• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Five string single cut - oak content

Jisch

Jisch

Jun 1, 2005
5,933
13,206
Connecticut (Northeast USA)
#1
In one of the threads here there was a discussion about using oak in instruments. In fact I've seen it discussed a few times in various places. I am not 100% sure about whether this will go forward, but I'm going to try doing a few things to prove it out.

First a google search came up with this beauty. I think I'm going to adapt this shape a bit. I'm not sold on those pointy bits coming out, but I like the general body shape and especially the carving. I also like the full length fingerboard, string terminations and bridge.
duoyjbmme2qakrhit40i.jpg

I looked through my parts bin and for some reason I have only four string pickups. I've got a bid in on some used five string Nordstrands, hopefully I'll get those. I would probably make a wooden oval shaped cover, like the Delano here. I was close to buying a Delano, it's still in play if this Reverb purchase doesn't work out.

I went through the oak in my attic, honestly I got a bit overwhelmed and just kind of grabbed a piece to start with. I may not use this piece, I've got nothing but time to decide.

After taking this pic I decided that they weren't similar enough, so I cut a consecutive piece so it has very similar flecks as the upper bout. I didn't take a pic, but that's what I glued up.

I got a new computer for the studio and it needs to be on a stand, so I'm combining the stand building with this build. The stand is really just some 2x4s side by side and I figured I'd put a piece of oak on top.

That bass I dropped in up top is made with "bog oak" it's been ebonized by sitting at the bottom of a bog for 2100 years (if the post can be believed). I may look to ebonize this oak, but instead, I'm trying to dye it. My first test piece will be the oak that is the top of this stand. I soaked as much dye in as I could. It's drying now.

I added a small amount of black dye powder to some Varathane and I'll put that on top of this piece of wood. Regardless of what it looks like it will go on the computer stand, but it's a test case for this.

I think the body will be two pieces of light wood, no wood on back. I'm not sure what kind of wood that will be yet - maybe ash or maple. Only the top will be dyed - which brings up questions about how the dyed Varathane might look over that wood, I guess.

So this post is more theories and questions than actual build, we'll see where this goes.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: lucas303, JACink, Freekmagnet and 10 others
#2
I've got the next few days off work, so I'll be messing around on this.

The dyed Varathane looks like a blackish purple in the jar, it looks the same when it's wet. When I put the first coat on, I thought this is a wasted experiment, but I'll have a cool Prince tribute in the form of a computer stand. Of course once it dries it darkens up and loses the blue/purplish tint. I did two coats of tinted Varathane over the wood that was dyed directly and at this point it's as black as it can be, you can still see grain, but any chatoyance is pretty hard to see beneath the dye in Varathane, this didn't deepen the figuring, it obliterated it.

I added two more coats of clear Varathane over top just for fun. The second coat is drying now.
20190627_152717.jpg

That might not be a bad look, but it's more or less like painting it black. I'll see what I think after it dries. I think the magic might be dye the wood, then one coat of dyed Varathane, then clear after that. The figuring wouldn't be quite as hidden. Before I added the dyed Varathane there were thin strips, they looked like sewing thread, that wouldn't take any dye, the Varathane covered those, so I think that's where I want to be.

The bottom of the stand is 2x4s that weren't dyed, they just got a coating of dyed Varathane. That has a very different look where some parts of the wood didn't absorb at all.
20190627_152736.jpg

So I figured I'd try putting just dyed Varathane on another scrap to see what happens.
20190627_152721.jpg

I should have sanded this with finer grit (the other piece was sanded to 400) before applying the Varathane, you can see the purplish hue here while it's wet. I'll see what this looks like when it's dry, but it doesn't look great right now. I don't see that enhancing anything.

The other thing I didn't try was sanding the dye back, that might work out well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Matt Liebenau and Beej
#3
I might have rushed this a little bit, but I polished up the top, going from 500 through 4000 Abralon pads before switching to anti-swirl. It's impossible to take a picture of it, but it looks REALLY good. You can see the figuring slightly under the finish. I'm pretty excited this will work!
20190627_161603.jpg

You can kind of see the figuring in this one taken with a flash, and there is some variation in the color, although the color doesn't look wine colored like it does in this pic, it's more like variations on black.
20190627_161612.jpg

To be clear I'm not trying to replicate the color of ebonizing, but I want to create a finish that's black but with some variation. Now I've got to figure out the back wood and how I'm going to treat (or not treat) that. That's for tomorrow though, it's a beautiful night and some friends and I are getting together for a bike ride.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wraub, BishopJP, Beej and 2 others
#5
That does look good. I wonder what it would look like to mix in a little dark brown with the black to give it some depth of color as well.

I love the body shape and that photo in your first post. Personally speaking, I've never really "got" the singlecut body shape, but this shape speaks to me. I do like the pointy bits, I think they help convey the message of "this is a bass" since they echo the pointy bits on an upright.

What about woods for the rest of the instrument? I feel like it needs a flame maple neck to continue the "this looks like an upright" theme...
 
#6
Funny another friend said the exact same thing about the points. Maybe I'll keep them. I will probably make the body out of ash. I was originally thinking of only dyeing the front, but I think I'm going to dye the whole body. The neck will be maple, I think I have some flamed maple that will work. I haven't decided on the fretboard, I guess based on the theme it should be ebony, but honestly I'm not going to buy that much ebony for this, it would be way too expensive. I have to think on that. I have to decide on fretless vs fretted, my inclination is fretless, but I have a lot of fretless basses and I need to work on my fretting skills, this is probably not the bass for frets.
 
#7
I hate to admit how long it took me to get the body blank flat and square, but they are there now. I started with a very warped piece of ash. I should have just started planing it with the router, but I thought I had a better idea, I didn't. Anyway, planed and ready to go. The treble side is upside down in this pic.
20190628_114821.jpg

I had originally drawn this for a four string at 34", when I widened out the neck and added an inch to the scale it looked weird, so I cut off some of the back end, it looks much better. It's so easy to cut paper.
20190628_100625.jpg


I sanded back the piece of wood that was coated in dyed Varathane and added two coats of clear Varathane to it. It actually looks pretty good, but I think I'll stick with the darker version - on this you can see a lot more of the grain and figure/flakes. It kind of looks like ghosts are trying to break through from the back or something.
20190628_114835.jpg

After fighting with that ash, I think I'm done in the shop for the day, but I might get in there a bit this afternoon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Matt Liebenau
#8
A nice finish, especially for figured wood, is to stain dark black, then sand back so just the deep grain is still black. Then stain dark translucent brown and seal, or spray a translucent layer of brown lacquer/poly/shellac.
 
#10
Yeah, I have more options to try. I don't know why it bothers me, but the dye doesn't stick to these fibers in the wood and I hate the way they look. The dyed Varathane does stick to it, so I'm going to have to do some kind of tinting on the clear. Also this wood doesn't have a lot of figuring, so there's not a lot to enhance. I just want to be able to see the grain after the finish is on.
 
#14
Jisch said:
This isn't blotchy, so much as thin lines that don't accept the dye at all. Perhaps if I treated the wood, it would accept it, but the dyed Varathane covers it as well.
Click to expand...

I may have missed it, but how high (grit) are you sanding? Sometimes you can go too far and the wood gets burnished and won’t accept color.
 
#19
You might want to try the iron acetate (vinegar + steel wool) treatment with oak. I've had good results with soaking the wood first with black tea and then applying. But oak can be tricky and turn odd colors, so as usual, test piece is your friend.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jisch

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back