Fearful 1212sub / Headcase Idea...Need Help.

[will33]

Lot's of cool ideas here but if it was me, I'd just build the fearful true to spec. There's a lot of though went into that thing to make it as good as it is.

Then I'd build a headcase for your amp and put a strap handle on top. Then do a completely separate small practice cab with a footprint the same as the amp and put latches on both sides and the back with the recieving end of the latches on the headcase.

You could then buckle the amp to the small cab and the combined 30ish pounds would be easy to carry around by the strap handle.

With the recieving end of the latches on the headcase it should sit flat on top the big cab for gigs.

Another way be to just build the fearful as 2 separate cabs. 12+6+1 top cab and lowpassed 12 bottom cab. Top cab for practice/ both for gigs. You could even leave the woofer/mid split part of the crossover out and use your biamping capabilities. Just use the portion of the passive crossover that splits the mid/tweet in the top cab. If you end up with a mono amp in the future could just build in the rest of the passive xover.

Anyway, my 2 cents. It's cool to see custom projects like this and whatever you end up doing will be a really nice rig and a bit of a one-of-a-kind.

 

[MWBass]

MWBass - It sounds like you've developed some pretty specific ideas. If I understand it correctly, your headcase will now have the 18 Sound mid, and a woofer that will be disconnected when running with the 1212 sub.

By all accounts, the 18 Sound 6ND410 is an impressive mid. If it's important to use that speaker, the rest of my post will be moot for you. But if your goal is only to stick to a pure fEARful design, you could also do that by using two Alpha 6a speakers. Unlike the 6ND410, the Alpha could be used full-range at low volume. The bass output would not be impressive, but you wouldn't have a "dead" speaker at your gigs, cost would be lower, and you'd have room for your tweeter again.

I definetly know what you are getting at. It has been looming in my head since the first time you mentioned using the faital 8pr200's as full range in the combo, and midrange in the headcase with the 1212 sub. I really wanted to stick with the 18 sound mid because I have heard such great things. So, I came up with an awesome design with appropriate volume and vents for 2 8 inch faitals as woofers and the 18 sound mid in a two way biamped combo.

However, after i was finished I couldn't stop thinking about how those 8's could easily cover mid duty on there own, and they would stand no purpose but extra weight when I brought the who rig to a show.

I took a look at the Alpha 6A's like you said, but the bass output is just not deep enough to satisfy my needs in the combo. But, I appreciated the idea, so I kept searching...

I modeled every appropriate 6", 8" and 10" driver, e... I even tested high efficiency 8" subwoofers in my first design, just so that If i went with my design I would have the satisfaction of knowing that it couldn't work as the midrange as well...

After I worked it all out, a pair of Faitals was still up there, but a new contender showed up...

The 18 Sound 6ND430.

I haven't heard much talk about the 18 sound 6ND430. It has a much lower efficiency around 92-93, but 2 or 3 of them, (three not being a problem becuae the amps I am looking at are safe to run at 2 ohms per side.

When I modeled them against a pair of Faital Pro 8pr200's in the same sized box, vented appropriately, 3 18 Sound ND430's have virtually the same maximum spl, within 1 db (at least up to 500 hz, i don't know how to see maximum spl at higher freq. in winISD...) ... but the added benefit is that their -3db point was 4 or 5 hz lower then the faitals.

This interests me because maybe the 6ND430 has more of the attributes in it that make the ND410 so great rather then the faital.

Also, when I modeled two Alpha 6A's against two 18 sound 6ND430's, they also had virtually the same max spl, within .5 db i think. I could possibly only use two of them.

Any thoughts on this driver. IF this works, I wouldn't be hauling around anything that won't be used all of the time. I'd run them as a full range in the combo, then biamped as themid in the Fearful set up.

I am pretty sure at this point that I don't even want the tweeter. I have been testing a lot of cabs lately and almost every time, I have been rolling back the tweeters, in some cases, completely off...

Just seeing what your thoughts are on this.

 

[1n3]

I definetly know what you are getting at. It has been looming in my head since the first time you mentioned using the faital 8pr200's as full range in the combo, and midrange in the headcase with the 1212 sub.

Actually, edwinhurwitz first suggested that speaker. I had no previous knowledge of it.

I really wanted to stick with the 18 sound mid because I have heard such great things. So, I came up with an awesome design with appropriate volume and vents for 2 8 inch faitals as woofers and the 18 sound mid in a two way biamped combo.

However, after i was finished I couldn't stop thinking about how those 8's could easily cover mid duty on there own, and they would stand no purpose but extra weight when I brought the who rig to a show.

Another option: build a headcase/amp with the 6ND410, plus a small woofer cab that latches to the bottom of that, to be detached away from rehearsal. See Sundogue's rig for an example of this.

I took a look at the Alpha 6A's like you said, but the bass output is just not deep enough to satisfy my needs in the combo. But, I appreciated the idea, so I kept searching...

Fair enough... didn't know how much you were willing to compromise on tone with the combo.

... when I modeled two Alpha 6A's against two 18 sound 6ND430's, they also had virtually the same max spl, within .5 db i think. I could possibly only use two of them.

... I am pretty sure at this point that I don't even want the tweeter. I have been testing a lot of cabs lately and almost every time, I have been rolling back the tweeters, in some cases, completely off...

Just seeing what your thoughts are on this.

Of course, you'd be off the fEARful pages again with this. Sensitivity of the 6ND430 is lower than the Alpha 6 - it's down about 5db to the Alpha at 200hz. But it has more power capacity and LF extension to help compensate.

There appears to be a breakup peak around 4k; this probably wouldn't cross over to the tweeter as nicely as the 6ND410, but if you don't want a tweeter, that's moot. No idea how the sound would compare to the 6ND410.

Here again, I'm stretching my expertise and experience. I'd be interested in Passinwind's thoughts on this one.

You're probably aware of this already, but it's worth mentioning... If you have two 6s or 8s doing double-duty, you'd want to have them aligned vertically to maximize horizontal dispersion; will make for a taller box.