/trem, rather than sending an effected signal into distortion.

But when guitarists talk about pedal platform amps, they're usually talking about something clean with lots of headroom to put all their effects into. I don't know about you, but to me, that sounds like my use-case on bass — I'm looking for a mostly clean, edge of breakup sound from my preamp, and don't mind my effects driving that, rather than the other way around. I could possibly see using an effects loop if you were getting your primary dirty tone from the preamp, but even then, nothing I currently own — various ODs, envelope filter, comp, phaser — would benefit from the loop. Maybe if I was using delay, but it's probably not worth the hassle. I wonder if it would be for you.

Nope, not for me. I'm quite picky about my tone, but 4 cables is too much for me.