Fbass Fancy Top vs. Standard BN5

[adrian garcia]

Didn't you just sell an MTD 6 because you couldn't deal with the 6 string format

i have been sked this several times. here is my response copied from another thread:

by having the mtd635 here i realized i really do WANT a 6 around, but the 635 was difficult to get used to- the F bass has a wider spacing and shorter scales, both pluses. And I know what the F bass sounds like. I would not do well on any other 6 , hence i did not buy the Roscoe

 

[Vic]

i have been sked this several times. here is my response copied from another thread:

by having the mtd635 here i realized i really do WANT a 6 around, but the 635 was difficult to get used to- the F bass has a wider spacing and shorter scales, both pluses. And I know what the F bass sounds like. I would not do well on any other 6 , hence i did not buy the Roscoe

So, Adrian, do you have this text in a file on your desktop and you just cut/paste it each time?

 

[KJung]

i have been sked this several times. here is my response copied from another thread:

by having the mtd635 here i realized i really do WANT a 6 around, but the 635 was difficult to get used to- the F bass has a wider spacing and shorter scales, both pluses. And I know what the F bass sounds like. I would not do well on any other 6 , hence i did not buy the Roscoe

Wow... you can feel the difference between 34.5 and 35

Not quite following, but hey... I've done some 'interesting' things in my gear swapping also for reasons even more convoluted

 

[GRoberts]

and for the top or no top question, I am debating if I should
1. Buy my Mac BN5 back
2. Buy a plain jane demo at a very low price, but very sound bass
3. Buy AJ's BN6 with a maple top and goodies

I have a feeling the plain jain BN5 would have the best tone of the three.

All options are winners.If I was going to buy a standard BN5(plain jane), I'd still want to chose a color and grain pattern that speaks to me. I LOVE my TobaccoBurst BN5 that I bought from you a couple years ago.

AJ's BN6 is a SWEETHeart! The BN6 makes more sense if you want a 6-er. You already have a Nordy vJ5 and another Nordy 5'er on the way if I recall. The BN6 would give you two options you don't have currently; A: an F Bass, and B: a 6 string option. Those are two things you don't have right now. I LOVE AJ's BN6. His is super fine!

Then again, your Mac BN5 is a Killer bass. It would be an interesting contest to see which gets played more; Nordy vJ5 or F Bass BN5.
Gary

 

[tombowlus]

The short answer is that personally, I prefer the tone of the ones without tops.

I will add that George uses a very thin top so it has minimal interference on tone ( i still hear it ) , and that F basses have probably the most consistent tone bass to bass that I have ever heard.

ps- i would guess that an ebony fingerboard will yield a bigger difference in tone than an ebony top. In contrast with an Ash / Maple. A guess.

+1 to all of the above. I don't have near the experience that Adrian does with F Basses, but having played a handful, I was struck with the notion that, in general, those without tops are just a tad more open and expressive, and those with tops are a tad more smooth and warm. But you can certainly make some minor tweaks to the EQ and more than counter the effect of a top or no top.

But, this is a generalization, and though they are consistent, there is some variation to be expected from bass to bass. I have a solid ash BN5 on order, and I currently own a BN5 with an ash body and an ambrosia top. That BN4, though, is very open, detailed and dynamic (and just flat out killer across the board, IMHO).

But again the fingerboard choice is probably the more significant decision.

Tom.

 

[tombowlus]

Wow... you can feel the difference between 34.5 and 35

Actually, I think that this difference is pretty noticeable. In fact, when I picked up my first F Bass at NAMM, I played about four notes, looked up at Mitch and said, "34 and a half inch scale?" And he smiled and nodded.

Tom.

P.S.
And before you say it, I honestly did not know the scale length before picking one up.

 

[KJung]

Actually, I think that this difference is pretty noticeable. In fact, when I picked up my first F Bass at NAMM, I played about four notes, looked up at Mitch and said, "34 and a half inch scale?" And he smiled and nodded.

Tom.

P.S.
And before you say it, I honestly did not know the scale length before picking one up.

You've got to be kidding

 

[tombowlus]

You've got to be kidding

Not at all. Are you saying that you do not notice this difference?

 

[KJung]

Not at all. Are you saying that you do not notice this difference?

Not at all. That's a little over a 1% difference across the entire range of the neck. If you notice it, that's really something!

That being said, the way the FBass is positioned on the body, I will say that the playability of that bass feels very different than other basses. I surely did not attribute that to a 1/2 inch scale difference

 

[basses55]

I agree with alot that has been said already but just to add my experience and reinforce with the others on this subject as we have before on other threads...

I've had considerable exposure and experience with this exact question and own a topped and a non topped BN5.. plus have owned several before now, and a/b'd dozens and played more than I can even count....

As thin as George makes the top, and it does mitigate the effect to a degree, from what we can hear they do sound generally a little different than non - topped Fs. To me this is not neccessarily a bad thing either- a matter of taste IMO.
The topped ones- especially the harder woods- have a slightly compressed quality and many times a slightly more pronounced fundamental. The slight compression may be interpreted as warmth or smoothness- those are good words too. But with compression can come a slightly more focused fundamental and that can be a plus too. My ambrosia topped BN5 is preferred by some people I work with for that reason. There seems to be some difference between woods too..for example between mac and the lighter and softer buckeye.The tops dont change the main character of the F tone really at all..just alter some of the nuance.
The non - topped Fs seem to be consistantly a little more open and airy, punchy and dynamic. I have a hard time deciding which I like better....both are great for me and I'm glad I have both for the variety. Even given for the differences between basses normally, these qualities seem to run generally for Fs.

As far as the finish, a poly was tried at the shop and George did not like it...we thought it may have changed something in the tone for one. George is still keeping an eye out for something he likes better without affecting the tone and that he could switch to efficiently.

Either way, the F "tone" is there for both - I may favor the non topped BN5 for slap...and sometimes the topped one for fingerstyle, but have not had a problem using either for both styles of playing.

Mitch

 

[tombowlus]

Not at all. That's a little over a 1% difference across the entire range of the neck. If you notice it, that's really something!

That being said, the way the FBass is positioned on the body, I will say that the playability of that bass feels very different than other basses. I surely did not attribute that to a 1/2 inch scale difference

Maybe it's because I own and play a number of difference basses with different scale lengths (30.5, 32, 34, 34.5, 35, and, well, Dingwall ). So, I have kinda gotten my brain used to figuring out the scale length when I first pick up an instrument. Of course, the whole muscle memory thing goes out the window....

 

[basses55]

You've got to be kidding

I am so sensistive to scales with my puny hands....to me I feel it also right away...granted its slight, but with the little I have to work with every 1/2 inch means something.

fingers..please..talking fingers.

 

[KJung]

Maybe it's because I own and play a number of difference basses with different scale lengths (30.5, 32, 34, 34.5, 35, and, well, Dingwall ). So, I have kinda gotten my brain used to figuring out the scale length when I first pick up an instrument. Of course, the whole muscle memory thing goes out the window....

Also, per our PM, I do not play DB and have never played fretless (my primary training is piano). So, I may have never developed the precise left hand discipline and precision to really hone in on this. I can many times feel the 34 vs. 35 scale difference, although sometimes, on a bass like the 55-94, I can't really notice the extra scale length (i.e., that bass 'feels' closer to my Sadowsky than to other 35" scale necks to me). On the other hand, the MTD that hangs way out away from the body and extends that left arm in the first position feels '35' to me.

Just call me thumbs!

 

[basses55]

+1 to all of the above. I don't have near the experience that Adrian does with F Basses, but having played a handful, I was struck with the notion that, in general, those without tops are just a tad more open and expressive, and those with tops are a tad more smooth and warm. But you can certainly make some minor tweaks to the EQ and more than counter the effect of a top or no top.

But, this is a generalization, and though they are consistent, there is some variation to be expected from bass to bass. I have a solid ash BN5 on order, and I currently own a BN5 with an ash body and an ambrosia top. That BN4, though, is very open, detailed and dynamic (and just flat out killer across the board, IMHO).

But again the fingerboard choice is probably the more significant decision.

Tom.

For sure Tom, the topped F still sounds open and dynamic on its own to me too. It was only when a non -topped F comes then the possible differences are shown AND mostly relative to each other too IMO.

I agree with you on the fingerboard too..that choice is fundamental to what nuance character your F will gravitate towards.

 

[basses55]

Actually, I think that this difference is pretty noticeable. In fact, when I picked up my first F Bass at NAMM, I played about four notes, looked up at Mitch and said, "34 and a half inch scale?" And he smiled and nodded.

Tom.



P.S.
And before you say it, I honestly did not know the scale length before picking one up.

I remember that actually. Not too common that people can know the diff..but I can vouch for that sensitivity as I have it myself. When I'm testing Fs at the shop sometimes there is a 34 in there for Japan...its an immediate knowing. Once I had to convince George that one that I was testing was a 34 not a 34.5 as may have been just jotted down on the order..got out the ruler...
Bingo.

35s are even more obvious for me from playing a 34 .5

 

[adrian garcia]

yes, i sure can feel the diff between 35 and 34.5. Freaky, huh? the spacing at the bridge is also something i notice right away.

 

[KJung]

yes, i sure can feel the diff between 35 and 34.5. Freaky, huh? the spacing at the bridge is also something i notice right away.

Adrian, I've always been in awe of you, but for the first time, I think I'm actually in awe of Bowlus

 

[Jeff Moote]

Also, per our PM, I do not play DB and have never played fretless (my primary training is piano). So, I may have never developed the precise left hand discipline and precision to really hone in on this.

I don't know if that's really the issue. I play more fretless (all unlined) than fretted these days, and also spend a fair time on classical DB. I'm switching from 41.5" on the DB to 35" on my fretless Roscoe, 34" on the Rob Allen. My fretted basses also utilize different scales.

I'm with you - I could hazard a guess when I pick up a new bass, but I'll probably guess wrong - your Lakland example rings true for me. I don't think the scale thing has much to do with muscle memory... or maybe it does, but I don't notice. It takes me all of 30 seconds to figure out where I am on an instrument of any scale.

So I guess what I'm saying is that while some folks can feel the difference in scale lengths, it's simply because they've paid attention to it in general. For those of us with hands plenty large enough and who play various instruments all the time, it's no big deal.

 

[adrian garcia]

Adrian, I've always been in awe of you, but for the first time, I think I'm actually in awe of Bowlus

you're moving up in the world! you have seen the light.

 

[tombowlus]

Adrian, I've always been in awe of you, but for the first time, I think I'm actually in awe of Bowlus

Nah, it'll pass.