dont think so. the cab tuning is done according to the driver(s)/needs/goals.
and/but
cabs (and ports in them) and drivers got their own characteristics.
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and/but
cabs (and ports in them) and drivers got their own characteristics.
Let’s get this straight:
Does changing the driver to one of identical size (so same internal volume for the cabinet) change the tuning of an enclosure?
Not the performance, not the ideal tuning, not the preferred tuning. The tuning as the box sits. Does the driver affect the existing tuning of an enclosure? I can't think of any way that could possibly happen. What am I missing here?
Speaker size is only one parameter and really the least important for tuning. Different speakers have different T/S parameters requiring a certain size cab and port tuning that works with all those parameters.
Which is why for anyone to claim they prefer one size speaker over another because they think a certain size sounds better isn't true at all.
Let’s get this straight:
Does changing the driver to one of identical size (so same internal volume for the cabinet) change the tuning of an enclosure?
Not the performance, not the ideal tuning, not the preferred tuning. The tuning as the box sits.
Yes or no?
short: no
technically: yes
different speakers got different physical dimensions. hence the cab "size", so the tuning will eventually differ.
in the real world You tune Your cab for a use case to the speaker You wanna use. see: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0270/8665/1462/files/Basslite_S2012_cab.pdf
pls note e. g. "Cone Displacement (mm/Hz) with 125 watts " for a sealed and vented cabs. exactly the same speaker.
also pls. note "System Impedance (ohms/Hz)" which will differ speaker to speaker in the same cab
(and cab to cab for the same speaker)same goes the other way, different 12" speakers got different curves and WILL sound different in the same cab.
(yes, I own a rumble 100 with a deltalite and one with the stock speaker, also a dfferent cab with the stock r100 speaker in it. all sound different. for reasons.)Then You put the same speaker/cab/amp to another place in the room: will sound different.
Then You move 25 cms: will sound different.
Then You bring the rig to another room/venue: will sound different.
hope this helps
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It might if the speaker is drastically different, like a very flat driver vs. a very deep cone, or a lightweight basket and small magnet vs. a heavy basket and an outsized magnet.
All these would change the internal net volume of the cab and would have a potentially significant impact on port tuning.
What‘s going on here? If you‘ve got all the answers what is the purpose of your questions? I‘m not here to lecture you. You already have the answer on how to determine the tuning frequency of the cab. I had the impression you were asking about simulation of the existing speaker for which you need the T/S parameters. I will refer you to the internet for the answer to your post. And my last advice is to be a little less offensive. My bet is that the answers will start pouring with a little better behavior.It's my understanding that the box tuning itself is not dependent on the driver. Example from the Rumble 40 discussion:
I have a used Rumble 40 incoming and will try out some other drivers and port tunings like you did. Do you still have your notes concerning net internal volume and the tuning of the stock ports with both open and with one closed? If you have those I can start the simulations even before the combo gets here....
Here is the info: 1.12 cf, 74 Hz w. 2 ports, 55 Hz w. 1 port. Note that once you have your amp, you can back calculate the tuning knowing the box volume and port dimensions (inside diameter and length).
I found that while modeling allowed me to determine if a...
Is AstroSonic wrong or lying here?
Before you lecture me, I'm aware that the -preferred- tuning of an enclosure might be dependent on the driver and other parameters (use case), but simply calculating the existing port tuning doesn't require any driver parameters. No?
short: no
technically: yes
different speakers got different physical dimensions. hence the cab "size", so the tuning will eventually differ.
in the real world You tune Your cab for a use case to the speaker You wanna use. see: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0270/8665/1462/files/Basslite_S2012_cab.pdf
pls note e. g. "Cone Displacement (mm/Hz) with 125 watts " for a sealed and vented cabs. exactly the same speaker.
also pls. note "System Impedance (ohms/Hz)" which will differ speaker to speaker in the same cab
same goes the other way, different 12" speakers got different curves and WILL sound different in the same cab.
Then You put the same speaker/cab/amp to another place in the room: will sound different.
Then You move 25 cms: will sound different.
Then You bring the rig to another room/venue: will sound different.
hope this helps
Let me repeat for a third time, because apparently I have not been clear:
Let’s get this straight:
Does changing the driver to one of identical size (so same internal volume for the cabinet) change the tuning of an enclosure?
Not the performance, not the ideal tuning, not the preferred tuning. The tuning as the box sits.
Yes or no?
Here's where you mentioned it here in The Club, Shiro, and got Rumbler #1832:
And here's where you mentioned it in another thread:
Yes, the Rumble 500 combo can get quite loud! Here's another post you made here in The Club:
Disappointed that the Rumble 500 combo is the only amp you need? Oh, you kill me, Shiro!! 
But, back to your post today ... ...
You could try separating the combo and cab horizontally to get a better idea as to which is louder.
Ah, yes, you used the approximate true flat settings for the Rumble! It's amazing how many people simply go to "all 12s" and judge an amp's tone by that single setting.
Thanks for the review/update. Glad to hear they work well together, though not surprised.
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You are trolling...
No! And Yes!
No cab without a speaker is functional.
Different speakers have different physical characteristics and they both are part of the system. You cannot interpret the system (measure volume) with the cab alone with no speaker in it.Cause then You are making a cajon.
(been there, done that)This was my last time explaining the same sh*t to You.
Hope this helps!I don't have any answers. I read AstroSonic's thread first and assumed he was correct in his assertions:
That the Rumble 40 cabinet has a tuning of X with 2 ports, Y with 1 port - and it's independent of the t/s parameters of the driver. That cabinet tuning is only dependent on geometry.
I don't know this stuff or him, but if the Rumble 40 works that way then I figured maybe the 100 also does. So I asked if anyone knew those numbers for the 100... and was promptly told that those numbers are not only useless but impossible to even know.
Multiple people seem to think that AstroSonic is a liar. I don't know, I'm just a dumb guitarist. I would like to know who to believe: folks today or AstroSonic.
And let me repeat.
Same speaker size is irrelevant. A different speaker of the same size will most likely require a different ideal internal volume or different ports, depending on the actual T/S specs.
The same speaker size only means you can (typically) use the same baffle without replacing it or cutting it out bigger.
Nobody ever said AstroSonic is a liar. You are the only one suggesting that.
That's not asking for "numbers", but repeated yelling and trolling.
What's the number that You wanna know? Cause the answer is 42... when You repeatedly ask the wrong question....
If You want to measure the freq. response with ports open/closed (like I did after a speaker change), then do so! (hint: it needs a speaker in the cab
)Or go the "lazy" route: use Your ears!
Hope this helps!
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I must be the dumbest woman on the planet.
Let’s try again:
AstroSonic claims to have measured or modeled a volume and tuning of the Rumble 40 cabinet with the stock porting and with one port blocked, and that these numbers are independent of the t/s parameters of the driver (but technically dependent on the physical geometry of the driver). He got this result:
My first question was whether anyone knew and was willing to share that same information for the Rumble 100. That's what I actually looking for...
But in response, I was told that those numbers are impossible to know without the t/s parameters of the driver... So now I'm just confused. Does the cabinet have a tuning or not? Empty subwoofer cabinets are commonly advertised with both an internal volume and a tuning number in Hz - what is that number?
Here's an example, they say approximately for the internal volume because it's technically dependent on driver geometry... But they state an Fc of 62 Hz:
How can they advertise a frequency without knowing the driver t/s parameters?
Let’s try again:
AstroSonic claims to have measured or modeled a volume and tuning of the Rumble 40 cabinet with the stock porting and with one port blocked, and that these numbers are independent of the t/s parameters of the driver (but technically dependent on the physical geometry of the driver). He got this result:
My first question was whether anyone knew and was willing to share that same information for the Rumble 100. That's what I actually looking for...
But in response, I was told that those numbers are impossible to know without the t/s parameters of the driver... So now I'm just confused. Does the cabinet have a tuning or not? Empty subwoofer cabinets are commonly advertised with both an internal volume and a tuning number in Hz - what is that number?
Here's an example, they say approximately for the internal volume because it's technically dependent on driver geometry... But they state an Fc of 62 Hz:
Goldwood E-10SP 10" Single Vented Box Speaker Cabinet
Goldwood E-10SP 10" Single Vented Box Speaker CabinetGoldwood's E-10SP 10" ported box is CNC cut from 5/8" MDF and glued air tight, producing a strong, tight, rock-solid box, then ported to extended low frequency response. High quality, black polyester carpet adds the finishing touch. Fc = 62...
www.parts-express.com
How can they advertise a frequency without knowing the driver t/s parameters?
I assume You did NOT consult the pdf I linked to You some comments earlier from a speaker manufacturer's cab design examples with measurement graphs for the SAME 12" driver... assume You were fixiated on some yes/no shouting.
Fc only means cutoff freq. There is a LOT more to a speaker/cab design/characteristics. Please see above.
As for freqs and what matters for a bass tone, see:
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Reading comprehension does not seem to be one of your strong traits. Nobody said or suggested that you need the T/S parameters of the speaker for the tuning frequency of a cab. @M-Mittlestead gave you a recipe to do that, i.e. salt or rice test.I must be the dumbest woman on the planet.
Let’s try again:
AstroSonic claims to have measured or modeled a volume and tuning of the Rumble 40 cabinet with the stock porting and with one port blocked, and that these numbers are independent of the t/s parameters of the driver (but technically dependent on the physical geometry of the driver). He got this result:
My first question was whether anyone knew and was willing to share that same information for the Rumble 100. That's what I actually looking for...
But in response, I was told that those numbers are impossible to know without the t/s parameters of the driver... So now I'm just confused. Does the cabinet have a tuning or not? Empty subwoofer cabinets are commonly advertised with both an internal volume and a tuning number in Hz - what is that number?
Here's an example, they say approximately for the internal volume because it's technically dependent on driver geometry... But they state an Fc of 62 Hz:
Goldwood E-10SP 10" Single Vented Box Speaker Cabinet
Goldwood E-10SP 10" Single Vented Box Speaker CabinetGoldwood's E-10SP 10" ported box is CNC cut from 5/8" MDF and glued air tight, producing a strong, tight, rock-solid box, then ported to extended low frequency response. High quality, black polyester carpet adds the finishing touch. Fc = 62...www.parts-express.com
How can they advertise a frequency without knowing the driver t/s parameters?
He said exactly that?
And so did you:
I'm still just trying to understand the basics here. Does anything besides cabinet volume (which is partly defined by the exact physical shape of the driver) and port geometry affect the tuning or not?
Gentlemen, and lady, please! Can we all please just take a breath for a moment? ... Then let's please endeavor to be more civil. 
I regret that I don't have any technical expertise in this area to contribute, but ... ... ...
I believe that, based on Astrosonic's quote that "once you have your amp, you can back calculate the tuning knowing the box volume and port dimensions (inside diameter and length)", Ms. Valerie is simply asking if anyone has already done that for the Rumble 100, yes or no?
If the answer is "yes," then I assume she'd like to get the data in similar form to Astrosonic's "1.12 cf, 74 Hz w. 2 ports, 55 Hz w. 1 port" he gave for the Rumble 40.
If the answer is "no," it doesn't seem she was looking for any further information, such as how to do it herself, or other considerations in cabinet design, ... ... yet.
Can we please just restart this discussion, in a more civil manner now, with only this point, please?
I regret that I don't have any technical expertise in this area to contribute, but ... ... ...
I believe that, based on Astrosonic's quote that "once you have your amp, you can back calculate the tuning knowing the box volume and port dimensions (inside diameter and length)", Ms. Valerie is simply asking if anyone has already done that for the Rumble 100, yes or no?
If the answer is "yes," then I assume she'd like to get the data in similar form to Astrosonic's "1.12 cf, 74 Hz w. 2 ports, 55 Hz w. 1 port" he gave for the Rumble 40.
If the answer is "no," it doesn't seem she was looking for any further information, such as how to do it herself, or other considerations in cabinet design, ... ... yet.
Can we please just restart this discussion, in a more civil manner now, with only this point, please?
