Fender Jazz nitro options

[swartzfeger]

Gang,

I really want a Fender Jazz in black nitro. And it looks like it isn't an option:

Classic Series '60s Jazz Bass® Lacquer (3-color sunburst)
Road Worn® '60s Jazz Bass® (3SB or Fiesta Red)
American Original '60s Jazz Bass® (3SB, Candy Apple Red or Olympic White)

No black. :/ In fact, the only black bass nitro option appears to be:

Classic Series '50s Precision Bass Lacquer

I'm not against Ps, but I really want a jazz. Sunburst does nothing for me. I like fiesta red but don't want road worn (I'll do my own dings and belt rash, thanks).

American Original '60s Jazz Bass® -- I'd really, finally, love to have an American Jazz. And I want nitro. But if I'm spending $2k on a jazz, I'd probably just get the USA Geddy.

Looking back at past models, I think the Highway One was nitro but I don't think they came in black either (iirc, candy apple red and a vintage cream (I think)).

So... black nitro jazz. What do I do? Just do the 50s Classic P (more in my price range)? Trade up to an American Original 60s? The candy apple red is gorgeous -- just not black.

Why am I so picky? lol.

 

[swartzfeger]

Also -- I checked the mod shop and custom shop.

One surprise -- the 70s jazz isn't even a base model, which is bull.

Second -- nitro isn't an option, at least not until the master built tier.

So if I wanted to just build a standard 70s pup spacing jazz in black nitro I can't do it.

 

[Dave W]

Look for a used American Vintage 62' Reissue.

 

[swartzfeger]

Look for a used American Vintage 62' Reissue.

Thank you, Dave. Now the eBay/Reverb obsession begins

 

[Dave W]

Thank you, Dave. Now the eBay/Reverb obsession begins

Actually, here's one for sale right now:
For Sale - Fender '62 American Vintage Reissue Jazz Bass AVRI Black with Mint Pickguard

 

[swartzfeger]

Actually, here's one for sale right now:
For Sale - Fender '62 American Vintage Reissue Jazz Bass AVRI Black with Mint Pickguard

Thanks for that. I didn't realize they went for that much $$$. For $1500 I'm probably going to learn to like candy apple red and spend $500 more for a new Jazz (one nice touch with the American Original 60s is the 9.5 radius).

 

[buldog5151bass]

Guitar Re-Ranch - paint it yourself.

 

[hypercarrots]

highway one jazz came in black. i have one.

 

[Midak]

Also -- I checked the mod shop and custom shop.

One surprise -- the 70s jazz isn't even a base model, which is bull.

Second -- nitro isn't an option, at least not until the master built tier.

So if I wanted to just build a standard 70s pup spacing jazz in black nitro I can't do it.

You definitely can - if you are talking about Custom Shop, though.

Nitro is standard on most builds; for vintage-style basses, they only feature one model-platform, the 1964.
The whole procedure goes more or less this way: you talk to an authorized CS dealer about the build you want and you get down to all specs; then, he quotes your order to Fender CS - should everything be ok, your order is placed and you wait for your bass.

I got my CS '64 Jazz this way.
If you really want a Fender Jazz and money is not a problem, a Teambuilt CS is as good as you can get.

 

[swartzfeger]

Thanks for that Midak... I may just go ahead and contact them. How much $USD did your CS '64 cost?

 

[Craig4003]

If you actually want to understand the truth about nitro and how it compares to other finishes, this article by luthier Brian Howard is well worth reading:

Brian Howard's guitar building & repair blog: The End of the Nitrocellulose Lacquer Era

 

[Jim C]

Great read.
And that's why we need to go back to brush on Shellac, which is made from bugs so you know that will be good

 

[Midak]

Thanks for that Midak... I may just go ahead and contact them. How much $USD did your CS '64 cost?

Yes, give it a try - worse case scenario is that you are not gonna order one.

I ordered mine through Thomann at September 2014 for 2,519€=3,260$. As far as specs are considered, I wanted the 1964 base-model as it is, plus a quartersawn neck that was a small upcharge - Fender CS necks are most of the time quartersawn by default, so even if I didn't have stated it in my order I would have end with one either way; I just wanted to be 101% certain.

And, in January 2015 I got it:

 

[swartzfeger]

If you actually want to understand the truth about nitro and how it compares to other finishes, this article by luthier Brian Howard is well worth reading:

Great read.
And that's why we need to go back to brush on Shellac, which is made from bugs so you know that will be good

Agreed on the great read, but these kinds of articles irk a little bit too -- I've lost count of the times I've read an article of "nitro doesn't sound better" when people ask re: nitro finishes.

I know it's still a 'thing' that some people believe that nitro breathes better; whatever. It may, it may not. If people want to believe it does, so be it, let 'em have their nitro/placebo finish. And completely anecdotal, but it seems like the nitro breathes better angle has been pushed back so hard/often that I don't notice as many people making claims about nitro's superior tone. Then again, I don't hang out (much) at places like TGP or forums that get into hardcore period specifics with guitars.

Some of us *do* want a finish that wears more easily... and I think that's ok! I in no way believe nitro will fundamentally improve or change my dream Jazz build's tone. I do believe over time it will have the desired visual aesthetic. Kudos to Brian Howard, but I'm not looking at nitro as a means of easy finish repair or tone mojo mumbo jumbo. Mr. Howard's read seems aimed squarely at the "nitro is superior" stuff (and he's probably right on all counts).

And I completely get the modern nitro isn't making your build "period correct." The EPA has seen to that. Yes, maybe one specific finish or odd shellac may still exist somewhere in a remote warehouse, but chances are slim (as we've been reminded ad nauseam) that getting an authentic vintage nitro finish would prove difficult at best. I haven't seen anyone that's spent more than a few minutes reading about nitro suffer the delusion they could have something period correct.

No expert here, but I've read decent bit on old nitro vs new, fullerplast, plasticizers, curing, binders, etc. From what I've seen, modern nitros still age in a way I find more aesthetically pleasing.

Maybe my reactionary rant to the "nitro isn't better" reactionary articles is misplaced... do armies of players still think nitro sounds better?

Also! Brian has two great article on air dry lacquers and sealers worth checking out for those interested in the topic.

And, in January 2015 I got it:

That's *beautiful*, Midak -- how has the QS neck behaved in your Mediterranean climate?

 

[Jim C]

No scientist here but my observation is that up to the late 60's finishes were reaonably thin.
The some how we got instruments that may have been dipped in polyurethane starting mid to late 70's.
Does adding density to the finish not let the wood ring true. Does wood even ring or matter to a pup?
Does the nitro breathe? No idea but maybe it matters.
Wants something that doesn't look as old or beat up? Nitro's your man.
What do you run in a Funny Car? Right on, Nitro.
OTOH
Most feel that older basses sound better.
Is it the age of the wood, the finish, the pups, the weakend magnets in the pups?
What about fingerboards or skunk stripes?

I gave up trying to figure it out. Just buy instruments that sound good out of the box to eliniate disapointments.

They say that the air leaving the Fender finish shop is cleaner than the air going in.
Last new poly finish I've seen on a Fender looks perfect; like that CAR J in Greece!

 

[tjh]

highway one jazz came in black. i have one...

… yup, was just about to add this, and then I saw your post … could be VERY tough to find, as it had a relatively short run … and, even though they call the Hwy One finish 'satin', the black P I had was more of a 'flat' finish than the several other Hwy 1 and Ones that came through here ... but it can be buffed out to more of a gloss with some patience …

Edit to add a photo ...

 

[hypercarrots]

… yup, was just about to add this, and then I saw your post … could be VERY tough to find, as it had a relatively short run … and, even though they call the Hwy One finish 'satin', the black P I had was more of a 'flat' finish than the several other Hwy 1 and Ones that came through here ... but it can be buffed out to more of a gloss with some patience …

Edit to add a photo ...

I did that to mine too and I’ve tried repeatedly to add a photo of it but it keeps erroring

 

[Midak]

Some of us *do* want a finish that wears more easily... and I think that's ok! I in no way believe nitro will fundamentally improve or change my dream Jazz build's tone. I do believe over time it will have the desired visual aesthetic. Kudos to Brian Howard, but I'm not looking at nitro as a means of easy finish repair or tone mojo mumbo jumbo. Mr. Howard's read seems aimed squarely at the "nitro is superior" stuff (and he's probably right on all counts).

That's exactly why I prefer nitro finishes, too, especially on Fender instruments - because it will age the right way to my eyes. Smell is nice, too.

That's *beautiful*, Midak -- how has the QS neck behaved in your Mediterranean climate?

It is pretty stable - I do a service every year around autumn and that's it. The first time I had it checked (and that was at late 2016) the tech said it that the neck has "memory", meaning that he tried to lower the relief and for 3-4 days the neck kept going back to where it was all this time - the next try was the last, as the neck settled to the desired relief. At the last service (late 2017) everything was fine, no problems or unexpected behaviors. I have to admit that if the relief changes during the year (which is quite reasonable for any bass), it does at a very slow pace; I don't notice any discomfort playing it throughout the year. What is more, it keeps tune very uniformly regardless how long you haven't check it.

 

[swartzfeger]

Most feel that older basses sound better.

I've been thinking about this, and while I think nostalgia/sentimentality has us pining for old and vintage instruments I wonder how much of it has to do with practicality. Probably a lot of junk was made back then too... I just don't think the crap or average basses lasted long due to necks warping and people getting rid of the garbage they didn't want to mess with.

Those rare basses where everything came together perfectly -- well behaved necks, perfect joints, etc -- probably were appreciated more, modded less, less likely to be sold, etc.

At least in theory. But I want to believe that pre-CBS Fenders were better just *because*.

I owned a '83 (Fullerton) P Bass that was absolutely awesome with a great neck. Would've kept it in a heartbeat but I'm not really a P guy. If it was a jazz I would've never let it leave the stable.

 

[swartzfeger]

… yup, was just about to add this, and then I saw your post … could be VERY tough to find, as it had a relatively short run … and, even though they call the Hwy One finish 'satin', the black P I had was more of a 'flat' finish than the several other Hwy 1 and Ones that came through here ... but it can be buffed out to more of a gloss with some patience …

Edit to add a photo ...

They must be rare, because the only two black highways I've seen have been posted here! Haven't looked seriously though, but out in the wild I've only seen the reds and the creams.

That's exactly why I prefer nitro finishes, too, especially on Fender instruments - because it will age the right way to my eyes. Smell is nice, too.

It is pretty stable - I do a service every year around autumn and that's it.

Thanks Midak, this is very helpful!