Fender: Vintage or Custom Shop?

[PJ Muzikmansky]

It’s always been my understanding that there was a steep decline in quality during the CBS years, but I’m open to arguments.

I think that's the general consensus, though I think it's fair to say the decline was probably more gradual rather than steep.

My own experience: I've played excellent examples of early 70's fenders, both jazz and precision, and this particular '75 P was untouchable. On the other hand, my '78 jazz was woeful.

 

[Ace Of Bass]

I’ve never owned a pre CBS , but i did own a ‘65 that was one of the worst Basses I’ve ever owned…it was soul crushing-ly bad…Every Custom Shop Bass I’ve ever owned has been excellent…the P bass I have now has a hall of fame neck…those guys do great work for certain…I’d much rather buy a used one at a used price though, to be honest, but a new one will still cost far less than a pre CBS…if I had the means and the time Id hunt down a pre CBS myself…when you get a good one, there’s nothing like it..but the Custom Shop stuff is pretty damn close..

 

[Picton]

A vintage piece is more of an heirloom than the CS piece will ever be, in terms of future value.

On the flipside, a CS piece should play better than the vintage piece. But this depends on how picky you are. I'm not very finicky about setup or neck shape, though I do have preferences about things like fret sprout (which I can fix myself).

My solution would be to find a vintage piece that plays like I want it to play. In fact, that WAS my solution, with my CBS Jazz, and I got a birth-year bass into the bargain. Win-win-win. I can't imagine being any more satisfied with an FCS bass than I am with that '75, but the FCS products do look beautiful.

CBS pieces are still pretty affordable. I'd not have wanted to spend what a pre-CBS costs.

 

[Rob1957]

A pre-cbs fender if you can find the right instrument
My 59 pbass was a player and always had been so I treated her like a gigging instrument

 

[Bill Murray]

Two very different pursuits.

A vintage fender will only grow in value but is something that would be best kept in climate controlled storage which would also leave it unplayed for the most part. Yea, you could play and gig it but I wouldn’t if it took me years to save for the purchase and was trying to make money off it in the long run. It’s a collectors item. You’ll also be at the mercy of 50-70 year old wood and whatever kind of damage/use/refinishing/replacements the instrument has undergone.

The Custom Shop bass is the total opposite. It could grow some value but it likely won’t. However, you get to pick every little detail about the bass. I know a handful of players who own custom guitars and basses and know a builder in there custom shop, the guys building these are the best of the best. You’ll have a perfect brand new fender bass and it’ll feature all of your personal favorite touches. You could probably have your daughters name engraved on the bridge or neck plate too. It’s a bass you could play all the time and not over-stress about

Custom Shop is the route I would go, but either way you’ll have something cool.

 

[Killing Floor]

Totally a personal choice. If you have the luxury to make this choice you are in a happy state. Both are obviously great options.

Here's how I would make that choice if I was considering (I do have the means if I plan for it and I am chasing a pre CBS but it has to be the right one).

Pre-CBS is basically a museum piece. Play in home and studio but would never see a gig and even a rehearsal is 50-50 whether I'd want to utilize it.

CS is "new" so even if it is NOS and/or aged it is still something I'd feel safe bringing out, playing, using as a tool.

It's really that simple. I want a 1966 and I could make that happen. But when I get one it won't be heavily used.
It will hang on my wall and I will enjoy it.

Gig type basses are covered so I don't "need" it.

YMMV

 

[dalkowski]

I want it to be something super special that holds some value

Start with used instruments then -- unless you beat the bag out of it, it won't lose value. Any new instrument automatically depreciates (30-40%, YMMV) once you take possession. As far as appreciation in value is concerned, possibly but never massive.

And don't necessarily turn your nose up at newer-than-pre-CBS — there are nice 70s examples out there (I think my P is one of them) which assuredly will be "vintage" by the time you pass it to your daughter. Think quality over cachet. (I personally would be tickled to have one of these: )

OR:




If investment value is a consideration, then buy some Amazon stock now and hold it for her. ROI will be orders of magnitude greater than that of any musical instrument. Good luck, you're a great dad.

 

[WoodyJ]

I believe that Vintage vs. CS boils down to a few factors. Basically, it depends on the individual bass. There are great vintage Fenders and some not-so great ones. When I started playing bass in the mid-'70's, vintage Fenders were just "old basses" and not worth a lot. My '57 Precision has collector provenance now but I only paid $750 for it in 1980. It is a great bass but when I was working in a music store years later, some of the older pre-CBS Fenders that came through the door were not so great. Same with older Fender guitars. They were treated as tools of the trade which wasn't necessarily a bad thing. That is what they were built for!

Over the years I ended up with three Custom Shop basses and each of them are spectacularly good. What I like better about the CS ones compared to vintage is that the electronics and pickups are new and generally better than what came in the oldies, along with better finishes and craftsmanship on the neck and body. The closest thing to a CS Fender were the "New American Vintage" ones that were introduced in 2012 and replaced by the not-quite-as-original American Original series in 2018. IMO, outside of the CS Fenders, the NAV's were the best of the best, IMO.

 

[Iristone]

I'd buy a working-class instrument and mod it to my specs, but if limited to bourgeoisie instruments I'd choose Custom Shop because it will be slightly cheaper and in a better condition than a vintage Fender.

 

[Iristone]

Reminds me of a story: when I was buying my Thunderbird, someone buying a Custom Shop said he felt sorry to play something that expensive. If it were me, I'd feel sorry NOT to play a guitar I spent ¥30 000 on...

 

[Ric Vice]

Pre-CBS, from what I think it's your long term objective.

It will gain value, the CS will loose value.

While I hope for the most part that this is true, as I actually own a 1959 Sunburst Precision Bass I'm wondering if we've reached a point where the 1957-59 P Bass has topped out.

Just my take of course

 

[LeFunk Machine]

The American Original series will do the job. If you use it and not ever take care of it, it will most likely look very custom-shop like in 15-25 years.

 

[JimmyM]

I'd go CS for one reason and one reason only...you can't get pre-CBS basses with a 9 1/2" neck radius or graphite strips in the neck. The graphite isn't a deal breaker but I do think it helps with dead spots. The rounder 7 1/4" neck radius is a total deal breaker, though.

 

[P. Aaron]

I’d rather order new. Used, especially searching for an item that has scarcity involved reduces the choices.

Either is a series of trade-offs but, being able to order the color, accessories, and condition are pretty compelling reasons to buy or order new.

 

[Ace Of Bass]

I think most FCS Basses probably sound as good as any pre CBS bass you’d put it up against…if you’re looking for more of an investment piece that you can pull out and play every once in a while, carefully (VERY carefully) go vintage…if you want a phenomenal player that is the best bass Fender makes, go FCS…I would find a used one for the best value you can find one normally for not too much more than a new American Oro cost and it’s a much better bass IMO..…also don’t limit yourself to pre CBS if you’re looking for a sweet player…my ‘76 is a far better bass than the AVRI ‘75 that is supposed to be the newer better version of that bass…it’s not and it’s not even close..that ‘76 kills…just another example of a great bass being a great bass regardless of when it was made..

 

[Nedmundo]

One factor in favor of new Custom Shop for me: the warranty. Of course a vintage bass will have proven itself by now and should have a stable neck, but I usually buy new partly because I've benefited considerably from having warranties on my Fender Jazz and formerly-owned G&L L-1500, both of which needed new necks. I'd be much more comfortable having a warranty on such an expensive bass, and like others I wouldn't want to gig with a vintage bass.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

I’ve been thinking about long term gear goals, since I’ve basically reached a point where I have all the different kinds of basses I’m into (crazy, right?). I have a checking account that I use solely for music stuff. I figure I can start saving and in my 10-20 years pick up something super cool. I’m pretty much a Fender guy, so that’s the direction I’m thinking of going.

So if you guys could have one high end Fender, what would you choose: a Custom Shop or something pre-CBS?
I realize that if I go the vintage route we are probably talking much longer to save, but this would be the Bass my daughter would eventually inherit. So I want it to be something super special that holds some value, whether she plays or not (and luckily for me she’s shown a lot of interest in music and lights up whenever I show her the Daisy Rock line).

if you want a once in a lifetime bass, have one custom built for you by a qualified luthier to you specifications. I’m pretty certain you can find one that will build you a better Fender Bass than what Fender will.

 

[BioDriver]

I'd sooner hack together a parts bass than go either route. IMO the price for pre-CBS basses is excessive for what you get, and I've never been blown away by any of the FCS basses I've played (horror CS and QC stories notwithstanding).

if you want a once in a lifetime bass, have one custom built for you by a qualified luthier to you specifications. I’m pretty certain you can find one that will build you a better Fender Bass than what Fender will.

And for cheaper!

 

[Bass4ThePublic]

I’d buy a pre cbs or very early cbs. I’d probably go for a stripped or refinned P or J to save money and send it to John Kallas or MJT to put a historically accurate finish on.

 

[Ric Vice]

I believe that Vintage vs. CS boils down to a few factors. Basically, it depends on the individual bass. There are great vintage Fenders and some not-so great ones. When I started playing bass in the mid-'70's, vintage Fenders were just "old basses" and not worth a lot. My '57 Precision has collector provenance now but I only paid $750 for it in 1980. It is a great bass but when I was working in a music store years later, some of the older pre-CBS Fenders that came through the door were not so great. Same with older Fender guitars. They were treated as tools of the trade which wasn't necessarily a bad thing. That is what they were built for!

Good words, for sure. Those basses were made in a factory, before the advent of CCR machines even existed. So there are bound to be basses that aren't that great. I'm not one to buy an instrument for it's provenance. If it sounds good and plays great then that's what I'm looking for regardless of it's age. To the OP's question

it's "all about the bass". There are lots of Fender inspired instrument's that sound better and play easier. Just my take of course.