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Fill the room w/ small cab???

G

greaseball

Dec 1, 2005
20
0
#1
I'm gonna be playing medium sized bars/clubs with no PA support. Currently using Yorkeville XM200 w/ 1x15 ext cab. Sounds great onstage but muddy in the room. Running everything flat except the sansamp pre running through the front (set on 'SVT'). I would love to invest in an SVT and 810 cab but can't afford it right now. Any suggstions on a small cab to add to this set-up that will get my sound into the room better? The XM cabs are front ported and are each 8 ohms. If I added another 8 ohm cab would this help with sound projection? Should I try using rear ported, or non-ported cabs instead? What can I do short of taking out a mortgage on the house to buy that SVT? Thanks in advance for any responses.:confused:
 
#2
From what I remember the SVT setting on the sansamp suggests having the blend control all the way up. Way too mid scooped IMO. I usually have my blend control at 12-1 o'clock which adds in some mids. Less boomy, more midrange growl. As ar as cabs go, I don't know much about your setup so I really can't suggest a cab. Bag End 15 are really know to cut through a mix an can be found used around $300 or so. I'm using my G&L L-1505 with mysansamp/power amp set up through One,two, or three Aguilar GS112 cabs. I can't imagine a playing situation or bass tone that my setup couldn't handle.
 
#3
greaseball said:
I'm gonna be playing medium sized bars/clubs with no PA support. Currently using Yorkeville XM200 w/ 1x15 ext cab. Sounds great onstage but muddy in the room. Running everything flat except the sansamp pre running through the front (set on 'SVT'). I would love to invest in an SVT and 810 cab but can't afford it right now. Any suggstions on a small cab to add to this set-up that will get my sound into the room better? The XM cabs are front ported and are each 8 ohms. If I added another 8 ohm cab would this help with sound projection? Should I try using rear ported, or non-ported cabs instead? What can I do short of taking out a mortgage on the house to buy that SVT? Thanks in advance for any responses.:confused:
Click to expand...

You should have got the XM200 with the 2-10s. When I tried the 2 of them side by side , the 1-15 had a good sound up close, as you say, but muddy and indistinct further away. I'm normally not a fan of 10" speaker cabinets and prefer 15s, but in this case I did prefer the 10s. If you can't trade in for the 2-10 model, you could add Yorkville's 2-10 extension cabinet. You'll get a noticeable improvement plus some increase in power. Other than the 1-15 being a bit muddy, it's a great amp for the money. It should last a long time.

I'd also lose the SansAmp. Or else use less extreme settings.
 
#6
FunkyLemz said:
Maybe some EA speakers can help- a wizzy
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The problem is that his combo will only allow a single 8 ohm extention speaker and the Wizzy is 4 ohms. That is not a lot of power and you will need an efficient speaker. I too would look for other EQ settings. For a more efficient 8 ohm cab that will cut through and not break the bank the Bag End 15s are hard to beat. I have no idea how it will sound with the speaker in your combo though. I would be tempted to unplug the combo speaker and plug the amp directly into the Bag End. A single one would probably be louder than your current set up in any case, and two would be significantly louder.
 
#10
Since your stage rig sounds good where it's supposed to , on stage, use what you've got and attack the problem at the source: get your PA up to snuff. The best band in the world will sound like crap through a crap PA. Going with a larger stage rig only drives up stage volume and if anything might make the sound in the room worse.
 
#12
Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. In answer to some of your responses, There's nothing I can do about the lack of PA support. I need to supply the bottom end for the room. I'm using the Sansamp because it sounds excellent going throught the front end of the XM200, which doesn't sound so good on it's own imho. I did not realize that I could cut back the blend on the sansamp to clean things up, and I appreciate that thought. I will see how it works out. I'm also going to look into adding a 2x10 and see if that helps. Does anyone think a Schroeder 10/10 would be an efficient enough cab to add here? Do ya think it would carry a small/med room without PA support? I wish there was a music store in my area where I could go to audition some of these options ie: Bag End, Schroeder, Epi, etc. but the best I can get around here is the usual Peavey, Hartke, Ampeg, Fender. Again, Thanks in ADVANCE FOR ALL RESPONSES.
 
#13
greaseball said:
There's nothing I can do about the lack of PA support.
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Yes there is. Own it. Bass players have a history of being the most technically oriented and gear conscious members of the band. As long as you have to carry the biggest pieces anyway better they be PA rather than bass cabs. A bass player who owns, and can run, a PA is never out of work.
 
#14
billfitzmaurice said:
Yes there is. Own it. Bass players have a history of being the most technically oriented and gear conscious members of the band. As long as you have to carry the biggest pieces anyway better they be PA rather than bass cabs. A bass player who owns, and can run, a PA is never out of work.
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Amen brother, amen.

Yep, i'm guilty of frequently telling others to have rigs up to the job, and i don't retract, but the PA is where it's at. I just did sound last night, and fortunately i got the BP to turn down his terrible sounding amp and put him thru the mains to great effect. Heck, you can get work running other people's PA systems (like i did last night). If you own and can run a good PA, AND can play bass you will have to turn down a lot more gigs than you accept.

As far as the sans amp, i reccomend having the blend at about 9 o'clock (yes, almost off). also try starting with the tone controls on the SA flat. They can sound great, but they scoop the heck out of your mids even when set "flat". SVT? they sound great, but unless you're planning to play a lot of 5,000 seater gigs dont get an 8x10 cab. IMHO. I fill plenty of rooms with a 15 and a 12 running 300-600 watts, a lot of gigs are fine with a 15 and 200 watts or so depending upon the effeciency and voicing of the cab in question.
 
#15
I would go with a rear ported 210 8 ohm cab. I personally find 15's kinda muddy and a 210 can really bring some sparkle to your sound. I currently run a 4 ohm 210 SWR Goliath Jr II with my SWR 550X. That is 500 watts into one 210 cab and I have yet to be short of what I need to fill any room. I would like to have a 410 or a 212 cab to push a luittl more air but am not in too big of a hurry to carry around a bigger cab as of yet.
 
#16
billfitzmaurice said:
Yes there is. Own it. Bass players have a history of being the most technically oriented and gear conscious members of the band. As long as you have to carry the biggest pieces anyway better they be PA rather than bass cabs. A bass player who owns, and can run, a PA is never out of work.
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Very true about being technically oriented, good point about having a decent PA too, I would consider it the singers job to have the proper gear to amplify their instrument (their voice) but for some reason it doesn't always happen that way. Anyway, for a bass specific solution, try adding an 8ohm 2-10 to your 115, look used or less expensive, you don't really need a high-end 210 with deep bass response, should help clear up the mids/highs though, Might try turning down your deep bass a little, a lot of times what sounds good on stage can be boomy out in the room, likewise what sounds good out where the audience is may be a little thin or middy sounding when standing next to your amp.
 
#17
"I would consider it the singers job to have the proper gear to amplify their instrument (their voice) but for some reason it doesn't always happen that way."

that misses the point.

good PA's amplify all instruments. Individual cabs are for stage monitoring / acheiving "your" tone.

sadly, as an amatuer, this isnt reality for me... and many others i am sure.
 
#19
billfitzmaurice said:
They're too busy with more important things after the gig to tear down the rig. Hadn't you noticed?
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heh, an aside.

a very popular local CT college band which will remain nameless has a lead singer who also performs in another heavier band (which shall also remain nameless). On of the nights that my GP and i were doing sound for them in the heavier band configuration I was carrying a huge sub. He was near the door talking to a girl (probably trying to score as it was the end of the night). I asked him if he would mind opening the door for me. He looked at me with a look of disgust and said "can't you see that I'm busy??????" It took every ounce of professionalism I had to refrain from inserting that subwoofer into his body via an exit orifice. :smug:
 
#20
billfitzmaurice said:
Since your stage rig sounds good where it's supposed to , on stage, use what you've got and attack the problem at the source: get your PA up to snuff. The best band in the world will sound like crap through a crap PA. Going with a larger stage rig only drives up stage volume and if anything might make the sound in the room worse.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Your gear is going to sound different in every room, on every stage. Boomy one night, another clear as a bell. Some rooms are long. Some narrow. Some have carpeting. Some have concrete floors, hollow wooden stages, etc. If you can find an amp that will consistently deliver the same tone 50 feet out from the stage every night, please pm me. Room acoustics will always challenge your FOH sound.

If you don't want to go through a board, use gear that has flexible EQ and perhaps an outboard eq pedal.

My CHF $.02
 

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