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Double Bass First bass?

davidchampoux

Supporting Member
Dec 2, 2008
919
552
I'm a pro electric bass player for 25 years, and lately, I've had many friends/bands that asked me to play the upright for misc gigs. While at a certain period of my life I've been a good fretless player, I still don't have experience at all with an upright. There's a friend of mine who will give me some basic starting lessons, how to hold the bass, etc. Now about the bass, I want to buy new. I've found 3 contenders locally (prices are CAD):

1) Eastman 85. Under $1800
2) Christopher DB 303T, $2500
3) Eastman Quenoil WITH full setup by a local TOP luthier+custom bridge+perfect neck adjusment+good strings+case at $3600

The goal is to have a good instrument that I will like to play and will deliver a clean and defined sound. I also plan to get a Fishman Full Circle pickup.

Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks for your help!
 
Welcome to the dark side!

It's not simply a matter of getting a few basic lessons and running out to do a gig. The DB and BG are related, but very different instruments. They demand different techniques and styles of play. You will need some time to adapt and that adaptation includes building muscle and hand-strength. The potential for injury should not be underestimated. If you injure yourself, then you likely won't be playing BG either. I assume that, if you're being asked to play the DB, then those asking want you to achieve what they know to be the sound of a DB. It's easy to spot a BG player who just grabbed a DB and went at it. I hope that won't be you.

As for the bass, I suggest that you pull up a chair and start right here. Then, read more generally here. The basses you mentioned span a one-octave price range. I suggest that you decide on a budget and then look for the best instrument you can get for the money. Keep in mind that a good setup is of paramount importance! Buy from a real bass shop. I think your current approach to buying a DB will not serve you well. Then again, you were wise enough to ask the folks here. I specifically suggest that you not simply examine the three basses you've listed and then buy the one you like best. After you read the threads linked to above, c'mon back and ask questions. :)
 
A thing to remember with double basses is that there can be a tremendous amount of difference between instruments, even with two basses of the same make and model. So it is difficult for folks here to comment on the sound of the basses you mention, other than very generally, considering they have never heard those same instruments. If you have heard them, you are already a better authority on that subject.
 
Many great advices so far, thanks! I'm aware about the differences from one instrument to another, so I understand no one can really say 'get this one'. I just wanted to know if I should avoid any of those bass I listed in my OP. I'm used to high end electric basses and I'm perfectly aware of differences between each pieces of wood, and sometimes the price doesn't mean anything at all. I'll pick by ear, but also by feeling, as I always do with all my gear.

drurb: I appreciate your PM suggesting Upton Bass, and for the 2 links in your post, I'll definitely take time to read these, thanks. However, I don't get why you say that my 'current approach (what approach?) won't serve me well' when I come here and hands down and in the very first place state that I'm a perfect newbie in terms of DB? Clients who asked me to play DB are used to DB with other players, but they prefer my overall approach and attitude. They know me as an electric bass player, and I want to serve them as well with a DB than I did with an EB in the past. That's why I ask the pros here for advices before I spend $4k on a DB. Regarding the techniques and injuries, you got it right. I'm planing to learn slowly and take my time and a few lessons like I said, but this is my job and I need to get to my goals. Or I drop it all.
 
Don't forget, you can most likely get any of the basses looked over by the top luthier you mention (or another) for their opinion. If you like the sound of the Christopher best, for instance, the setup can always be tweaked to your liking.

You probably already know this, but Eastman and Christopher are regarded as decent quality Chinese instruments, AFAIK.
 
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...However, I don't get why you say that my 'current approach (what approach?) won't serve me well' when I come here and hands down and in the very first place state that I'm a perfect newbie in terms of DB?

The "current approach" to which I referred was restricted to the purchase of a DB. I wasn't referring to your approach to playing. Sorry if that wasn't clear. Specifically, I was referring to finding DB contenders and asking about them and potentially giving the limited set serious consideration. I was suggesting a much broader approach and I outlined what it would be. I did qualify my own comment and specifically recognized that you were asking for advice:
...I think your current approach to buying a DB will not serve you well. Then again, you were wise enough to ask the folks here.
 
Do you guys recommend a flat fingerboard under the E string?
I think you're referring to what's called the Romberg bevel. Here's an informative thread. A search will lead you to others. Nothing wrong with it but it's fair to say that it's not all that common these days. Oh, glad you liked the video! You can search youtube for the non-PG version. :D
 
"Now about the bass, I want to buy new..."

Why? In your place, I'd get the least expensive thing I could find that wasn't junk because you simply cannot know what you'll like and dislike six months or a year from now.

-S-
 
Cause I like new gear. I'm like that. And I like to keep my gear as new.

I bought the Christopher DB303. So far I'm happy! I'm about to order a pickup (tough choice) and a new set of string to have another flavour. Stock on the bass is a set of D'Addario Helicore Hybrid. I plan to buy a set of Obligato.

When I'm done with that bass and want an upgrade, I'll just sell it (will be in as new or so condition) and I won't loose that much $, I'm sure about that!

Thanks to all for your help!
 
Cause I like new gear. I'm like that. And I like to keep my gear as new.

I bought the Christopher DB303. So far I'm happy! I'm about to order a pickup (tough choice) and a new set of string to have another flavour. Stock on the bass is a set of D'Addario Helicore Hybrid. I plan to buy a set of Obligato.

When I'm done with that bass and want an upgrade, I'll just sell it (will be in as new or so condition) and I won't loose that much $, I'm sure about that!

Thanks to all for your help!
Feel free to contact me if you'd like to try out another set of our strings. Thanks, and good luck with your new DB venture! [email protected]
 
"Now about the bass, I want to buy new..."

Why? In your place, I'd get the least expensive thing I could find that wasn't junk because you simply cannot know what you'll like and dislike six months or a year from now.

-S-
The least expensive bass may not be a "healthy" bass, and may require extensive setup to be playable. When I decided to get a double bass, I did purposely purchase a CCDBSO (that is, Cheap Chinese Double Bass Shaped Object, CCB for short) because I wanted to do exactly that: learn how it is set up. It came with baling wire at least 10 cm off the fingerboard, which thankfully was a slab of ebony, rough hewn. It was not a Palatino, but it was only about a half-step up from there, with a paint job to simulate fake wood grain even worse than the Fender Foto Flame! Here is what I had to do to get it playable:
1) shave, recontour and refinish (with tung oil - I just like how it feels) the neck at the nut down to 1 3/4 inch width, (it was over two inches - now, we all want thick necks for stability, but this was just too much) retaining as much as possible;
2) bandsawing a proper contour to the bridge (I had to take off almost 1/4 inch) and recontour the flat sides to the proper bevel on my belt sander;
3) trimming and resetting the soundpost
4) new ebony tailpiece and cable to replace the anodized aluminum one, and learning how to set the afterlength to even out resonance and avoid the wolves.
5) contouring the fingerboard - fortunately, it had a fairly good slight scoop already. I clamped each string to the board under reduced tension and shined a light behind it to highlight the "gap" and know where and exactly how much to sand down in any particular flat spot. It took hours, and I think there is still a fine coating of ebony dust all over the work area, all these years later;
6) hacksawed off the excess peg length that extended so far up into the body that, well, watch Drurb's video;
7) strings, strings, strings, until I finally realized, as we all eventually do, that everything goes with a Dead Spiro E;
8) Fishman Full Circle and an fDeck Series 2 preamp, after trying some lesser and inferior piezo pickups;
9) because my pinky is so short and curved in, and my index finger is slightly short and slightly curved in, installed a false nut to shorten the mensure so I can span the F to f in 1/2 position.
10) purchase of a proper bow, in case my right hand stops cramping and I actually can arco some day (I spent hours with a friend who teaches double bass, tried both French and German, and nothing is working right now. I don't have time to play in community orchestra, anyway, with my other gigs, so it rests peacefully if and until then)

I've probably done more over time; that's all I can think of right now. The cheap gig bag is starting to unravel at the bottom of the zipper; I'll need a new gig bag eventually. I may still upgrade the tuners, but the thought of spending another couple hundred bucks and a other couple of hours on it is not appealing to me, even though one tuner post desperately needs to be re-drilled and re-chamfered because it is in the wrong place to mount the string properly. The bass still has a resonant peak on the open D string; I just keep a brown washcloth shoved in the off-side soundhole to damp the resonance and as a feedback controller when amplified.

OK, so far, initial purchase was, with the stand (hey, Drurb!) $750. I already had the larger woodworking tools, but add in purchasing the smaller ones, like the model plane and blades to shave the neck, factor in the time, and upgrades, and injuries (yes, there is one cross-grained spot in the neck that the blade caught, slipped, and took off a chunk of thumb skin - not good for a guy who takes rat poison daily) and I easily have @$2K in it, just to be playable. And that does not count getting a new bass amp that can be used for both DB & EB, which I needed anyway because my old one was over twenty years old and the capacitors on the board are starting to get hissy. Then there is the Simandl book and at least some time with a proper teacher to learn good habits and break old EB habits, and the rest of your life learning something new every day.

That's why you don't just go out and get the cheapest bass to start on.

The whole point of this digression: To get a proper bass, unless you want to dive into it piecemeal to learn how it works and how to set it up as you go along, (which I did because I am at least 200 miles from the nearest double bass luthier shop), plan on at least a $2K budget, new or used.
 
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Thanks for that, iiipopes. Let it stand as another first-hand, experience-based account and explanation for why the budget you cite is so often recommended here.