Everyone's downsizing these days..

[Pilgrim]

If I dont feel the bass....then its worthless. pa's are okay, but most the time you have to be on top of the damned monitor to feel the bass. Oh sure maybe you can hear it, but I mean feel what the heck youre playing. I dont care how many class d watts will go into a 112 combo or "mini stack". I have to feel it. And it has to EASILY compete with 2 50 watt fenders, and a loud drummer.

You may not have experienced this, but putting 300 to 600 watts into a pair of 12's is PLENTY capable of making you feel the bass. The last gig I played, a single 12 had the stage flexing so I could feel it with my feet as well as my body.

It does not take a stack of 15s to move air and feel the bass. And I play with two guitarists using 60W Fenders and a surf drummer who's like a machine gun. Then again, we don't play at 120dB and cause small birds to fall from the sky.

And we don't even use a PA except for between-song announcements.

Using a modular system also makes load-in and load-out much faster and more pleasant, and makes it possible for me to travel to the gig in a smaller vehicle.

 

[guy n. cognito]

When I was young and stupid, I agreed with many of the above. No matter the gig, I was dragging my 810 and 1000 watt rack with me. I was convinced that I needed that setup to get "my tone." 100 seat bar? 810. 50 seat coffee house? 810. 300 seat music venue? 2-810s. I bought vehicles around my "need" to carry large gear.

When I got back into gigging a few years ago. I spent alot of time (and money) trying to find lighter gear. Guess what? I found it.

I regularly play a 150 seat bar with nothing more than my Acme 210 and my GB Shuttle. No PA support. I never get the master over 4 and I'm thumping the back of the room. Last year, we played a reunion in a VERY large meeting room. For that gig, I used my Neox 212. Granted, we weren't there to play at ear splitting volumes, but I could easily be heard all the way in the back and I wasn't pushing either my head or my cab.

The advances made in gear in the last 10 years is amazing. A bass player no longer needs a wall of 810s to keep up with drummers and guitards.

 

[Femto]

I use a rig that sounds good to me, if it is "overkill" for some things I don't care, that is what a volume control is for.

I say that regularly, pretty much word for word.

 

[ljazz]

You may not have experienced this, but putting 300 to 600 watts into a pair of 12's is PLENTY capable of making you feel the bass. The last gig I played, a single 12 had the stage flexing so I could feel it with my feet as well as my body.

It does not take a stack of 15s to move air and feel the bass. And I play with two guitarists using 60W Fenders and a surf drummer who's like a machine gun. Then again, we don't play at 120dB and cause small birds to fall from the sky.

Using a modular system also makes load-in and load-out much faster and more pleasant, and makes it possible for me to travel to the gig in a smaller vehicle.

All excellent points.....

My 212 sounds great, pushes a bunch of air, and is a joy to drag out at 3am (compared to even a 90+ pound 410). I love that I can fit my rig easily into my 30 mile per gallon vehicle, with room to spare. I love that I don't need anyones help to load/unload, and I really dig that my rig hasn't turned out to be a compromise to the old SVT/Fridge, especially when I bring the 112 along with the 212.

Nothing against the cats that feel they have to play a 250 pound rig..... but I'll take effective and efficient over just effective any day of the week.

 

[Mudfuzz]

All excellent points.....

My 212 sounds great, pushes a bunch of air, and is a joy to drag out at 3am (compared to even a 90+ pound 410).

I gig with a 2X12 most of the time, it is 90+LBs, not all 2x12 cabs are light.

 

[greenboy]

When I did the fEarfuls I downsized without losing any SPL or lower frequency extension. Less weight and bulk, modular, and actually louder at any frequency than my old "big rig".

 

[JimmyM]

You may not have experienced this, but putting 300 to 600 watts into a pair of 12's is PLENTY capable of making you feel the bass. The last gig I played, a single 12 had the stage flexing so I could feel it with my feet as well as my body.

It does not take a stack of 15s to move air and feel the bass. And I play with two guitarists using 60W Fenders and a surf drummer who's like a machine gun. Then again, we don't play at 120dB and cause small birds to fall from the sky.

Using a modular system also makes load-in and load-out much faster and more pleasant, and makes it possible for me to travel to the gig in a smaller vehicle.

Well we all have our own acceptable level of air movement. Like a 210 or a 112 will do in a pinch but I don't find them acceptable for me, but a 115, 212 or 410 is acceptable to me. But if you find the 112 acceptable, rock.

 

[Deluge Of Sound]

There's also the aesthetic element--a big wall of speakers just looks a hell of a lot cooler than an uber-efficient micro setup.

 

[NortyFiner]

I would love to trade in my heavy Acoustic for something easier to move (all the better to find jam sessions with) but what kills me is that all the lightweight gear costs so much. Even the Shuttle 3.0 costs like half a house payment, WITHOUT a cab. Makes those lightweight GK combos look even more attractive, I guess...

 

[metdistortion]

First of all no offense again.

2nd-I have a keen ear for fine tone thx.But you cant tell me a 10 inch speker will even be heard in my band playing as quiet as they can(obviously different genres so fair enough).

And yeah looks,to me, is a factor.Love a mean lookin rig!!When a bass "rig" is smaller them my drummers tomtom-yeah nuff said.

But hey no offense and to each there own.

My Trace Elliot only needs a ten inch speaker to be able to fill a venue at less than half volume whilst playing with a metal band without going through the PA.

However, the cab does have an enclosed speaker design that gives it the kind of feel of an 810

 

[Baird6869]

I think a good 4x10 is a big enough cab for almost every gig and I use them almost always. Heavy, but IMO worth lugging around. A 2x10 IMO can do most smaller-med rooms also.

I DID just order a TC Electronic 1x12 for practice, so I am hoping it is loud enough to hear over drums and guitars. We shall see.

Also, I have owned a GB Shuttlemax 12.0 and a MB F1 until recently... I want to love the smaller heads, but I keep coming back to the big gear (currently an 85lb SVT-CL and a 42lb GB GBE1200). The lightest amp I have played that gives me the tone I want is a 20+lb GK 1001RB-II. I am gigging this most of the time these days.

 

[Mudfuzz]

My Trace Elliot only needs a ten inch speaker to be able to fill a venue at less than half volume whilst playing with a metal band without going through the PA.

Against what amps?

 

[THUNDERGODX]

I just retired or at least rested my Peavy 3620 and Max head in favor of an Ampeg SVT-IV Pro and an 810E.

I was using 3 1810's over 3 118's with the Max head.
I called that rig the Wall Of Sound.
I also have a Peavey 1820 with a 118 D.
Those are larger dimension cabinets like the 1810 and 118.
That was the Tower Of Power.
I guess that does make me a downsizer.

I like to look like Im in an 80s metal video.

Ampeg-Nuff Said.

 

[metdistortion]

Against what amps?

Lead guitarist was using a 210 Line6 Combo (about 100watts I imagine), and vocalist/rhythm guitarist was only using a 30watt Line6 combo.

 

[Pilgrim]

There's also the aesthetic element--a big wall of speakers just looks a hell of a lot cooler than an uber-efficient micro setup.

I agree - but not enough to continue enduring the pain of moving 70-to 100-pound speaker cabs around. I seldom used more than one cab anyway. I never could see the logic behind a wall of speakers unless you are playing a coliseum.

I'm not in it to play "mine's bigger than yours" with cabs (not saying that you are, but some are...). I'm there to make good music.

 

[Mudfuzz]

Lead guitarist was using a 210 Line6 Combo (about 100watts I imagine), and vocalist/rhythm guitarist was only using a 30watt Line6 combo.

I see....

I find Line6 very underpowered really.

My guitarist runs a Marshall pre-amp in to a 150 watt Seymour Duncan power amp into a Marshall 4X14...

I use either a Mesa 400+ or a SVT Cl into a 2X12 and or a 1X18.

 

[T-Funk]

I would say that some people are not only downsizing, but rightsizing to their present and anticipated future needs.

 

[johnk_10]

i've tried alot of different cabs to give me the feel/tone/fullness that i desire playing with a loud rock band with no FOH support, and for me, i couldn't get away with anything smaller than a 2x12 cab (two-3012LF's/Eminence 630SS 6.5"). my 2x12 cab is light (43 lbs) and small, but comes pretty close to putting out the same low end and volume of my Ampeg 412, 610 or 810 cabs. but i do agree that i've always felt it lacking when trying to get it done with a single 12" or 15" cab.

 

[georgestrings]

Quote:
Originally Posted by metdistortion
My Trace Elliot only needs a ten inch speaker to be able to fill a venue at less than half volume whilst playing with a metal band without going through the PA.

Against what amps?

No doubt - I'm thinking that his drummer must hit like a girl, too...



- georgestrings

 

[metdistortion]

I see....

I find Line6 very underpowered really.

My guitarist runs a Marshall pre-amp in to a 150 watt Seymour Duncan power amp into a Marshall 4X14...

I use either a Mesa 400+ or a SVT Cl into a 2X12 and or a 1X18.

But still, we are plenty loud enough with our gear, we could still be heard a few hundred metres away up the highstreet. My rig was the backline, and none of the other bassists had problems with a single 10